RFL grant Bradford Bulls points appeal

Bulls players celebrate a try during Friday night’s defeat to Salford, a result that leaves them desperate to win back the points taken away for entering administration

Bulls players celebrate a try during Friday night’s defeat to Salford, a result that leaves them desperate to win back the points taken away for entering administration

First published in Sport Bradford Telegraph and Argus: Photograph of the Author by , Bradford Bulls Reporter

The Bulls’ bid to claw back points has taken a significant step forward after the Rugby Football League granted them an unprecedented appeal against the penalty.

OK Bulls Ltd, the club’s former holding company, was placed into administration on January 31, leading the RFL to impose the standard six-point punishment on Francis Cummins’ side.

The penalty, handed out on February 25, dealt a massive blow to the Bulls’ survival hopes in a season in which the bottom two teams in Super League will be relegated.

Friday’s home defeat at the hands of Salford Red Devils left Cummins’ side on minus two points and six points from safety with almost a third of the season gone.

But the Bulls say they have been granted a right of appeal by the RFL and that an independent panel will now hear their case.

It is not clear when the hearing will be held but the club said in a statement: “Bradford Bulls can today announce their right of appeal against the points deduction has been granted by the sport’s governing body.

“The notice of intention to appeal was lodged with the Rugby Football League, by former administrator David Wilson, however the appeal could not proceed until the ownership of the club was resolved.

“Following consultation with legal representatives, the new board have confirmed their intention to proceed with the appeal process and are now awaiting a hearing date.

“Bradford Bulls will be making no further comment on the matter at this time.”

Blake Solly, the RFL’s director of licensing and standards, told the Telegraph & Argus last month that the Bulls had a right to appeal their points penalty as and when new owners were in position.

Marc Green completed his takeover of the club on March 26 and recently confirmed the Bulls were considering appealing their six-point deduction.

Whether or not they are successful in winning back any points could be determined by how much they are willing to pay off creditors.

Previously Wakefield and Crusaders were docked four points when they entered administration after the RFL took into account the new owners’ willingness to pay off some of the debts to creditors.

Solly said on March 10: “There is an appeal process whereby a sporting sanctions appeal panel is set up by the RFL and that includes one of our independent tribunal chairmen and an insolvency practitioner.

“They would hear the case put forward by the club and make a decision on any appeal.

“Amongst other things, they would assess whether the administration was avoidable.”

* Bulls legend Lesley Vainikolo will make a special guest appearance at the Provident Stadium for the visit of arch-rivals Leeds Rhinos on Thursday.

Comments (49)

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8:14am Mon 14 Apr 14

raisemeup says...

Brilliant hope it is successful,. This will give us some hope COYB
Brilliant hope it is successful,. This will give us some hope COYB raisemeup
  • Score: 10

8:21am Mon 14 Apr 14

bully4us says...

The report from the administrator stated hardly anyone would be paid anything. I am glad they are appealing but I doubt we will get anything back. The best result would be two points so we are the same as Wakey got - but they paid some money to creditors. We owed £1.25m. How much are two points worth to us if we had to write a check before we get 2 points back?
The report from the administrator stated hardly anyone would be paid anything. I am glad they are appealing but I doubt we will get anything back. The best result would be two points so we are the same as Wakey got - but they paid some money to creditors. We owed £1.25m. How much are two points worth to us if we had to write a check before we get 2 points back? bully4us
  • Score: 8

11:10am Mon 14 Apr 14

mines a pint says...

bully4us wrote:
The report from the administrator stated hardly anyone would be paid anything. I am glad they are appealing but I doubt we will get anything back. The best result would be two points so we are the same as Wakey got - but they paid some money to creditors. We owed £1.25m. How much are two points worth to us if we had to write a check before we get 2 points back?
Dont forget Marc Greens business was one of the largest creditors & all the talk was he bought the Bulls to safeguard his loan.

Will it now be viewed as this creditor being paid?

How will the panel decide on how creditors have been paid if it is a simple percentage of the money owed when entering administration then Marc Greens loan would be a sizeable percentage also a number of the creditors at the time of administration would have been existing suppliers who would already have set payment terms (most large businesses pay invoices between 30 - 60 days from when they were submitted) If we are still trading with these creditors presumably they will have been paid by the administrator when the invoice fell due?

Ultimately though if the rest of super league have any input into the decision we can forget any points being reinstated, with relegation due at the end of the season I for one do not expect to see any turkeys voting for Christmas!
[quote][p][bold]bully4us[/bold] wrote: The report from the administrator stated hardly anyone would be paid anything. I am glad they are appealing but I doubt we will get anything back. The best result would be two points so we are the same as Wakey got - but they paid some money to creditors. We owed £1.25m. How much are two points worth to us if we had to write a check before we get 2 points back?[/p][/quote]Dont forget Marc Greens business was one of the largest creditors & all the talk was he bought the Bulls to safeguard his loan. Will it now be viewed as this creditor being paid? How will the panel decide on how creditors have been paid if it is a simple percentage of the money owed when entering administration then Marc Greens loan would be a sizeable percentage also a number of the creditors at the time of administration would have been existing suppliers who would already have set payment terms (most large businesses pay invoices between 30 - 60 days from when they were submitted) If we are still trading with these creditors presumably they will have been paid by the administrator when the invoice fell due? Ultimately though if the rest of super league have any input into the decision we can forget any points being reinstated, with relegation due at the end of the season I for one do not expect to see any turkeys voting for Christmas! mines a pint
  • Score: 2

11:25am Mon 14 Apr 14

poppastratton says...

It is very encouraging news however I'm not too optimistic. Whatever the rights and wrongs of our demise it does seem that the knives are out with regard to the RFL and other Super League clubs. Is there an underlying reason as to why we are unwelcome in Super League nowadays or am I just being slightly cynical and paranoid?
It is very encouraging news however I'm not too optimistic. Whatever the rights and wrongs of our demise it does seem that the knives are out with regard to the RFL and other Super League clubs. Is there an underlying reason as to why we are unwelcome in Super League nowadays or am I just being slightly cynical and paranoid? poppastratton
  • Score: 14

11:34am Mon 14 Apr 14

Wobblyhead says...

poppastratton wrote:
It is very encouraging news however I'm not too optimistic. Whatever the rights and wrongs of our demise it does seem that the knives are out with regard to the RFL and other Super League clubs. Is there an underlying reason as to why we are unwelcome in Super League nowadays or am I just being slightly cynical and paranoid?
You're being slightly cynical and paranoid.
[quote][p][bold]poppastratton[/bold] wrote: It is very encouraging news however I'm not too optimistic. Whatever the rights and wrongs of our demise it does seem that the knives are out with regard to the RFL and other Super League clubs. Is there an underlying reason as to why we are unwelcome in Super League nowadays or am I just being slightly cynical and paranoid?[/p][/quote]You're being slightly cynical and paranoid. Wobblyhead
  • Score: -4

11:36am Mon 14 Apr 14

Claytonbull says...

Hope this is good news however by the time this all gets rectified I think we will be to far behind for it to make any difference. There is no way the RFL are going to allow London and dragons to go down so I think it will be London and the bulls that get relegated with the new Cumbrian team coming on board in the next few years . I think we will be given 2 points back then the RFL can say we've received the same treatment as everyone else.
Hope this is good news however by the time this all gets rectified I think we will be to far behind for it to make any difference. There is no way the RFL are going to allow London and dragons to go down so I think it will be London and the bulls that get relegated with the new Cumbrian team coming on board in the next few years . I think we will be given 2 points back then the RFL can say we've received the same treatment as everyone else. Claytonbull
  • Score: -4

11:59am Mon 14 Apr 14

Thee Voice of Reason says...

