That’s the way to do it, says Bradford City boss Parkinson (From Bradford Telegraph and Argus)

meanwhile Richie Jones joins Rochdale

tyker2 wrote:
meanwhile Richie Jones joins Rochdale

thanks for that...

tyker2 wrote:
meanwhile Richie Jones joins Rochdale

It won't matter to us we've played them both time this season so it is what we do not what anyone can do against us. Great result last night we need another 12 out of the last 17 for automatic promotion and 80 points. can't see any of the others below Port Vale and Gillingham getting anywhere near that. I wasn't that impressed with Gillingham in the home game.

Where are all the Parkinson/Hanson/Gra
y/Duke bashers this morning? Oh, it seems City won last night. Back in the woodwork until the next defeat? AND...........where is the now LEGENDARY shaun from RICHMOND?????? ..... DEADBEAT shaun......Thanks for helping the club I support shaun....It's kind of you... cos you don't support the club, the chairmen, the players or manager do you shaun. So kind of you to give money....How's the GOLF??????........sh
aun......he's been to DUBAI you know.... isn't that just brilliant????

Peter 300 why do you always write that crap?it's boring now.

Peter300 wrote:
Where are all the Parkinson/Hanson/Gra y/Duke bashers this morning? Oh, it seems City won last night. Back in the woodwork until the next defeat? AND...........where is the now LEGENDARY shaun from RICHMOND?????? ..... DEADBEAT shaun......Thanks for helping the club I support shaun....It's kind of you... cos you don't support the club, the chairmen, the players or manager do you shaun. So kind of you to give money....How's the GOLF??????........sh aun......he's been to DUBAI you know.... isn't that just brilliant????

You've long since surpassed Shaun as the biggest pr1ck on this site.

As previously predicted City have stormed back into contention for a play off place.

Nobody makes predictions like me, nobody.

Come on you Bantams, ctid

Listen to the Parky ..you have to go out and earn it !. We did that last night and we have done in all the Cup encounters that for sure.

If you also go out and make sure the opposition have to 'earn it' then you won't be short in the end.

Come on City.

Great win, a victory against bottom side Wimbledon will still see us nicely placed for the play-offs and the league cup distractions over after the following weekend.

There is about 3 - 5 points we need to close down to get within that group battling for the final promotion spot and the play-offs, with many of the teams in those spots having to come to Valley Parade it is still more than achievable.

Also shout out to the fans currently queuing for cup final tickets, good luck and hope you all get one, thats dedication spending 24 hours in the snow, I hope your loyalty is rewarded. Surely the club can spare a few scarves to help keep them warm.

Great result last nite the players who came in seemed to have done a great job great to see Davies back

Great result last nite the players who came in seemed to have done a great job great to see Davies back

Great result last nite the players who came in seemed to have done a great job great to see Davies back

Shaunfromrichmond1 wrote:
Great result last nite the players who came in seemed to have done a great job great to see Davies back

shout it thrice from the roof tops

Phew....we needded that. Sounds like a 'rollicking' worked then.....

Also sounded ont radio that Reid was back to his best, which could be great news for wembley.....but just as important after wimbledon we could be right back in there.

I can understand some getting a little concerned but like i said we could have won on Saturday as well. I still feel we need a plan b when our tactics are nullified but an early goal last night certainly helps our system ( as does any lead)......

Also sounded like Davies was immense and just hope we don't re-aggravate any injuries.

Hanson Bashers, why didn't Gray or Thompson score ;-)...seriuosly tho it actually sounds like jimmy contributed nicely. Impact sub ;-).......

Good to see we have the squad to change things around and still get a result. Its all confidence for wembley and then a full on assault for the play-off's......

PS did you know that stewards also qualified for 3 wembley tickets. That should raise a few blood pressures......

pps also heard people some are selling ticket stubs online.......

I hold my hand up and admit i was wrong.....yesterday i said the players were already at Wembley and the next 2 games were virtually given the opposition the points!!!
.
It fees good to be wrong and an amazing result it was. Excellent o have our leader back!!!

