Good news, bad news for Bradford Bulls (From Bradford Telegraph and Argus)

What a total mess. This whole situation is a complete farce! Fans deserve far better than the sh*t we have been fed over last few months!
I hope that when we are told there are potential investors, that this time it is not lies, as we have all been fed previously! Very worried!

I hope they don't expect more donations from supporters. I am affraid I have paid my lot unfortunately. £750,000 on top of an investor sounds a lot of money unless they can build this in to future planning and spread this debt over say 5 years. Many clubs are in debt. If we end up owing this figure and can plan to pay it off over a period of time while still spending the full cap then it might work out fine. We don't need to pay off all debts at one go - just make sure they are managable - 750,000 over 5 years would be £150,000 pa + interest = not too bad!

Oddly enough I find something encouraging about this - for the first time in years we have a person who is willing to come straight out with specific numbers as to what is actually going on with the club and call a spade a spade. Now we know the situation, and they are embarking on a plan to remedy it. I do not understand how we can be losing 100k a month but never mind.

What is clear and I appreciate that money is tight and people around BD are not well off, but we cannot have the cheap season ticket deal again and we supporters had better get used to paying more like 200 for the season tickets than we presently do.

Ah well, onward and upward. COYB FOREVER!!!

I think its more mudslinging than transparency... but hopefully we can announce some re-signings or there will be no team next year anyway

Good luck to all. The finances of the club are a complete shambles and these revelations are, frankly, shocking. Injecting funds into a "business" that is losing £100K per month is not an Investment - it's a "charitable donation". The previous stewardship of the club has been disastrous and clearly the Management have simply closed their eyes to what was needed to balance the books - that is, increasing income or trimming costs. No easy matter at the best of times. Frankly, this is why Administrators are appointed. As disinterested parties they can make unpalatable decisions that those too emotionally involved are unwilling to implement. I wish any "investors" the best of luck but from the fans point of view any requests to raise more funds should be viewed on the basis that their hard earned cash will in present circumstances be a mere "sticking plaster" - likely to be "money down the drain". But as a sports fan I would still donate cash to support my club however dire the circumstances - that's what fans do - however irrational ! Let's hope that the new Board can get to grips with the situation sooner rather than later because time is definitely not on the Club's side.

Good morning fellow 'moaners!! We have only just begun to hear the truth from the 'board'. Why on earth it has taken this long to confirm what some of us suspected all along is a mystery.
I can reveal there is a lot worse to come.Brace yourselves.

Expect administration within the next 2 weeks

barbarian mike wrote:
What a total mess. This whole situation is a complete farce! Fans deserve far better than the sh*t we have been fed over last few months!
I hope that when we are told there are potential investors, that this time it is not lies, as we have all been fed previously! Very worried!

Exactly!! Why are people not able to see it the way some of us do? It is totally unacceptable and I'm sorry but it looks more and more like the cash they took from us to 'save' the club was little short of criminal. There remains a lot of questions to be answered.

The last point is spot on.
Where has the £500000 gone.To pay what?
Yes this is more mudslinging than transparency.
Why has it taken over 3 and a half weeks to find this out.
Why no published statement of affairs.
Do fans and public who have invested half a million not deserve that.
They have probably invested more than the new board.
If the fans (who to date are THE ONLY INVESTORS)want someone to imndependently look at these numbers I think you have a right.
I would not donate any more without transparency.
Your investment should be regarded as that.
Just as Caisley sees his investment of the "6 percent holding of shares.
THe fans are just as worthy of the full picture,.
From what I read He in all probability started the rot to which others have added.
DISGRACE>
How can anyone (if it is accurate)lose 1.2 million annually and expect to survive.
Without an Abranovic or sheik.
Could not manage their way out of a paper bag.
Come on you fans demand to see the full financial statements your investment deserves.
Expect administration if the figures are correct.
What do the Bulls own now.
Sweet FA I would assumne.
Not good

I think the new investor may be an Arab investor friend of our MP George Galloway.

As majority share holder Caisley will have known about what we owe and what we should have paid off. All this talk of additional cash we owe is absolute nonsense. I'm afraid we've all been taken hook line and sinker.