Strange how an appeal have been given at a time when Bulls play all of the Super Leagues elite back to back.

Come the end of this run they could happily hand points back knowing full well that Bulls are all but relegated.

As it stands Bulls have to gain 6 more points than Catalan and Wakefield before the end of the season. Way the run of games is lined up they could well be half way through the season and still not have six points (even when you add back the deduction) so the task it massive.

A false hope, prolonging the enevitable?

I'm still annoyed that those who created this fiasco are currently walking round without a care in the world and have been left alone by the press. Why aren't the press all over Khan, Sutcliffe and Whitcut asking some serious questions of them?
Strange how an appeal have been given at a time when Bulls play all of the Super Leagues elite back to back. Come the end of this run they could happily hand points back knowing full well that Bulls are all but relegated. As it stands Bulls have to gain 6 more points than Catalan and Wakefield before the end of the season. Way the run of games is lined up they could well be half way through the season and still not have six points (even when you add back the deduction) so the task it massive. A false hope, prolonging the enevitable? I'm still annoyed that those who created this fiasco are currently walking round without a care in the world and have been left alone by the press. Why aren't the press all over Khan, Sutcliffe and Whitcut asking some serious questions of them? Thee Voice of Reason
  • Score: 23

12:18pm Mon 14 Apr 14

BradfordSportsFan says...

With reference to a different part of the story, I wish Big Les was making a special guest appearance on the left wing for the Rhino's game! Can only imagine having a player like that amongst our ranks again anytime soon!!
With reference to a different part of the story, I wish Big Les was making a special guest appearance on the left wing for the Rhino's game! Can only imagine having a player like that amongst our ranks again anytime soon!! BradfordSportsFan
  • Score: 7

12:20pm Mon 14 Apr 14

blue marlin says...

Thee Voice of Reason wrote:
Strange how an appeal have been given at a time when Bulls play all of the Super Leagues elite back to back. Come the end of this run they could happily hand points back knowing full well that Bulls are all but relegated. As it stands Bulls have to gain 6 more points than Catalan and Wakefield before the end of the season. Way the run of games is lined up they could well be half way through the season and still not have six points (even when you add back the deduction) so the task it massive. A false hope, prolonging the enevitable? I'm still annoyed that those who created this fiasco are currently walking round without a care in the world and have been left alone by the press. Why aren't the press all over Khan, Sutcliffe and Whitcut asking some serious questions of them?
I know its old hat to most people but got to agree, somebody should be asking questions
Find it strange that if the bulls get the points back, the only people who lose out are the small supliers etc and the people who created the mess walk away as TVOR says.
[quote][p][bold]Thee Voice of Reason[/bold] wrote: Strange how an appeal have been given at a time when Bulls play all of the Super Leagues elite back to back. Come the end of this run they could happily hand points back knowing full well that Bulls are all but relegated. As it stands Bulls have to gain 6 more points than Catalan and Wakefield before the end of the season. Way the run of games is lined up they could well be half way through the season and still not have six points (even when you add back the deduction) so the task it massive. A false hope, prolonging the enevitable? I'm still annoyed that those who created this fiasco are currently walking round without a care in the world and have been left alone by the press. Why aren't the press all over Khan, Sutcliffe and Whitcut asking some serious questions of them?[/p][/quote]I know its old hat to most people but got to agree, somebody should be asking questions Find it strange that if the bulls get the points back, the only people who lose out are the small supliers etc and the people who created the mess walk away as TVOR says. blue marlin
  • Score: 8

12:24pm Mon 14 Apr 14

Bowlingboy says...

Think they would be better spending their time and efforts
on finding a better coaching team and some players,
At least you are in charge of your destiny that way...
They were Sh£t on Friday a waster of £20.

Marc green and the new owners need to put their money where their mouth is.
Or its the championship and gates of less than 6k next year.
Think they would be better spending their time and efforts on finding a better coaching team and some players, At least you are in charge of your destiny that way... They were Sh£t on Friday a waster of £20. Marc green and the new owners need to put their money where their mouth is. Or its the championship and gates of less than 6k next year. Bowlingboy
  • Score: 10

12:42pm Mon 14 Apr 14

Loadofbull70 says...

I totally agree with TVOR why have these 3 got away with it ? Khan tried making a quick buck helped on by Sutcliife who used his power to gain council funds the Whitcut used as an escape goat folling the usual trend in most of Khan`s business failures.

Also have to agree with Bowling boy Franny has to step up now massive credit to him for what he has done while we were in admin but he has to move forward now we need some quality & we need to change our playing style or we will be lucky to pick up another 2 points this season.

Friday nights game did Franny no favours at all he needs to take control of the players fast. Dont agree with calls to replace him but he needs a strong number two.
I totally agree with TVOR why have these 3 got away with it ? Khan tried making a quick buck helped on by Sutcliife who used his power to gain council funds the Whitcut used as an escape goat folling the usual trend in most of Khan`s business failures. Also have to agree with Bowling boy Franny has to step up now massive credit to him for what he has done while we were in admin but he has to move forward now we need some quality & we need to change our playing style or we will be lucky to pick up another 2 points this season. Friday nights game did Franny no favours at all he needs to take control of the players fast. Dont agree with calls to replace him but he needs a strong number two. Loadofbull70
  • Score: 9

12:45pm Mon 14 Apr 14

bartsbull says...

So we may or may not get our points back it is a long season not all clubs are playing well two at the mot are at the top there game so there is still a very good chance

We need to play well and sort our defence out that is where we are letting in to
many soft tries
Rearding Wakey being docked point Mr Glover who took over the club at the time did state that he would pay the creditors or some of them so they only received a small points deduction

Why then when the other two directors took over the club from Mr Glover they found that x amount of money needed to be found to pay people so players were once again sold everyone keeps having a dig at the Bulls for being in trouble but i bet they are not th only ones
So we may or may not get our points back it is a long season not all clubs are playing well two at the mot are at the top there game so there is still a very good chance We need to play well and sort our defence out that is where we are letting in to many soft tries Rearding Wakey being docked point Mr Glover who took over the club at the time did state that he would pay the creditors or some of them so they only received a small points deduction Why then when the other two directors took over the club from Mr Glover they found that x amount of money needed to be found to pay people so players were once again sold everyone keeps having a dig at the Bulls for being in trouble but i bet they are not th only ones bartsbull
  • Score: 5

12:50pm Mon 14 Apr 14

mrrl says...

I am sure the other clubs will look at this decision from the RL with great interest. The fact of the matter is if you are looking to go into administration but have a back up plan to minimise either a points deduction or raise a successful appeal and the creditors get their dues back then everyone is happy. So why not get points back if the debts are paid. Its those who basically cant pay wont pay who should be penalised. So this time we might get the truth and realise the predicament we are in.
I am sure the other clubs will look at this decision from the RL with great interest. The fact of the matter is if you are looking to go into administration but have a back up plan to minimise either a points deduction or raise a successful appeal and the creditors get their dues back then everyone is happy. So why not get points back if the debts are paid. Its those who basically cant pay wont pay who should be penalised. So this time we might get the truth and realise the predicament we are in. mrrl
  • Score: 5

3:18pm Mon 14 Apr 14

axelf1963 says...

Just take your punishment on the chin and get on with it.
Just take your punishment on the chin and get on with it. axelf1963
  • Score: -24

3:33pm Mon 14 Apr 14

BierleyBoy says...

Marc Green put OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture on the assets.

Ok Bulls is being liquidated meaning every other creditor can go & whistle for their money.