@gspot01

It's true, I looked on ebay, and some people were openly selling them for £25, £30, £45, one guy even had a bid of £97 for 3 of his stubs at one point, and there was around half a day left of bidding. I did get rid of my 2 stubs, to a couple of friends, and no money exchanged hands, hope they get tickets!

Great news for the lads last night, well done, we needed that. Roll on Saturday for another 3 points please!

Dannyp1892 wrote:
@gspot01 It's true, I looked on ebay, and some people were openly selling them for £25, £30, £45, one guy even had a bid of £97 for 3 of his stubs at one point, and there was around half a day left of bidding. I did get rid of my 2 stubs, to a couple of friends, and no money exchanged hands, hope they get tickets! Great news for the lads last night, well done, we needed that. Roll on Saturday for another 3 points please!

Sorry @dannbradfc

Wembley tickets (numbered) for sale on e bay: face value of tickets £146:starting offer £150.

this is a part of the auction listing



WEMBLEY CAPITAL ONE CUP FINAL

BRADFORD CITY vs SWANSEA CITY


I have for sale a pair of adult tickets for the upcoming Capital One cup final at Wembley Sunday 24th February 2013
*** Bradford City vs Swansea City***
The tickets are for the Bradford end ( Western terracing ).
Seat numbers are - Block 127 - LV1B127 01/0143 & LV1B127 02/0143.
The seats are together but one right behind the other.
I have included a seating plan and also the view from the seats for these tickets.
The face value for these tickets are £90.00 and £56.00 (Hence the starting price)
Unfortunately I am unable to make it due to other commitments.
I will post out the tickets F.O.C. by special delivery or collection can be arranged
Have yourself a great day out, and lets hope they win!!!

Thanks for looking

so no need to queue if you want these two tickets!!!

tyker2 wrote:

Shaunfromrichmond1 wrote:
Great result last nite the players who came in seemed to have done a great job great to see Davies back

shout it thrice from the roof tops

Ha ha.

I was under the understanding it was illegal to sell them on ebay and seeing as though the seat numbers have been listed they can easily be traced back to a season ticket holder.

The word I think we are looking for is idiot.

Thee Voice of Reason wrote:
I was under the understanding it was illegal to sell them on ebay and seeing as though the seat numbers have been listed they can easily be traced back to a season ticket holder. The word I think we are looking for is idiot.

It's only illegal if the terms and conditions on the back of the ticket say it is illegal, otherwise it's ok. Not got my Wembley tickets to hand to see, but you are probably right, it's most likely illegal

Farsley Bantam wrote:

Peter300 wrote:
Where are all the Parkinson/Hanson/Gra y/Duke bashers this morning? Oh, it seems City won last night. Back in the woodwork until the next defeat? AND...........where is the now LEGENDARY shaun from RICHMOND?????? ..... DEADBEAT shaun......Thanks for helping the club I support shaun....It's kind of you... cos you don't support the club, the chairmen, the players or manager do you shaun. So kind of you to give money....How's the GOLF??????........sh aun......he's been to DUBAI you know.... isn't that just brilliant????

You've long since surpassed Shaun as the biggest pr1ck on this site.

here here

balbrigganfc wrote:
As previously predicted City have stormed back into contention for a play off place.

Nobody makes predictions like me, nobody.

Come on you Bantams, ctid

you do entertain me But please give us the Score for Saturday.I do keep asking but you do not reply NOW be Bold and tell us the score then you will become the Great Predictor Take care City Forever

Queing at VP already - HARDCORE PLASTICS

fatbloke wrote:
Queing at VP already - HARDCORE PLASTICS

You bore me, rather have them there than not, go on, spout off, "where are they on a Saturday afternoon" blah blah blah,,,,, get over it!!!

Farsley Bantam wrote:

Peter300 wrote: Where are all the Parkinson/Hanson/Gra y/Duke bashers this morning? Oh, it seems City won last night. Back in the woodwork until the next defeat? AND...........where is the now LEGENDARY shaun from RICHMOND?????? ..... DEADBEAT shaun......Thanks for helping the club I support shaun....It's kind of you... cos you don't support the club, the chairmen, the players or manager do you shaun. So kind of you to give money....How's the GOLF??????........sh aun......he's been to DUBAI you know.... isn't that just brilliant????