The board are preparing the fans for administration without taking any of the blame themselves. I regret giving the club £150 now.

arhmen aleg wrote:
The last point is spot on.
Where has the £500000 gone.To pay what?
Yes this is more mudslinging than transparency.
Why has it taken over 3 and a half weeks to find this out.
Why no published statement of affairs.
Do fans and public who have invested half a million not deserve that.
They have probably invested more than the new board.
If the fans (who to date are THE ONLY INVESTORS)want someone to imndependently look at these numbers I think you have a right.
I would not donate any more without transparency.
Your investment should be regarded as that.
Just as Caisley sees his investment of the "6 percent holding of shares.
THe fans are just as worthy of the full picture,.
From what I read He in all probability started the rot to which others have added.
DISGRACE>
How can anyone (if it is accurate)lose 1.2 million annually and expect to survive.
Without an Abranovic or sheik.
Could not manage their way out of a paper bag.
Come on you fans demand to see the full financial statements your investment deserves.
Expect administration if the figures are correct.
What do the Bulls own now.
Sweet FA I would assumne.
Not good

I think you may be getting confused between Investment and Donation, An investment is where you receive a return on what you put in. A donation is a gift without any return or commitment. The pledge was asking for fan donations not fan investments.

Sell your better players.
Live within your means.
Pay realistic prices for your season tickets.
Don't listen to Adey" Duke Peter of Hood".
Do all of the above and you wont have to go around embarrassing yourselves any more.
Oh, and give back all those titles you won when you obviously cheated your figures to obtain the squad you did.

The honorable thing would be to put The Bulls into liquidation. Then we (the fans) can rebuild Bradford Northern RLFC from the bottom up, out of the ashes.

Any attempt at administration would leave our club in the hands of the crooks who have got us into this mess in the first place, at the price of swindling their creditors and the fans who so generously donated money under false pretences.

Let the club die, then resurrect it and bring it back as a fan-owned club.

It seems like Mr Hood decided to roll the dice and hoped that seven would show. No wonder he was self-deluding in believing we were good enough to finish in the top four - our only hope to gain and attract further income. To budget to LOSE 1 million pounds beggars belief. We are paying the up to the salary cap and for what? Much better to pay for personnel who have a passion and belief in Bradford Bulls. What happened to Mr Hood's financial prudence that so many of his followers came on this site to preach the mantra? Mr Hood has made Mr Caisley appear astute and financially competent. A five year contract for Mr McNamara - sorry to mention it but unbelievable. The worry, now, is that we are being set up for administration. Forget about the play-offs and focus on saving this once great club. The Phoenix can rise - keep the faith.

So have I got this right we have received £1.5 million from the RFL and £0.5 million in pledges. It would be good to receive a breakdown of where this money has gone or is going before stating that we need a further £1.25 million to pay off outstanding debts and cover expenses until the end of the season. The supporters who have pledged their money deserve some answers.

So Mr Coulby has said the hole is bigger than the previous incubents let on - what a surprise - given the split between shareholders he was hardly going to say that everything was better than he thought was he.

The hole was massive when Hood and Bennet took over. Caisley and his cohorts are doing their best to shift all the blame on to them, when they are just as culpable.

Budgeting for a loss IS a sensible business practice. You don't want to make a loss in business, but sometimes there's no choice. Knowing how much you can afford to lose is the key

Wots up wrote:
So have I got this right we have received £1.5 million from the RFL and £0.5 million in pledges. It would be good to receive a breakdown of where this money has gone or is going before stating that we need a further £1.25 million to pay off outstanding debts and cover expenses until the end of the season. The supporters who have pledged their money deserve some answers.

...you've forgotten to include the six figure loan.

Looks like the Bulls have been living in Never Never Land for years, racking up debts, with no likelihood of stemming the outflow of cash.

Fans then told "half a story" to attract enough cash to pay the wages and serving only to defer the inevitable.