RFL Operational Rules have been followed with a points deduction being imposed after an.Insolvency event.

Had OK Bulls continued as the operating company & a proportion of the debts paid to creditors, then the penalty would have been less severe.

There is no difference between Bradford Bulls Holdings Ltd & OK Bulls Ltd entering administration. Khan didn't take on any of the old company liabilities, neither has Green.

This is posturing from Green to try and win favour with fans. He has no passion for rugby league or Bradford Bulls, he's a hard nosed businessman hoping to kid enough that he's on their side for them to continue to part with money.

The points deduction will stand & Green will be able to say he tried. Creating a victim mentality works sometimes, but not even Bulls fans are stupid enough to fall for this...are they?
Marc Green put OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture on the assets. Ok Bulls is being liquidated meaning every other creditor can go & whistle for their money. RFL Operational Rules have been followed with a points deduction being imposed after an.Insolvency event. Had OK Bulls continued as the operating company & a proportion of the debts paid to creditors, then the penalty would have been less severe. There is no difference between Bradford Bulls Holdings Ltd & OK Bulls Ltd entering administration. Khan didn't take on any of the old company liabilities, neither has Green. This is posturing from Green to try and win favour with fans. He has no passion for rugby league or Bradford Bulls, he's a hard nosed businessman hoping to kid enough that he's on their side for them to continue to part with money. The points deduction will stand & Green will be able to say he tried. Creating a victim mentality works sometimes, but not even Bulls fans are stupid enough to fall for this...are they? BierleyBoy
  • Score: 2

3:46pm Mon 14 Apr 14

fedupwiththeBS says...

We will only get the points back if ALL the creditors have been paid and as Wilson has said that hardly any have or will be then this is just a paper exercise by the RFL to appear not to be the bad guys in all of this.

I know of at least one creditor that is sill owed £40K and has not even been contacted by the administrator.
We will only get the points back if ALL the creditors have been paid and as Wilson has said that hardly any have or will be then this is just a paper exercise by the RFL to appear not to be the bad guys in all of this. I know of at least one creditor that is sill owed £40K and has not even been contacted by the administrator. fedupwiththeBS
  • Score: 4

4:47pm Mon 14 Apr 14

spanglishbull.uk says...

Bierley Boy,
You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise.
Bierley Boy, You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise. spanglishbull.uk
  • Score: 2

5:46pm Mon 14 Apr 14

1964gc says...

BierleyBoy wrote:
Marc Green put OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture on the assets.

Ok Bulls is being liquidated meaning every other creditor can go & whistle for their money.

RFL Operational Rules have been followed with a points deduction being imposed after an.Insolvency event.

Had OK Bulls continued as the operating company & a proportion of the debts paid to creditors, then the penalty would have been less severe.

There is no difference between Bradford Bulls Holdings Ltd & OK Bulls Ltd entering administration. Khan didn't take on any of the old company liabilities, neither has Green.

This is posturing from Green to try and win favour with fans. He has no passion for rugby league or Bradford Bulls, he's a hard nosed businessman hoping to kid enough that he's on their side for them to continue to part with money.

The points deduction will stand & Green will be able to say he tried. Creating a victim mentality works sometimes, but not even Bulls fans are stupid enough to fall for this...are they?
He lent money to help initally,without this no doubt we d have sunk months ago,he could have said no ,after all it was nt exactly a secured loan knowing the state the bulls were in
[quote][p][bold]BierleyBoy[/bold] wrote: Marc Green put OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture on the assets. Ok Bulls is being liquidated meaning every other creditor can go & whistle for their money. RFL Operational Rules have been followed with a points deduction being imposed after an.Insolvency event. Had OK Bulls continued as the operating company & a proportion of the debts paid to creditors, then the penalty would have been less severe. There is no difference between Bradford Bulls Holdings Ltd & OK Bulls Ltd entering administration. Khan didn't take on any of the old company liabilities, neither has Green. This is posturing from Green to try and win favour with fans. He has no passion for rugby league or Bradford Bulls, he's a hard nosed businessman hoping to kid enough that he's on their side for them to continue to part with money. The points deduction will stand & Green will be able to say he tried. Creating a victim mentality works sometimes, but not even Bulls fans are stupid enough to fall for this...are they?[/p][/quote]He lent money to help initally,without this no doubt we d have sunk months ago,he could have said no ,after all it was nt exactly a secured loan knowing the state the bulls were in 1964gc
  • Score: 0

6:10pm Mon 14 Apr 14

oswald777 says...

Getting some points back from the RFL is the only way we will get any, that's for sure. Cummins will take us down.
Getting some points back from the RFL is the only way we will get any, that's for sure. Cummins will take us down. oswald777
  • Score: -1

6:15pm Mon 14 Apr 14

axelf1963 says...

I saw Viking on Friday at cue gardens and over heard him say that if bulls appeal they should be docked a further 2 points.
Thought this guy was a fan.
I saw Viking on Friday at cue gardens and over heard him say that if bulls appeal they should be docked a further 2 points. Thought this guy was a fan. axelf1963
  • Score: -7

6:19pm Mon 14 Apr 14

NG1972 says...

Bring back Nobby !!! I think Cummings is to loyal to his Leeds contingent & not to the Bulls hence his decision to play Walker at prop & have three props on the bench on Friday night. And just to note our defence once again was shocking how St Hilaire is still in job I will never know this is our problem below average players to go along side below average coaches.
Bring back Nobby !!! I think Cummings is to loyal to his Leeds contingent & not to the Bulls hence his decision to play Walker at prop & have three props on the bench on Friday night. And just to note our defence once again was shocking how St Hilaire is still in job I will never know this is our problem below average players to go along side below average coaches. NG1972
  • Score: 8

6:40pm Mon 14 Apr 14

spanglishbull.uk says...

Axelf,
Oh no you did not.
Axelf, Oh no you did not. spanglishbull.uk
  • Score: 4

7:00pm Mon 14 Apr 14

axelf1963 says...

Well its not pantomime season yet but Oh yes I did.
How would you know you are not even in this country super fan.
Well its not pantomime season yet but Oh yes I did. How would you know you are not even in this country super fan. axelf1963
  • Score: -3

7:24pm Mon 14 Apr 14

Alhaurinrhino says...

What I find funny is the fact that the T&A seem to think the shabby bulls are some kind of rivals to the Rhino's. In your dreams.
What I find funny is the fact that the T&A seem to think the shabby bulls are some kind of rivals to the Rhino's. In your dreams. Alhaurinrhino
  • Score: 1

7:25pm Mon 14 Apr 14

Bowlingboy says...

Thee Voice of Reason wrote:
Strange how an appeal have been given at a time when Bulls play all of the Super Leagues elite back to back.

Come the end of this run they could happily hand points back knowing full well that Bulls are all but relegated.

As it stands Bulls have to gain 6 more points than Catalan and Wakefield before the end of the season. Way the run of games is lined up they could well be half way through the season and still not have six points (even when you add back the deduction) so the task it massive.

A false hope, prolonging the enevitable?