You've long since surpassed Shaun as the biggest pr1ck on this site.

he'll probably enjoy that title.....

TheCoach wrote:

fatbloke wrote:
Queing at VP already - HARDCORE PLASTICS

You bore me, rather have them there than not, go on, spout off, "where are they on a Saturday afternoon" blah blah blah,,,,, get over it!!!

Ha! Touch a nerve?

They might go on a Saturday afternoon and pay in. I really o not give a sh!t.

I was bigging them up by calling them 'hardcore' plastics lol

Great result! We need to build on this now.

fatbloke wrote:

TheCoach wrote:

fatbloke wrote:
Queing at VP already - HARDCORE PLASTICS

You bore me, rather have them there than not, go on, spout off, "where are they on a Saturday afternoon" blah blah blah,,,,, get over it!!!

Ha! Touch a nerve?

They might go on a Saturday afternoon and pay in. I really o not give a sh!t.

I was bigging them up by calling them 'hardcore' plastics lol

I wonder if that landlady is in the queue for her tickets which she promised her regulars - that story still makes me laugh
.
I still think season ticket holders should have had 3 and a half each so we could auction the half to the hardcore plastics.

gspot01 wrote:

fatbloke wrote:

TheCoach wrote:

fatbloke wrote: Queing at VP already - HARDCORE PLASTICS

You bore me, rather have them there than not, go on, spout off, "where are they on a Saturday afternoon" blah blah blah,,,,, get over it!!!

Ha! Touch a nerve? They might go on a Saturday afternoon and pay in. I really o not give a sh!t. I was bigging them up by calling them 'hardcore' plastics lol

I wonder if that landlady is in the queue for her tickets which she promised her regulars - that story still makes me laugh . I still think season ticket holders should have had 3 and a half each so we could auction the half to the hardcore plastics.

the lads in the west have their tickets, apparently.

fatbloke wrote:

TheCoach wrote:

fatbloke wrote: Queing at VP already - HARDCORE PLASTICS

You bore me, rather have them there than not, go on, spout off, "where are they on a Saturday afternoon" blah blah blah,,,,, get over it!!!

Ha! Touch a nerve? They might go on a Saturday afternoon and pay in. I really o not give a sh!t. I was bigging them up by calling them 'hardcore' plastics lol

Like I said, it's gone on for two weeks now,, no nerve touched, just bored!

tyker2 wrote:
meanwhile Richie Jones joins Rochdale

Bet everyone's quaking in their boots over that one!:))

The management and players showed last night that the 'Land of Make Believe' can indeed become a reality, and because 'the Camera never lies' the performance was shown to be strong. Indeed it showed the players finally 'making their mind up' and whilst the club is no longer a Premier League side ('now those days are gone') that they can still

.....play down at places like Wycombe with the desired amount of 'Buckingham Fizz' in their play! Now onto Wimbledon....let's hope the two performances and results have a lot in 'Common!'

You got big balls parky. I like that in a manger. It worked but you would of got so much stick if it had not.
Your turning out to be one of our greatest ever managers due to your intelligence.

tyker2 wrote:
Wembley tickets (numbered) for sale on e bay: face value of tickets £146:starting offer £150.

this is a part of the auction listing



WEMBLEY CAPITAL ONE CUP FINAL

BRADFORD CITY vs SWANSEA CITY


I have for sale a pair of adult tickets for the upcoming Capital One cup final at Wembley Sunday 24th February 2013
*** Bradford City vs Swansea City***
The tickets are for the Bradford end ( Western terracing ).
Seat numbers are - Block 127 - LV1B127 01/0143 & LV1B127 02/0143.
The seats are together but one right behind the other.
I have included a seating plan and also the view from the seats for these tickets.
The face value for these tickets are £90.00 and £56.00 (Hence the starting price)
Unfortunately I am unable to make it due to other commitments.
I will post out the tickets F.O.C. by special delivery or collection can be arranged
Have yourself a great day out, and lets hope they win!!!

Thanks for looking

so no need to queue if you want these two tickets!!!