The Directors then walk away leaving someone else to sort out the mess.

jambo wrote:
The hole was massive when Hood and Bennet took over. Caisley and his cohorts are doing their best to shift all the blame on to them, when they are just as culpable.

Budgeting for a loss IS a sensible business practice. You don't want to make a loss in business, but sometimes there's no choice. Knowing how much you can afford to lose is the key

It's alright to run at a manageable loss when you have assets to borrow against or a "sugar daddy" to plug the gap until the good times return. The Bulls have neither. Mismanagement at best, unprintable at worst.

This is bollards from Caisley, trying to make others look bad so he can come in as the saviour. It is clear from the last couple of quotes that they expect to avoid administration.
To go into administration would make owning the franchise pointless as there is little money or glory in the lower leagues.
It is clear the company has been in deep s..t for ages, and the new people are rightly trying to ensure that does not happen again. BUT...they have to prepare us for selling the prize assets such as Bateman.
This is just prep for that happening.

Pablo wrote:

Wots up wrote:
So have I got this right we have received £1.5 million from the RFL and £0.5 million in pledges. It would be good to receive a breakdown of where this money has gone or is going before stating that we need a further £1.25 million to pay off outstanding debts and cover expenses until the end of the season. The supporters who have pledged their money deserve some answers.

...you've forgotten to include the six figure loan.

Looks like the Bulls have been living in Never Never Land for years, racking up debts, with no likelihood of stemming the outflow of cash.

Fans then told "half a story" to attract enough cash to pay the wages and serving only to defer the inevitable.

The Directors then walk away leaving someone else to sort out the mess.

I didn't forget I just assumed it was an insignificant amount (£100k/5%) compared to £2million. But after reading the report it could have been £999k. One other thought is if the bank supposedly withdrew our overdraft facilities why would they give us a six figure loan. It beggars belief. Another reason for thinking that it would not be a substantial figure. But I don't have the figures to hand.

jammle wrote:

arhmen aleg wrote: The last point is spot on. Where has the £500000 gone.To pay what? Yes this is more mudslinging than transparency. Why has it taken over 3 and a half weeks to find this out. Why no published statement of affairs. Do fans and public who have invested half a million not deserve that. They have probably invested more than the new board. If the fans (who to date are THE ONLY INVESTORS)want someone to imndependently look at these numbers I think you have a right. I would not donate any more without transparency. Your investment should be regarded as that. Just as Caisley sees his investment of the "6 percent holding of shares. THe fans are just as worthy of the full picture,. From what I read He in all probability started the rot to which others have added. DISGRACE> How can anyone (if it is accurate)lose 1.2 million annually and expect to survive. Without an Abranovic or sheik. Could not manage their way out of a paper bag. Come on you fans demand to see the full financial statements your investment deserves. Expect administration if the figures are correct. What do the Bulls own now. Sweet FA I would assumne. Not good

I think you may be getting confused between Investment and Donation, An investment is where you receive a return on what you put in. A donation is a gift without any return or commitment. The pledge was asking for fan donations not fan investments.

I beg to differ.
I may be wrong but All my distant follow of the appeal referred to "pledges".
therefore it is my view that to date its the fans that have kept this club alive through their INVESTMENT.
Has Mr Coulby,Mr Caisley,Mr Hood come forward with any further INVESTMENT themselves.
Methinks not.
Do you seriously believe the shareholders had any worthwhile value on their original investment years ago.
Methinks not.
The fans INVESTMENT has brought about a stay of executuion.
In any insolvency administration (without further investors restructuring) is inevitable.
So the fans did to build a pot independent of the "crooks" as some refer to them.
To be ready to invest and purchase fronm the administrater.
Who will be appointed if other investors are not found.
Yes you sound like you have been taken for a ride fans and I cannot believe it has to three and a half weeks to come up with this tiny bit of financial information.
No transparency here.
Just a lot of shuffling for position in order to be in pole to pick up the first opportunity for the crooks to retain ownership by purchasing from the administrater.
DO NOT DONATE ANY MORE FANS UNTIL YOU GET COMPLETE TRANSPARENCY>
Do you seriously trust Mr Caisley?
To lead you back to the promised land?
Or is he likely to be just axtinng to protect his worthless (current)investment.