I'm still annoyed that those who created this fiasco are currently walking round without a care in the world and have been left alone by the press. Why aren't the press all over Khan, Sutcliffe and Whitcut asking some serious questions of them?
Think its called embezzlement (fraud?
[quote][p][bold]Thee Voice of Reason[/bold] wrote: Strange how an appeal have been given at a time when Bulls play all of the Super Leagues elite back to back. Come the end of this run they could happily hand points back knowing full well that Bulls are all but relegated. As it stands Bulls have to gain 6 more points than Catalan and Wakefield before the end of the season. Way the run of games is lined up they could well be half way through the season and still not have six points (even when you add back the deduction) so the task it massive. A false hope, prolonging the enevitable? I'm still annoyed that those who created this fiasco are currently walking round without a care in the world and have been left alone by the press. Why aren't the press all over Khan, Sutcliffe and Whitcut asking some serious questions of them?[/p][/quote]Think its called embezzlement (fraud? Bowlingboy
  • Score: 4

7:52pm Mon 14 Apr 14

BierleyBoy says...

spanglishbull.uk wrote:
Bierley Boy,
You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise.
I know the actual facts of what has occurred.. Unlike many of those Bulls fans that are commenting.
[quote][p][bold]spanglishbull.uk[/bold] wrote: Bierley Boy, You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise.[/p][/quote]I know the actual facts of what has occurred.. Unlike many of those Bulls fans that are commenting. BierleyBoy
  • Score: 1

7:58pm Mon 14 Apr 14

BierleyBoy says...

1964gc wrote:
BierleyBoy wrote:
Marc Green put OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture on the assets.

Ok Bulls is being liquidated meaning every other creditor can go & whistle for their money.

RFL Operational Rules have been followed with a points deduction being imposed after an.Insolvency event.

Had OK Bulls continued as the operating company & a proportion of the debts paid to creditors, then the penalty would have been less severe.

There is no difference between Bradford Bulls Holdings Ltd & OK Bulls Ltd entering administration. Khan didn't take on any of the old company liabilities, neither has Green.

This is posturing from Green to try and win favour with fans. He has no passion for rugby league or Bradford Bulls, he's a hard nosed businessman hoping to kid enough that he's on their side for them to continue to part with money.

The points deduction will stand & Green will be able to say he tried. Creating a victim mentality works sometimes, but not even Bulls fans are stupid enough to fall for this...are they?
He lent money to help initally,without this no doubt we d have sunk months ago,he could have said no ,after all it was nt exactly a secured loan knowing the state the bulls were in
The loan he made to OK Bulls was repayable within 6 weeks and charged at 8% per month interest.

It was secured watertight in the form of a debenture on business assets which made him the sole preferred creditor.

Once it became clear OK Bulls could not pay the HMRC debt, Green placed OK Bulls into admin to protect his money.

He didn't set out to buy the club and now owns it by default.
[quote][p][bold]1964gc[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BierleyBoy[/bold] wrote: Marc Green put OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture on the assets. Ok Bulls is being liquidated meaning every other creditor can go & whistle for their money. RFL Operational Rules have been followed with a points deduction being imposed after an.Insolvency event. Had OK Bulls continued as the operating company & a proportion of the debts paid to creditors, then the penalty would have been less severe. There is no difference between Bradford Bulls Holdings Ltd & OK Bulls Ltd entering administration. Khan didn't take on any of the old company liabilities, neither has Green. This is posturing from Green to try and win favour with fans. He has no passion for rugby league or Bradford Bulls, he's a hard nosed businessman hoping to kid enough that he's on their side for them to continue to part with money. The points deduction will stand & Green will be able to say he tried. Creating a victim mentality works sometimes, but not even Bulls fans are stupid enough to fall for this...are they?[/p][/quote]He lent money to help initally,without this no doubt we d have sunk months ago,he could have said no ,after all it was nt exactly a secured loan knowing the state the bulls were in[/p][/quote]The loan he made to OK Bulls was repayable within 6 weeks and charged at 8% per month interest. It was secured watertight in the form of a debenture on business assets which made him the sole preferred creditor. Once it became clear OK Bulls could not pay the HMRC debt, Green placed OK Bulls into admin to protect his money. He didn't set out to buy the club and now owns it by default. BierleyBoy
  • Score: 1

8:02pm Mon 14 Apr 14

BierleyBoy says...

spanglishbull.uk wrote:
Bierley Boy,
You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise.
Who is AexF? I clearly know a great deal more than you do!!
[quote][p][bold]spanglishbull.uk[/bold] wrote: Bierley Boy, You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise.[/p][/quote]Who is AexF? I clearly know a great deal more than you do!! BierleyBoy
  • Score: -3

8:23pm Mon 14 Apr 14

portugalbull says...

BierleyBoy wrote:
spanglishbull.uk wrote:
Bierley Boy,
You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise.
I know the actual facts of what has occurred.. Unlike many of those Bulls fans that are commenting.
Defence is the main problem. How St Hilaire can be classed as defence coach with the results both last season and this is beyond me. If Fanny doesn't watch it he could lead to the demise of them both.
Fanny needs help from more experienced coach.
Now two ex bull coaches on the market, either one would do a good job.
[quote][p][bold]BierleyBoy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]spanglishbull.uk[/bold] wrote: Bierley Boy, You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise.[/p][/quote]I know the actual facts of what has occurred.. Unlike many of those Bulls fans that are commenting.[/p][/quote]Defence is the main problem. How St Hilaire can be classed as defence coach with the results both last season and this is beyond me. If Fanny doesn't watch it he could lead to the demise of them both. Fanny needs help from more experienced coach. Now two ex bull coaches on the market, either one would do a good job. portugalbull
  • Score: 4

8:26pm Mon 14 Apr 14

portugalbull says...

Sorry don't know how the quote got attached.
Sorry don't know how the quote got attached. portugalbull
  • Score: 1

8:46pm Mon 14 Apr 14

Sheffieldbull says...

This is what the points appeal is based on.

http://www.therfl.co
.uk/news/article/299
82/independent-panel
-to-hear-bradford

RFL -“Amongst other things, they would assess whether the administration was avoidable.”

The appeal has been lodged on the grounds that the insolvency event arose solely as a result of force majeure, in that the club’s administration occurred in circumstances that were unforeseeable and unavoidable.

And yes, to prevent repetition from some posters, we know there was a ‘Winding up’ order from HMRC- just to save you the bother!
This is what the points appeal is based on. http://www.therfl.co .uk/news/article/299 82/independent-panel -to-hear-bradford RFL -“Amongst other things, they would assess whether the administration was avoidable.” The appeal has been lodged on the grounds that the insolvency event arose solely as a result of force majeure, in that the club’s administration occurred in circumstances that were unforeseeable and unavoidable. And yes, to prevent repetition from some posters, we know there was a ‘Winding up’ order from HMRC- just to save you the bother! Sheffieldbull
  • Score: -2

8:53pm Mon 14 Apr 14

blue marlin says...

Being a simple soul can someone explain "if administration was avoidable" why didn't we avoid it?
Being a simple soul can someone explain "if administration was avoidable" why didn't we avoid it? blue marlin
  • Score: 3

9:52pm Mon 14 Apr 14

northern pig says...

All the previous posters are missing the point!!!! It did not matter when Wakey and Crusaders were deducted points, they could not be relegated.This season you can be .I do not believe the conspiracy theory either.Let us put it into perspective .We have been a 'selling club' for Years from the time of Ellery Hanley.We sold him to Wigan for 82k. Wigan had His best years and sold him to Leeds for 250k. He is not alone, Newlove,Fielding,Bur
gess,Whitehead etc. Forgive me for the ones i have missed. Funny how Leeds bring guys like Sinfield Maguire and Burrows and build a side round them and they are still there!! Get the picture.Bulls have been there and done it but have always lacked Money and vision,As Gary Hetherrington said, when he went to Leeds, they were close to bankruptcy.Let us hope we can replicate what they have achieved eventually.
All the previous posters are missing the point!!!! It did not matter when Wakey and Crusaders were deducted points, they could not be relegated.This season you can be .I do not believe the conspiracy theory either.Let us put it into perspective .We have been a 'selling club' for Years from the time of Ellery Hanley.We sold him to Wigan for 82k. Wigan had His best years and sold him to Leeds for 250k. He is not alone, Newlove,Fielding,Bur gess,Whitehead etc. Forgive me for the ones i have missed. Funny how Leeds bring guys like Sinfield Maguire and Burrows and build a side round them and they are still there!! Get the picture.Bulls have been there and done it but have always lacked Money and vision,As Gary Hetherrington said, when he went to Leeds, they were close to bankruptcy.Let us hope we can replicate what they have achieved eventually. northern pig
  • Score: 8

10:14pm Mon 14 Apr 14

1964gc says...