When I checked Ebay just now, a Bradford 'fan' (?) was selling his ticket (worth: cost of ticket= £72 + delivery charge=£6 booking fee=£2= grand total of £80) for....£125 !!! as a 'starting bid' OR £300 at the 'BUY IT NOW PRICE!!

The place where the ticket is held is listed as 'Bradford' so this person is basically a Bradford fan 'touting' their ticket to a 'fellow City supporter for a much higher price.!!

Apart fom the fact that it is illegal to tout tickets there is the question of the morality of trying to make financial gain from a fellow City fan.

Yes, this person has a right to £80 plus perhaps the cost of the phone call when he/she phoned up to order the ticket eg £0.70 for seven mins. on phone at 10p per minute, but at anywhere etween £125-£300, this 'so-called City fan is tryng to 'screw over'
a fellow City supporter and that stinks!

Like the person who blogged above, the person whose 'ad' I saw on Ebay sited 'committments.' But you have to wonder at the prices some sellers are hoping for and why hey ut it up in the first place. ie whether it is just 'old-fashioned bare-faced greed.'

If you want to sell your ticket .fine...advertise it 'to buy' at a price that covers your expenses..but no more!!

I don't understand peoples problem with people selling their tickets on ebay. In my opinion they've got a season ticket which shows their commitment to the club, maybe for many year so why shouldn't they?? Call it there gift for sticking by the club. Good luck to them.
.
I had to have a chuckle at seeing the people queue at VP tonight.....hope you don't get too cold :-)

If you're a REAL City fan and want to sell your ticket because you cannot now attend the match for whatever reason here's two 'legitimate'/'decent
' ways to do it (apart from selling it on Ebay at face value) which DON'T involve 'ripping off' fellow supporters:

a) In this month's 'Wembley' edition of "City Gent" the editor, Mike Harrison said those with spare tickets should get in touch with him and then he can match up people looking for tickets who have moved out of the area/country with a ticket/the seller be recompensed for all the costs of the ticket/getting it. These 'far-flung' fans are NOT the so-called 'Johnny-come-lately-
glamour game-hungry-plastics
' they are people who ONCE were keen fans but who moved...for whatever reason!

b) In the City reception at Valley Parade, the City official on duty said people with spare tickets could contact him and he would try to match up ticketless fans with unneeded tickets.

So...you've he choice..get your money back AND help a City fan to get a ticket on your behalf...

OR

SeLL your ticket on EBAY to the highest bidder...and possibly rip off a desperate City fan.

PS: I tend to think, the 'greedy ticket sellers DESERVE to sell their ticket to a fan who misbehaves at Wembley and then a forthcoming enquiry will use the ticket details to trace back to the original owner (with all thge 'consequences' involved.

What goes around..etc!!

Remember it says ON the ticket 'Not transferable'! (and certainly NOT to Non-City fans!!)

The type of market economics being witnessed are a relection of society and the world at large and in that way blaming individuals is somewhat harsh. The truth is that it is their choice if they wish to align themselves rather strongly to the principles and behaviours that Margaret Thatcher held so dear and so badly affected the North of the United Kingdom in the 1980s. It does not make a person wrong or bad to exploit their capital (their ticket) & to do what many other have also learnt to do and try and create wealth....but perhaps it does not best represent the principles that were at the heart of the welfare state, the NHS and what is widely seen as 'community'....just a thought....everyone had to answer to their own conscience, nothing more.

bcfcincheshire wrote:
The type of market economics being witnessed are a relection of society and the world at large and in that way blaming individuals is somewhat harsh. The truth is that it is their choice if they wish to align themselves rather strongly to the principles and behaviours that Margaret Thatcher held so dear and so badly affected the North of the United Kingdom in the 1980s. It does not make a person wrong or bad to exploit their capital (their ticket) & to do what many other have also learnt to do and try and create wealth....but perhaps it does not best represent the principles that were at the heart of the welfare state, the NHS and what is widely seen as 'community'....just a thought....everyone had to answer to their own conscience, nothing more.

So much for the 'bonds' in being City fans. 'Thatcherism'...now there's a 'creed'..to follow..Bantams fans!!