Would you have sanctioned Fred the shred to be still in charge of RBS.
Or the goons at Northern Rock to be given first chance to buy it back after write off"s and saviour by HM Govt.
Methinks not.
Mr Caisley and Co currently hold a worthless investment.
Get shut of them and take control fans when administration beckons.
A fraction of that £ 500000 could have bought the club back.
The sad truth is that the bulk of it will go on the professional fees that administration usually incurrs.
And the creditors will whistle.
And Caisley will hope to gain full control by purchase from the administrater.
STOP THIS HAPPENING FANS>
Hand over no more but put it into a war chest to ensure that a future club is rid of these idiots.
The pledges should have been given this way.
To force the shareholders to part with their shares.
Oh the filfthy scheming of it all.
Jammie are you truly serious in believing that anyone Invests in professional sport hoping for a return.
Even Jack Tordoff made no profit by the time he got out of Bradford City.
And he"s as shrewd as they come.
Be ready to go fans.

Where does all the money go.We have no superstars to pay.The ground is a dump.The club shop is selling a poor range of Kooga products, it must be that the girls behind the bars are on £5000 a game.Hood staked everything on Orford in 2010. that failed and cheap tickets in 2011 .I agree ticket prices need to increase, and the club needs to tell us all where the money goes. I mean £100000 a month are they throwing down a sewer.

arhmen aleg has got it right. To summarise - we (the fans) have been swindled. We can no longer trust the club's owners.

The time has come for fans to take action, along the lines of AFC Wimbledon or FC United. If the majoroty of Bulls fans put their weight behind a Pheonix club - RLFC Bradford Northern - we could have a fans club operating at a decent level within a couple of years. Such a club would have far more credibility than a disgraced Bulls that had been "rescued" by its own saboteurs.

Shelfrino has a short memory, its only a few years ago that his crap club was saved from going bust by a certain Mr Caddick who still bankrolls them to keep them a float. Please Mr Caddick do the right thing and let them sink.

Shelfrino has a short memory, its only a few years ago that his crap club was saved from going bust by a certain Mr Caddick who still bankrolls them to keep them a float. Please Mr Caddick do the right thing and let them sink.

trueBradfordian wrote:
arhmen aleg has got it right. To summarise - we (the fans) have been swindled. We can no longer trust the club's owners.

The time has come for fans to take action, along the lines of AFC Wimbledon or FC United. If the majoroty of Bulls fans put their weight behind a Pheonix club - RLFC Bradford Northern - we could have a fans club operating at a decent level within a couple of years. Such a club would have far more credibility than a disgraced Bulls that had been "rescued" by its own saboteurs.

like your thought,about an phoenix club,but your phrase
"If the majoroty of Bulls fans put their weight behind a Pheonix club - RLFC Bradford Northern - we could have a fans club operating at a decent level within a couple of years."this in itself is one of the problems not enough of fans would be interested its hard enough getting them to odsal ,while we are is super league ,so a team operating in the lower leagues , would receive little support IMO.

where has all the money gone has Hood paid for his new house he's building out of it?
what did they get a loan for just after they sold the ground to the rfl?
hood & bennett bled the club dry!

oatesingham wrote:

trueBradfordian wrote:
arhmen aleg has got it right. To summarise - we (the fans) have been swindled. We can no longer trust the club's owners.

The time has come for fans to take action, along the lines of AFC Wimbledon or FC United. If the majoroty of Bulls fans put their weight behind a Pheonix club - RLFC Bradford Northern - we could have a fans club operating at a decent level within a couple of years. Such a club would have far more credibility than a disgraced Bulls that had been "rescued" by its own saboteurs.

like your thought,about an phoenix club,but your phrase
"If the majoroty of Bulls fans put their weight behind a Pheonix club - RLFC Bradford Northern - we could have a fans club operating at a decent level within a couple of years."this in itself is one of the problems not enough of fans would be interested its hard enough getting them to odsal ,while we are is super league ,so a team operating in the lower leagues , would receive little support IMO.