BierleyBoy wrote:
1964gc wrote:
BierleyBoy wrote:
Marc Green put OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture on the assets.

Ok Bulls is being liquidated meaning every other creditor can go & whistle for their money.

RFL Operational Rules have been followed with a points deduction being imposed after an.Insolvency event.

Had OK Bulls continued as the operating company & a proportion of the debts paid to creditors, then the penalty would have been less severe.

There is no difference between Bradford Bulls Holdings Ltd & OK Bulls Ltd entering administration. Khan didn't take on any of the old company liabilities, neither has Green.

This is posturing from Green to try and win favour with fans. He has no passion for rugby league or Bradford Bulls, he's a hard nosed businessman hoping to kid enough that he's on their side for them to continue to part with money.

The points deduction will stand & Green will be able to say he tried. Creating a victim mentality works sometimes, but not even Bulls fans are stupid enough to fall for this...are they?
He lent money to help initally,without this no doubt we d have sunk months ago,he could have said no ,after all it was nt exactly a secured loan knowing the state the bulls were in
The loan he made to OK Bulls was repayable within 6 weeks and charged at 8% per month interest.

It was secured watertight in the form of a debenture on business assets which made him the sole preferred creditor.

Once it became clear OK Bulls could not pay the HMRC debt, Green placed OK Bulls into admin to protect his money.

He didn't set out to buy the club and now owns it by default.
And if he did not lend the bulls money,what would have happened ??????

Not exactly a queue of cheque books waving at the time I remember
[quote][p][bold]BierleyBoy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]1964gc[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BierleyBoy[/bold] wrote: Marc Green put OK Bulls into administration to protect his debenture on the assets. Ok Bulls is being liquidated meaning every other creditor can go & whistle for their money. RFL Operational Rules have been followed with a points deduction being imposed after an.Insolvency event. Had OK Bulls continued as the operating company & a proportion of the debts paid to creditors, then the penalty would have been less severe. There is no difference between Bradford Bulls Holdings Ltd & OK Bulls Ltd entering administration. Khan didn't take on any of the old company liabilities, neither has Green. This is posturing from Green to try and win favour with fans. He has no passion for rugby league or Bradford Bulls, he's a hard nosed businessman hoping to kid enough that he's on their side for them to continue to part with money. The points deduction will stand & Green will be able to say he tried. Creating a victim mentality works sometimes, but not even Bulls fans are stupid enough to fall for this...are they?[/p][/quote]He lent money to help initally,without this no doubt we d have sunk months ago,he could have said no ,after all it was nt exactly a secured loan knowing the state the bulls were in[/p][/quote]The loan he made to OK Bulls was repayable within 6 weeks and charged at 8% per month interest. It was secured watertight in the form of a debenture on business assets which made him the sole preferred creditor. Once it became clear OK Bulls could not pay the HMRC debt, Green placed OK Bulls into admin to protect his money. He didn't set out to buy the club and now owns it by default.[/p][/quote]And if he did not lend the bulls money,what would have happened ?????? Not exactly a queue of cheque books waving at the time I remember 1964gc
  • Score: 2

4:51am Tue 15 Apr 14

Arhmen Noleg says...

Bowlingboy wrote:
Think they would be better spending their time and efforts
on finding a better coaching team and some players,
At least you are in charge of your destiny that way...
They were Sh£t on Friday a waster of £20.

Marc green and the new owners need to put their money where their mouth is.
Or its the championship and gates of less than 6k next year.
The crowd on Friday was 6100
[quote][p][bold]Bowlingboy[/bold] wrote: Think they would be better spending their time and efforts on finding a better coaching team and some players, At least you are in charge of your destiny that way... They were Sh£t on Friday a waster of £20. Marc green and the new owners need to put their money where their mouth is. Or its the championship and gates of less than 6k next year.[/p][/quote]The crowd on Friday was 6100 Arhmen Noleg
  • Score: 0

4:53am Tue 15 Apr 14

Arhmen Noleg says...

blue marlin wrote:
Being a simple soul can someone explain "if administration was avoidable" why didn't we avoid it?
Because there was no money left.Simple really.
[quote][p][bold]blue marlin[/bold] wrote: Being a simple soul can someone explain "if administration was avoidable" why didn't we avoid it?[/p][/quote]Because there was no money left.Simple really. Arhmen Noleg
  • Score: 0

8:04am Tue 15 Apr 14

raisemeup says...

If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........?
Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth?
For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars.
So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander
ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls.
Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse!
If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........? Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth? For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars. So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls. Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse! raisemeup
  • Score: -1

8:35am Tue 15 Apr 14

axelf1963 says...

Looks like Brian s wife is posting again. Make yourself useful love and get washing up done you know about as much as Brian. . . Nothing
Looks like Brian s wife is posting again. Make yourself useful love and get washing up done you know about as much as Brian. . . Nothing axelf1963
  • Score: -2

10:11am Tue 15 Apr 14

oswald777 says...

portugalbull wrote:
BierleyBoy wrote:
spanglishbull.uk wrote:
Bierley Boy,
You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise.
I know the actual facts of what has occurred.. Unlike many of those Bulls fans that are commenting.
Defence is the main problem. How St Hilaire can be classed as defence coach with the results both last season and this is beyond me. If Fanny doesn't watch it he could lead to the demise of them both.
Fanny needs help from more experienced coach.
Now two ex bull coaches on the market, either one would do a good job.
How he can be called a defence coach on this season and last seasons results ????? How about from the last 6 seasons results ??? I've been saying he should go since crapnamara was ruining the club !!!!
[quote][p][bold]portugalbull[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BierleyBoy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]spanglishbull.uk[/bold] wrote: Bierley Boy, You actually know Marc.Green very well then I assume by your posting.Even if you do I hardly believe he would tell you his private business.But,there again you and your alter ego Axelf.seem to know everything.There again maybe you two are Marc.Green in disguise.[/p][/quote]I know the actual facts of what has occurred.. Unlike many of those Bulls fans that are commenting.[/p][/quote]Defence is the main problem. How St Hilaire can be classed as defence coach with the results both last season and this is beyond me. If Fanny doesn't watch it he could lead to the demise of them both. Fanny needs help from more experienced coach. Now two ex bull coaches on the market, either one would do a good job.[/p][/quote]How he can be called a defence coach on this season and last seasons results ????? How about from the last 6 seasons results ??? I've been saying he should go since crapnamara was ruining the club !!!! oswald777
  • Score: 2

12:45pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Loyalbull1981 says...

Loadofbull70 wrote:
I totally agree with TVOR why have these 3 got away with it ? Khan tried making a quick buck helped on by Sutcliife who used his power to gain council funds the Whitcut used as an escape goat folling the usual trend in most of Khan`s business failures.

Also have to agree with Bowling boy Franny has to step up now massive credit to him for what he has done while we were in admin but he has to move forward now we need some quality & we need to change our playing style or we will be lucky to pick up another 2 points this season.