Of course 'Thatcherism's' brand of wealth creation was ALL about exploitation of...someone or other!!

Rather, this (Lancastrian-based) exiled fan seems to be excusing the concept of 'every City fan for themselves'

Doesn't make for a particularly inspiring 'motto':

'We spend ..we sell ...other City fans can go...to hell..!!.

Cityman23 wrote:

bcfcincheshire wrote:
The type of market economics being witnessed are a relection of society and the world at large and in that way blaming individuals is somewhat harsh. The truth is that it is their choice if they wish to align themselves rather strongly to the principles and behaviours that Margaret Thatcher held so dear and so badly affected the North of the United Kingdom in the 1980s. It does not make a person wrong or bad to exploit their capital (their ticket) & to do what many other have also learnt to do and try and create wealth....but perhaps it does not best represent the principles that were at the heart of the welfare state, the NHS and what is widely seen as 'community'....just a thought....everyone had to answer to their own conscience, nothing more.

So much for the 'bonds' in being City fans. 'Thatcherism'...now there's a 'creed'..to follow..Bantams fans!!

Of course 'Thatcherism's' brand of wealth creation was ALL about exploitation of...someone or other!!

Rather, this (Lancastrian-based) exiled fan seems to be excusing the concept of 'every City fan for themselves'

Doesn't make for a particularly inspiring 'motto':

'We spend ..we sell ...other City fans can go...to hell..!!.

Thatcherism was indeed reprehensible...that is obvious...but blaming individuals directly won't prevent them doing it....they have to make that judgement for themselves...perhaps you and I would make a different choice to them and sell at face value....and the examples given clearly showed their behaviour is not one you and I share nor aspire to....but discrimination and division takes all forms....such as labelling people as exiles and Lancastrian as if everyone living every day of their life in Yorkshire makes them a better person. Plenty of Yorkshire people live outside of Yorkshire. Indeed a one hundered mile round trip to watch City home games from Cheshire and working in the NHS public sector means all of the above reaction was not really an accurate assessment of the points being made. Not to worry.

You're obviously sensitive about being a City fan and living in Lancashire, but you're the one who flagged it up with your 'nomme de plume' and all I did was accurately describe you as 'Lancastrian-based'. That appears to be a fact and not an opinion. unless you think it's perjorative? But how you get from that to saying I am discriminating against you or creating 'division' is beyond me.

I think you'll find it was 'Thatcher' herself who was the high priestess of 'divide and rule!'

If you're a CITY FAN YOU'RE ""ONE OF US" to coin the well known phrase. But it's the 'US' bit that I care about most!

And City fans like any others are NOT 'saints' but if I can persuade other City fans not to sell their tickets to other City fans at exploitative prices, I think it's worth doing. If some City fans agree that it's a shaming thing to do/don't do it-great!!

This site is a forum for discussion/agreeing/
disagreeing/persuadi
ng/argument.... after all.

As for criticising 'individuals', I reserve the right to do so, when I see fit, just as you appear to be doing so to me. And I have taken stick from others before, but not carped about it.

My opinion remains mine, and anybody else is free to disagree if they like, as you can too.

I STILL feel that to buy tickets with the purpose of selling at large profit at the expense of other City fans...REPEAT OTHER CITYFANS...not just any buyer... is disgusting and wrong.

And that is wrong whether it be one individual or a group of individuals doing it.

This country would have been screwed without Maggie. If only today's politicians had half as much about them.

Correction.. this country was screwed ...BECAUSE... of 'Maggie'!!

Evidence:

She sold off Gas/Elecricity for a 'song' now we're ALL being 'screwed' by the energy companies.

She created a 'greed is good' culture whch was carried on by her heirs/successors incl. New Labour which led to...2008 and the financial crash ..which screwed us all..financially. It will continue for a decade or more.

She created a 'culture' where bosses of firms could screw their workers..and now we find workers..with little means of defending themseles from low pay/unemployment etc.

The culture of 'greed is good' has led to a destablisation within society where many think nothing of screwing their neighbour, thinking it's only a problem when you're caught..and of course..the Tottenham riots where some indulged in an orgy of ''acquisition' at any price...can also be 'sourced'..to the time of 'loads of money'...that's what I want!!