You may be right, but I would say that (i) there should be enough support and interest for such a club to be viable (ii) Super League would be very keen to help the new club, given their investment in odsal (iii) what's the alternative?

I have no appetite for a club that is the plaything of a bunch of crooks who have deliberately swindled theiir own fans.

Let's not forget it was solicitor Caisley's foolish misinterpretation of contract law that started us down this path to financial meltdown eight years ago. I worry that while Hood made it no better the current incumbents aren't going to improve things either. I hope I am wrong.

bullsforever wrote:
Shelfrino has a short memory, its only a few years ago that his crap club was saved from going bust by a certain Mr Caddick who still bankrolls them to keep them a float. Please Mr Caddick do the right thing and let them sink.

Think you'll find the World Champions make a profit.
Virtually giving season tickets away was never going to work.
The fact that most of your fans have dropped off the radar just goes to show that most were glory hunters.
All those years of buying titles and silverware, the chickens are now coming home to roost, and it doesn't look like the bucket rattlers are going to save you this time.
Time to do the honest thing and sell your assets and live within your means.

Who are these people supposedly running sports clubs? They're either utterly incompetent or seriously corrupt.
I'm sick and tired of the stories trotted out by these jokers. They seem to imply, and want people to believe that circumstances shift as if by magic and then expect fans, new investors etc to rally round and help sort it out.
There were the multiple farces at Leeds United ("oh dear, we thought we were fifty million in debt but after selling forty millions worth of players it now turns out that we're still fifty million in debt") and Portsmouth, and now the farce at Glasgow Rangers (how on earth can a brand as big as that go bust? - because people have hands their hands in the till big time and do it more and more when they see signs of the ship wobbling).
These supposed "business" people lording it in their suits, see sports clubs as cash cows where they can play their games and act all innocent.
We need more more stringest rules to stop them exploiting situations in this way.
If a club's not sustainable, let it die and get over it.
The fans can then set up their own clubs like AFC Wimbledon or FC United of Manchester. Refreshing examples of people who do it for the love of sport and community.

Shelfhino lives in cloud cuckoo land, the Whinos posted their first profit in April for years. Without Mr Caddick, the owner who saved them from bankruptcy they would have gone out of existance years ago.

bullsforever wrote:
Shelfhino lives in cloud cuckoo land, the Whinos posted their first profit in April for years. Without Mr Caddick, the owner who saved them from bankruptcy they would have gone out of existance years ago.

Oh dear how bitter you are. Feeling ripped off after giving " Duke Peter of Hood" your money are you?
Never mind, next season you'll be the bigger fish in the pond again when you go to Fev, Barrow and the likes.
Marching on together.

belle vue wrote:
Who are these people supposedly running sports clubs? They're either utterly incompetent or seriously corrupt. I'm sick and tired of the stories trotted out by these jokers. They seem to imply, and want people to believe that circumstances shift as if by magic and then expect fans, new investors etc to rally round and help sort it out. There were the multiple farces at Leeds United ("oh dear, we thought we were fifty million in debt but after selling forty millions worth of players it now turns out that we're still fifty million in debt") and Portsmouth, and now the farce at Glasgow Rangers (how on earth can a brand as big as that go bust? - because people have hands their hands in the till big time and do it more and more when they see signs of the ship wobbling). These supposed "business" people lording it in their suits, see sports clubs as cash cows where they can play their games and act all innocent. We need more more stringest rules to stop them exploiting situations in this way. If a club's not sustainable, let it die and get over it. The fans can then set up their own clubs like AFC Wimbledon or FC United of Manchester. Refreshing examples of people who do it for the love of sport and community.

Well said.
All we have at Odsal now is a merry go round of incompetents.
How can anyone with even half a brain budget to lose £1.2 million without at the end of that 12 month period having a big benefactor to close the shortfall and ensure all the creditors are paid.
Some accountant Mr Hood appears.
And some solicitor Caisley appears.
As a player agent he has a conflict of interest.
give your shares to the fans Caisley.You are one of the main reasons the Bulls are bust.