Friday nights game did Franny no favours at all he needs to take control of the players fast. Dont agree with calls to replace him but he needs a strong number two.
strong number two - scott naylors says he will jump at chance to work at odsal, hes mates with franny too. Just need to get rid of the dead wood aka st hilaire, der what frannys loyalty is to him, maybe its coz he gts paid peanuts why keephim, anyone any ideas. Mr Naylor has 4 year ssistant coaching experience and 2 years coaching oldham. I think he'd be great asset.
[quote][p][bold]Loadofbull70[/bold] wrote: I totally agree with TVOR why have these 3 got away with it ? Khan tried making a quick buck helped on by Sutcliife who used his power to gain council funds the Whitcut used as an escape goat folling the usual trend in most of Khan`s business failures. Also have to agree with Bowling boy Franny has to step up now massive credit to him for what he has done while we were in admin but he has to move forward now we need some quality & we need to change our playing style or we will be lucky to pick up another 2 points this season. Friday nights game did Franny no favours at all he needs to take control of the players fast. Dont agree with calls to replace him but he needs a strong number two.[/p][/quote]strong number two - scott naylors says he will jump at chance to work at odsal, hes mates with franny too. Just need to get rid of the dead wood aka st hilaire, der what frannys loyalty is to him, maybe its coz he gts paid peanuts why keephim, anyone any ideas. Mr Naylor has 4 year ssistant coaching experience and 2 years coaching oldham. I think he'd be great asset. Loyalbull1981
  • Score: 1

1:08pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Bowlingboy says...

Arhmen Noleg wrote:
Bowlingboy wrote:
Think they would be better spending their time and efforts
on finding a better coaching team and some players,
At least you are in charge of your destiny that way...
They were Sh£t on Friday a waster of £20.

Marc green and the new owners need to put their money where their mouth is.
Or its the championship and gates of less than 6k next year.
The crowd on Friday was 6100
still bab...
[quote][p][bold]Arhmen Noleg[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Bowlingboy[/bold] wrote: Think they would be better spending their time and efforts on finding a better coaching team and some players, At least you are in charge of your destiny that way... They were Sh£t on Friday a waster of £20. Marc green and the new owners need to put their money where their mouth is. Or its the championship and gates of less than 6k next year.[/p][/quote]The crowd on Friday was 6100[/p][/quote]still bab... Bowlingboy
  • Score: 3

2:48pm Tue 15 Apr 14

BierleyBoy says...

Sheffieldbull wrote:
This is what the points appeal is based on.

http://www.therfl.co

.uk/news/article/299

82/independent-panel

-to-hear-bradford

RFL -“Amongst other things, they would assess whether the administration was avoidable.”

The appeal has been lodged on the grounds that the insolvency event arose solely as a result of force majeure, in that the club’s administration occurred in circumstances that were unforeseeable and unavoidable.

And yes, to prevent repetition from some posters, we know there was a ‘Winding up’ order from HMRC- just to save you the bother!
Green was fully aware of the debt to HMRC prior to a winding up order being issued. The administration was entirely foreseeable and avoidable. Green chose not to avoid it in order to prevent his debenture depreciating..

He can't expect to eb the one who put the club into admin and not suffer the consequences, which were well established in precedent.
[quote][p][bold]Sheffieldbull[/bold] wrote: This is what the points appeal is based on. http://www.therfl.co .uk/news/article/299 82/independent-panel -to-hear-bradford RFL -“Amongst other things, they would assess whether the administration was avoidable.” The appeal has been lodged on the grounds that the insolvency event arose solely as a result of force majeure, in that the club’s administration occurred in circumstances that were unforeseeable and unavoidable. And yes, to prevent repetition from some posters, we know there was a ‘Winding up’ order from HMRC- just to save you the bother![/p][/quote]Green was fully aware of the debt to HMRC prior to a winding up order being issued. The administration was entirely foreseeable and avoidable. Green chose not to avoid it in order to prevent his debenture depreciating.. He can't expect to eb the one who put the club into admin and not suffer the consequences, which were well established in precedent. BierleyBoy
  • Score: 1

2:50pm Tue 15 Apr 14

BierleyBoy says...

northern pig wrote:
All the previous posters are missing the point!!!! It did not matter when Wakey and Crusaders were deducted points, they could not be relegated.This season you can be .I do not believe the conspiracy theory either.Let us put it into perspective .We have been a 'selling club' for Years from the time of Ellery Hanley.We sold him to Wigan for 82k. Wigan had His best years and sold him to Leeds for 250k. He is not alone, Newlove,Fielding,Bur

gess,Whitehead etc. Forgive me for the ones i have missed. Funny how Leeds bring guys like Sinfield Maguire and Burrows and build a side round them and they are still there!! Get the picture.Bulls have been there and done it but have always lacked Money and vision,As Gary Hetherrington said, when he went to Leeds, they were close to bankruptcy.Let us hope we can replicate what they have achieved eventually.
The fact that there is relegation this year is irrelevant. The Bulls didn't finish in the bottom two last season.
[quote][p][bold]northern pig[/bold] wrote: All the previous posters are missing the point!!!! It did not matter when Wakey and Crusaders were deducted points, they could not be relegated.This season you can be .I do not believe the conspiracy theory either.Let us put it into perspective .We have been a 'selling club' for Years from the time of Ellery Hanley.We sold him to Wigan for 82k. Wigan had His best years and sold him to Leeds for 250k. He is not alone, Newlove,Fielding,Bur gess,Whitehead etc. Forgive me for the ones i have missed. Funny how Leeds bring guys like Sinfield Maguire and Burrows and build a side round them and they are still there!! Get the picture.Bulls have been there and done it but have always lacked Money and vision,As Gary Hetherrington said, when he went to Leeds, they were close to bankruptcy.Let us hope we can replicate what they have achieved eventually.[/p][/quote]The fact that there is relegation this year is irrelevant. The Bulls didn't finish in the bottom two last season. BierleyBoy
  • Score: 1

3:54pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Arhmen Noleg says...

raisemeup wrote:
If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........?
Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth?
For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars.
So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander

ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls.
Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse!
So we all should just say nothing and take whats happened as if it was quite normal.
Thee is no glory in attempting to dissect discus and analyse the dreadfull events of the past three years.
Do you really think anyone is happy with the truth.
I see many genuine sports loving fans calling for an enquiry.

6000 at Odsal last Thursday.
Evidence in itself that people are heartily sick of the affair.

You come across a if you would defend Charles Manson or Peter Sutcliffe.
Legendary Status...come off it.
It pains us all to reveal things.
[quote][p][bold]raisemeup[/bold] wrote: If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........? Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth? For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars. So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls. Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse![/p][/quote]So we all should just say nothing and take whats happened as if it was quite normal. Thee is no glory in attempting to dissect discus and analyse the dreadfull events of the past three years. Do you really think anyone is happy with the truth. I see many genuine sports loving fans calling for an enquiry. 6000 at Odsal last Thursday. Evidence in itself that people are heartily sick of the affair. You come across a if you would defend Charles Manson or Peter Sutcliffe. Legendary Status...come off it. It pains us all to reveal things. Arhmen Noleg
  • Score: 0

5:23pm Tue 15 Apr 14

northern pig says...