That wonderful 'excuse' .MARKET FORCES ..was trotted out to..excuse ..just about anything...but usually..something..
.not very nice...and it is STILL. BEING TROTTED OUT!!

So despite the fact, MT came across as strong-willed, determined and knew her own mind..the things she believed in ...were wrong...and she did more damage and harm...than any democratic country has the right to expect..or indead fear!

Hopefully, we'll neer see her ilk again!

Cityman23 wrote:
Correction.. this country was screwed ...BECAUSE... of 'Maggie'!!

Evidence:

She sold off Gas/Elecricity for a 'song' now we're ALL being 'screwed' by the energy companies.

She created a 'greed is good' culture whch was carried on by her heirs/successors incl. New Labour which led to...2008 and the financial crash ..which screwed us all..financially. It will continue for a decade or more.

She created a 'culture' where bosses of firms could screw their workers..and now we find workers..with little means of defending themseles from low pay/unemployment etc.

The culture of 'greed is good' has led to a destablisation within society where many think nothing of screwing their neighbour, thinking it's only a problem when you're caught..and of course..the Tottenham riots where some indulged in an orgy of ''acquisition' at any price...can also be 'sourced'..to the time of 'loads of money'...that's what I want!!

That wonderful 'excuse' .MARKET FORCES ..was trotted out to..excuse ..just about anything...but usually..something..

.not very nice...and it is STILL. BEING TROTTED OUT!!

So despite the fact, MT came across as strong-willed, determined and knew her own mind..the things she believed in ...were wrong...and she did more damage and harm...than any democratic country has the right to expect..or indead fear!

Hopefully, we'll neer see her ilk again!

But we were virtually bankrupt.

Because of poor management by the Labour party - again.

This country is currently the seventh richest in the world. Back in May 1979, BT (before Thatcher) we were similarly one of the richest in te world. To say we were/are 'bankrupt' is/was simply untrue.

Cityman23 wrote:
Correction.. this country was screwed ...BECAUSE... of 'Maggie'!!

Evidence:

She sold off Gas/Elecricity for a 'song' now we're ALL being 'screwed' by the energy companies.

She created a 'greed is good' culture whch was carried on by her heirs/successors incl. New Labour which led to...2008 and the financial crash ..which screwed us all..financially. It will continue for a decade or more.

She created a 'culture' where bosses of firms could screw their workers..and now we find workers..with little means of defending themseles from low pay/unemployment etc.

The culture of 'greed is good' has led to a destablisation within society where many think nothing of screwing their neighbour, thinking it's only a problem when you're caught..and of course..the Tottenham riots where some indulged in an orgy of ''acquisition' at any price...can also be 'sourced'..to the time of 'loads of money'...that's what I want!!

That wonderful 'excuse' .MARKET FORCES ..was trotted out to..excuse ..just about anything...but usually..something..

.not very nice...and it is STILL. BEING TROTTED OUT!!

So despite the fact, MT came across as strong-willed, determined and knew her own mind..the things she believed in ...were wrong...and she did more damage and harm...than any democratic country has the right to expect..or indead fear!

Hopefully, we'll neer see her ilk again!

and she sorted out the unions who were crippling this country: remember the three day week by any chance?

Without breaking the unions we would now ha e been a communist state run by the brothers in the unions,

But what has all this to do with BCAFC

It may have 'nothing' to do with BCAFC superficially but the 'argument' has 'gone there' (and you've carried it on yourself, so I will similarly add my 'four penneth'!

Societies generally are fraught with 'battles' between those people with great wealth who don't want to share it, and in fact increase their riches greatly further ..
and those who have much less who seek more 'redistribution.'

Up to Thatcher all govts. accepted that stable societies must have redistribution and a fair tax system which allows the difference between richest/poorest NOT to be too great.

Thatcher smashed that 'orthodoxy' and from then to this day (incl. under New Labour) the gap between richest/poorest has grown to ridiculously and even dangerous levels. It continues to grow because those at the 'top' incl. bankers/financiers/h
edge fund operators/ CEOs etc are being paid 100s of times what ordinary employees get.

In the 70s, before Thatcher, it was Tory PM Heath who caused 'the three day week' by attempting to deny tge miners a fair wage for a dreadful type of job. Heath called an election and was NOT supported by most people.

When Thatcher came in, she defeated the miners who said she was trying to destroy their jobs-she did just that..and more.

Today, most workers have little 'clout' when it comes to dealing with employers hence we now live in a low wage/long working hours economy, which is precisely what MT/others of her 'persuasion' hoped for.

But we also see signs of breakdown of 'coherency' in society with an 'underclass' of people derided as 'chavs' and to be blamed/treated badly as not worthy of any decent treatment. This allows the 'heirs of MT to carry on treating thgem badly.

Thatcher WAS the starting point for all this and she created a divisiveness in society that persists where some-generally the 'better off' think she was wonderful whilst the rest off us loathe/revile her for what she did to our country.

What's this to do with BCAFC? Well there's bound to be people who have suffered at her policies/those being carried on now by the Tory-led govt, carrying on 'her legacy' who are City fans.

As a City fan myself (and one who opposed her and all she stood for) and one who opposes the idea of people carrying on her 'market forces ideas', ie sell your BCAFC ticket to the 'highest bidder' and to hell with how it affects the 'other BCAFC fan', I believe I am entitled to opppose it..here!

I think we need to look after our old and vunerable but there is a balance to be struck. this is what she said in 1987 and i find it hard to disagree with:

I think we have gone through a period when too many children and people have been given to understand "I have a problem, it is the Government's job to cope with it!" or "I have a problem, I will go and get a grant to cope with it!" "I am homeless, the Government must house me!" and so they are casting their problems on society and who is society? There is no such thing! There are individual men and women and there are families and no government can do anything except through people and people look to themselves first. It is our duty to look after ourselves and then also to help look after our neighbour and life is a reciprocal business and people have got the entitlements too much in mind without the obligations.

Cityman23 wrote:

bcfcincheshire wrote:
The type of market economics being witnessed are a relection of society and the world at large and in that way blaming individuals is somewhat harsh. The truth is that it is their choice if they wish to align themselves rather strongly to the principles and behaviours that Margaret Thatcher held so dear and so badly affected the North of the United Kingdom in the 1980s. It does not make a person wrong or bad to exploit their capital (their ticket) & to do what many other have also learnt to do and try and create wealth....but perhaps it does not best represent the principles that were at the heart of the welfare state, the NHS and what is widely seen as 'community'....just a thought....everyone had to answer to their own conscience, nothing more.

So much for the 'bonds' in being City fans. 'Thatcherism'...now there's a 'creed'..to follow..Bantams fans!!

Of course 'Thatcherism's' brand of wealth creation was ALL about exploitation of...someone or other!!

Rather, this (Lancastrian-based) exiled fan seems to be excusing the concept of 'every City fan for themselves'

Doesn't make for a particularly inspiring 'motto':

'We spend ..we sell ...other City fans can go...to hell..!!.

Actually, the intent of Thatcherism was that you would get out more if you put in more and that free market economics would deliver this. Sadly, as with any ideology it completely fails to sit well with Human Nature so that those who are unable (or unwilling) to put much in end up with little or nothing and are exploited by those who see an opportunity to get even more out for themselves.

Hence, free market economics make Wayne Rooney a multi millionnaire and the average Nurse a pauper. Who's fault is it though if some people are willing to pay £100 every month for Sky TV but get uppity about paying less than a tenner for prescription....

It's a tricky one Cityman.

Cityman23 wrote:
Correction.. this country was screwed ...BECAUSE... of 'Maggie'!!

Evidence:

She sold off Gas/Elecricity for a 'song' now we're ALL being 'screwed' by the energy companies.

She created a 'greed is good' culture whch was carried on by her heirs/successors incl. New Labour which led to...2008 and the financial crash ..which screwed us all..financially. It will continue for a decade or more.

She created a 'culture' where bosses of firms could screw their workers..and now we find workers..with little means of defending themseles from low pay/unemployment etc.