BierleyBoy wrote:
northern pig wrote:
All the previous posters are missing the point!!!! It did not matter when Wakey and Crusaders were deducted points, they could not be relegated.This season you can be .I do not believe the conspiracy theory either.Let us put it into perspective .We have been a 'selling club' for Years from the time of Ellery Hanley.We sold him to Wigan for 82k. Wigan had His best years and sold him to Leeds for 250k. He is not alone, Newlove,Fielding,Bur


gess,Whitehead etc. Forgive me for the ones i have missed. Funny how Leeds bring guys like Sinfield Maguire and Burrows and build a side round them and they are still there!! Get the picture.Bulls have been there and done it but have always lacked Money and vision,As Gary Hetherrington said, when he went to Leeds, they were close to bankruptcy.Let us hope we can replicate what they have achieved eventually.
The fact that there is relegation this year is irrelevant. The Bulls didn't finish in the bottom two last season.
That is the salient point!!!!. It would not have mattered last year or every other year. if they had finished bottom .Superleague was on a franchise basis.THIS YEAR THE BOTTOM TWO CLUBS WILL BE RELEGATED.What are you trying to say?We are the first club to suffer relegation by the virtue of having points deducted,if we finish the season in the bottom two.
[quote][p][bold]BierleyBoy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]northern pig[/bold] wrote: All the previous posters are missing the point!!!! It did not matter when Wakey and Crusaders were deducted points, they could not be relegated.This season you can be .I do not believe the conspiracy theory either.Let us put it into perspective .We have been a 'selling club' for Years from the time of Ellery Hanley.We sold him to Wigan for 82k. Wigan had His best years and sold him to Leeds for 250k. He is not alone, Newlove,Fielding,Bur gess,Whitehead etc. Forgive me for the ones i have missed. Funny how Leeds bring guys like Sinfield Maguire and Burrows and build a side round them and they are still there!! Get the picture.Bulls have been there and done it but have always lacked Money and vision,As Gary Hetherrington said, when he went to Leeds, they were close to bankruptcy.Let us hope we can replicate what they have achieved eventually.[/p][/quote]The fact that there is relegation this year is irrelevant. The Bulls didn't finish in the bottom two last season.[/p][/quote]That is the salient point!!!!. It would not have mattered last year or every other year. if they had finished bottom .Superleague was on a franchise basis.THIS YEAR THE BOTTOM TWO CLUBS WILL BE RELEGATED.What are you trying to say?We are the first club to suffer relegation by the virtue of having points deducted,if we finish the season in the bottom two. northern pig
  • Score: 1

7:58pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Sheffieldbull says...

BierleyBoy wrote:
Sheffieldbull wrote:
This is what the points appeal is based on.

http://www.therfl.co


.uk/news/article/299


82/independent-panel


-to-hear-bradford

RFL -“Amongst other things, they would assess whether the administration was avoidable.”

The appeal has been lodged on the grounds that the insolvency event arose solely as a result of force majeure, in that the club’s administration occurred in circumstances that were unforeseeable and unavoidable.

And yes, to prevent repetition from some posters, we know there was a ‘Winding up’ order from HMRC- just to save you the bother!
Green was fully aware of the debt to HMRC prior to a winding up order being issued. The administration was entirely foreseeable and avoidable. Green chose not to avoid it in order to prevent his debenture depreciating..

He can't expect to eb the one who put the club into admin and not suffer the consequences, which were well established in precedent.
However knowledgeable you think you are, YOU will not decide the outcome. You do unfortunately have an even chance of being correct.
You will no doubt be the first to tell us if and when you are.
I told you all so, or words to that effect – hope that helps.
[quote][p][bold]BierleyBoy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Sheffieldbull[/bold] wrote: This is what the points appeal is based on. http://www.therfl.co .uk/news/article/299 82/independent-panel -to-hear-bradford RFL -“Amongst other things, they would assess whether the administration was avoidable.” The appeal has been lodged on the grounds that the insolvency event arose solely as a result of force majeure, in that the club’s administration occurred in circumstances that were unforeseeable and unavoidable. And yes, to prevent repetition from some posters, we know there was a ‘Winding up’ order from HMRC- just to save you the bother![/p][/quote]Green was fully aware of the debt to HMRC prior to a winding up order being issued. The administration was entirely foreseeable and avoidable. Green chose not to avoid it in order to prevent his debenture depreciating.. He can't expect to eb the one who put the club into admin and not suffer the consequences, which were well established in precedent.[/p][/quote]However knowledgeable you think you are, YOU will not decide the outcome. You do unfortunately have an even chance of being correct. You will no doubt be the first to tell us if and when you are. I told you all so, or words to that effect – hope that helps. Sheffieldbull
  • Score: 0

8:16pm Tue 15 Apr 14

raisemeup says...

Arhmen Noleg wrote:
raisemeup wrote:
If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........?
Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth?
For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars.
So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander


ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls.
Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse!
So we all should just say nothing and take whats happened as if it was quite normal.
Thee is no glory in attempting to dissect discus and analyse the dreadfull events of the past three years.
Do you really think anyone is happy with the truth.
I see many genuine sports loving fans calling for an enquiry.

6000 at Odsal last Thursday.
Evidence in itself that people are heartily sick of the affair.

You come across a if you would defend Charles Manson or Peter Sutcliffe.
Legendary Status...come off it.
It pains us all to reveal things.
If I thought that was the case, you would have my support! However as you and your other self " Noble and Honest" only concentrate on the negatives, plus you bandy about damaging and unsubstantiated stories that lack clarity and substance?
You believe what you want to, but the majority I suspect don't believe you or the others are champions of the justice you tell us all about.
I will not defend the indefensible just as I won't judge or pre judge anyone unless I have irrefutable proof that they have committed the wrongs people like yourself say they have.
When challenged you can never produce any real evidence of anything that wasn't known.

Carry on in your protestations by all means but don't expect much in the way of belief for most of what you spout ad nauseum.
[quote][p][bold]Arhmen Noleg[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]raisemeup[/bold] wrote: If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........? Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth? For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars. So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls. Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse![/p][/quote]So we all should just say nothing and take whats happened as if it was quite normal. Thee is no glory in attempting to dissect discus and analyse the dreadfull events of the past three years. Do you really think anyone is happy with the truth. I see many genuine sports loving fans calling for an enquiry. 6000 at Odsal last Thursday. Evidence in itself that people are heartily sick of the affair. You come across a if you would defend Charles Manson or Peter Sutcliffe. Legendary Status...come off it. It pains us all to reveal things.[/p][/quote]If I thought that was the case, you would have my support! However as you and your other self " Noble and Honest" only concentrate on the negatives, plus you bandy about damaging and unsubstantiated stories that lack clarity and substance? You believe what you want to, but the majority I suspect don't believe you or the others are champions of the justice you tell us all about. I will not defend the indefensible just as I won't judge or pre judge anyone unless I have irrefutable proof that they have committed the wrongs people like yourself say they have. When challenged you can never produce any real evidence of anything that wasn't known. Carry on in your protestations by all means but don't expect much in the way of belief for most of what you spout ad nauseum. raisemeup
  • Score: 1

11:55pm Tue 15 Apr 14

Arhmen Noleg says...

raisemeup wrote:
Arhmen Noleg wrote:
raisemeup wrote:
If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........?
Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth?
For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars.
So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander



ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls.
Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse!
So we all should just say nothing and take whats happened as if it was quite normal.
Thee is no glory in attempting to dissect discus and analyse the dreadfull events of the past three years.
Do you really think anyone is happy with the truth.
I see many genuine sports loving fans calling for an enquiry.

6000 at Odsal last Thursday.
Evidence in itself that people are heartily sick of the affair.

You come across a if you would defend Charles Manson or Peter Sutcliffe.
Legendary Status...come off it.
It pains us all to reveal things.
If I thought that was the case, you would have my support! However as you and your other self " Noble and Honest" only concentrate on the negatives, plus you bandy about damaging and unsubstantiated stories that lack clarity and substance?
You believe what you want to, but the majority I suspect don't believe you or the others are champions of the justice you tell us all about.
I will not defend the indefensible just as I won't judge or pre judge anyone unless I have irrefutable proof that they have committed the wrongs people like yourself say they have.
When challenged you can never produce any real evidence of anything that wasn't known.

Carry on in your protestations by all means but don't expect much in the way of belief for most of what you spout ad nauseum.
Where ARE the positives?
I suppose I could say 6000 die had fans.
Long Suffering.
Lied to consistently particularly over the past twelve months.
Many have pulled up evidence that dispels the lies to customers,creditors and fans.
Twice in 19 months for approaching 3 million debt that cannot be paid?
Your concluding line is priceless.
"what you spout ad nauseum"
Quid Pro Quo.

Nite Nite Brian.
Get off the sofa.
Good Boy.
Family Guy will never be the same when you retire
[quote][p][bold]raisemeup[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Arhmen Noleg[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]raisemeup[/bold] wrote: If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........? Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth? For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars. So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls. Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse![/p][/quote]So we all should just say nothing and take whats happened as if it was quite normal. Thee is no glory in attempting to dissect discus and analyse the dreadfull events of the past three years. Do you really think anyone is happy with the truth. I see many genuine sports loving fans calling for an enquiry. 6000 at Odsal last Thursday. Evidence in itself that people are heartily sick of the affair. You come across a if you would defend Charles Manson or Peter Sutcliffe. Legendary Status...come off it. It pains us all to reveal things.[/p][/quote]If I thought that was the case, you would have my support! However as you and your other self " Noble and Honest" only concentrate on the negatives, plus you bandy about damaging and unsubstantiated stories that lack clarity and substance? You believe what you want to, but the majority I suspect don't believe you or the others are champions of the justice you tell us all about. I will not defend the indefensible just as I won't judge or pre judge anyone unless I have irrefutable proof that they have committed the wrongs people like yourself say they have. When challenged you can never produce any real evidence of anything that wasn't known. Carry on in your protestations by all means but don't expect much in the way of belief for most of what you spout ad nauseum.[/p][/quote]Where ARE the positives? I suppose I could say 6000 die had fans. Long Suffering. Lied to consistently particularly over the past twelve months. Many have pulled up evidence that dispels the lies to customers,creditors and fans. Twice in 19 months for approaching 3 million debt that cannot be paid? Your concluding line is priceless. "what you spout ad nauseum" Quid Pro Quo. Nite Nite Brian. Get off the sofa. Good Boy. Family Guy will never be the same when you retire Arhmen Noleg
  • Score: 0

10:36am Wed 16 Apr 14

raisemeup says...

Arhmen Noleg wrote:
raisemeup wrote:
Arhmen Noleg wrote:
raisemeup wrote:
If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........?
Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth?
For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars.
So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander




ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls.
Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse!
So we all should just say nothing and take whats happened as if it was quite normal.
Thee is no glory in attempting to dissect discus and analyse the dreadfull events of the past three years.
Do you really think anyone is happy with the truth.
I see many genuine sports loving fans calling for an enquiry.

6000 at Odsal last Thursday.
Evidence in itself that people are heartily sick of the affair.

You come across a if you would defend Charles Manson or Peter Sutcliffe.
Legendary Status...come off it.
It pains us all to reveal things.
If I thought that was the case, you would have my support! However as you and your other self " Noble and Honest" only concentrate on the negatives, plus you bandy about damaging and unsubstantiated stories that lack clarity and substance?
You believe what you want to, but the majority I suspect don't believe you or the others are champions of the justice you tell us all about.
I will not defend the indefensible just as I won't judge or pre judge anyone unless I have irrefutable proof that they have committed the wrongs people like yourself say they have.
When challenged you can never produce any real evidence of anything that wasn't known.

Carry on in your protestations by all means but don't expect much in the way of belief for most of what you spout ad nauseum.
Where ARE the positives?
I suppose I could say 6000 die had fans.
Long Suffering.
Lied to consistently particularly over the past twelve months.
Many have pulled up evidence that dispels the lies to customers,creditors and fans.
Twice in 19 months for approaching 3 million debt that cannot be paid?
Your concluding line is priceless.
"what you spout ad nauseum"
Quid Pro Quo.

Nite Nite Brian.
Get off the sofa.
Good Boy.
Family Guy will never be the same when you retire
There speaks a non supporter.
I read that you think I'm a lunatic, under your "Noble and Honest" persona on the RAB site.

Thanks for the compliment, I'm sure I don't deserve it!
By the way can I borrow your key to the asylum?
[quote][p][bold]Arhmen Noleg[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]raisemeup[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Arhmen Noleg[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]raisemeup[/bold] wrote: If we follow the articles written about the whole mess we find ourselves faced with, people don't need to posture on what could have been "IF" this had happened and if these people hadn't have........? Every time something happens, with the Bulls attempting to continue trading, with a semblance of a chance to avoid the slip into obscurity. We read the same self righteous comments from either those who would like to see us dead in the water, or would like us to think they are in the know, and what they wish to tell us is the absolute truth? For an example of this idiotic thinking, someone (a nameless person) said that he knew for a fact that someone (another nameless person) was a con man, and dishonest, When I asked how they knew this? The person with no name said, he knew this for fact because his son's father in laws,son in law lived next door to this nameless con man, and he knew how he got his cars. So TVOR- AXelf-Armen-Bierley Boy- Shelf ,(by other names,) Rhino - and others who can tell us how bad it is for us con men-crooks-philander ers etc,etc. and of course Loyal Supporters of the Bulls. Enjoy your brief moment of glory, and realise like the rest us already know, your legendary status is only in your Head...we think you are absolutely full of S... or worse![/p][/quote]So we all should just say nothing and take whats happened as if it was quite normal. Thee is no glory in attempting to dissect discus and analyse the dreadfull events of the past three years. Do you really think anyone is happy with the truth. I see many genuine sports loving fans calling for an enquiry. 6000 at Odsal last Thursday. Evidence in itself that people are heartily sick of the affair. You come across a if you would defend Charles Manson or Peter Sutcliffe. Legendary Status...come off it. It pains us all to reveal things.[/p][/quote]If I thought that was the case, you would have my support! However as you and your other self " Noble and Honest" only concentrate on the negatives, plus you bandy about damaging and unsubstantiated stories that lack clarity and substance? You believe what you want to, but the majority I suspect don't believe you or the others are champions of the justice you tell us all about. I will not defend the indefensible just as I won't judge or pre judge anyone unless I have irrefutable proof that they have committed the wrongs people like yourself say they have. When challenged you can never produce any real evidence of anything that wasn't known. Carry on in your protestations by all means but don't expect much in the way of belief for most of what you spout ad nauseum.[/p][/quote]Where ARE the positives? I suppose I could say 6000 die had fans. Long Suffering. Lied to consistently particularly over the past twelve months. Many have pulled up evidence that dispels the lies to customers,creditors and fans. Twice in 19 months for approaching 3 million debt that cannot be paid? Your concluding line is priceless. "what you spout ad nauseum" Quid Pro Quo. Nite Nite Brian. Get off the sofa. Good Boy. Family Guy will never be the same when you retire[/p][/quote]There speaks a non supporter. I read that you think I'm a lunatic, under your "Noble and Honest" persona on the RAB site. Thanks for the compliment, I'm sure I don't deserve it! By the way can I borrow your key to the asylum? raisemeup
  • Score: -1

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