The culture of 'greed is good' has led to a destablisation within society where many think nothing of screwing their neighbour, thinking it's only a problem when you're caught..and of course..the Tottenham riots where some indulged in an orgy of ''acquisition' at any price...can also be 'sourced'..to the time of 'loads of money'...that's what I want!!

That wonderful 'excuse' .MARKET FORCES ..was trotted out to..excuse ..just about anything...but usually..something..

.not very nice...and it is STILL. BEING TROTTED OUT!!

So despite the fact, MT came across as strong-willed, determined and knew her own mind..the things she believed in ...were wrong...and she did more damage and harm...than any democratic country has the right to expect..or indead fear!

Hopefully, we'll neer see her ilk again!

It's not that one-sided though is it. How many people now run a car, own their own home, can afford to buy horse burgers; er I mean can afford to buy ample food. Many people only feel poor now because expectations are so much higher. The average person is significantly better off now then they were in the 70's. Thatcherism was supposed to give people the opportunity to improve themselves but as mentioned; that works better for some than it does for others.

If someone has a low paid job; they do have the freedom to get a different job or set up their own business if they feel that they are exploited by their current employer. The single most important person in anyone's career is themselves and the only thing holding you back is you. Looking to blame anyone; even big busiess or government is (in my opinion) a cop out.

I would however ask what you would suggest as an alternative? I hate state interference as I do not believe that some muppet minister should be telling me what i can and can't do with my life. I do not see why Government is allowed to tell me that i cannot stand at a football match or that i MUST wear a seatbelt. I also do not believe that governments can control a population to try and make things fair. The free market with appropriate legislation still seems like the best way if not a perfect way to run things.

I suspect you don't agree...

Cityman23 wrote:
This country is currently the seventh richest in the world. Back in May 1979, BT (before Thatcher) we were similarly one of the richest in te world. To say we were/are 'bankrupt' is/was simply untrue.

Let's get this straight. We are still bankrupt. This is a fact. If our "borrowing" capabilities were switched off then we have more debts than assets. If the UK were a Limited or a Public company then it would be breaking the law operating as it currently does. The measure of who is and isn't the richest country is based on standard of living but in the UK this is artificially underpinned by government borrowing!

The failure of the banks was a failure of regulation, a failure of good corporate governance and a failure of the consumer to accept reality and live to their means. You can't just blame Thatcher for all of that; particularly when it was the US and the rest of Europe that caused the most grief.

Cityman23 wrote:
It may have 'nothing' to do with BCAFC superficially but the 'argument' has 'gone there' (and you've carried it on yourself, so I will similarly add my 'four penneth'!

Societies generally are fraught with 'battles' between those people with great wealth who don't want to share it, and in fact increase their riches greatly further ..
and those who have much less who seek more 'redistribution.'

Up to Thatcher all govts. accepted that stable societies must have redistribution and a fair tax system which allows the difference between richest/poorest NOT to be too great.

Thatcher smashed that 'orthodoxy' and from then to this day (incl. under New Labour) the gap between richest/poorest has grown to ridiculously and even dangerous levels. It continues to grow because those at the 'top' incl. bankers/financiers/h

edge fund operators/ CEOs etc are being paid 100s of times what ordinary employees get.

In the 70s, before Thatcher, it was Tory PM Heath who caused 'the three day week' by attempting to deny tge miners a fair wage for a dreadful type of job. Heath called an election and was NOT supported by most people.

When Thatcher came in, she defeated the miners who said she was trying to destroy their jobs-she did just that..and more.

Today, most workers have little 'clout' when it comes to dealing with employers hence we now live in a low wage/long working hours economy, which is precisely what MT/others of her 'persuasion' hoped for.

But we also see signs of breakdown of 'coherency' in society with an 'underclass' of people derided as 'chavs' and to be blamed/treated badly as not worthy of any decent treatment. This allows the 'heirs of MT to carry on treating thgem badly.

Thatcher WAS the starting point for all this and she created a divisiveness in society that persists where some-generally the 'better off' think she was wonderful whilst the rest off us loathe/revile her for what she did to our country.

What's this to do with BCAFC? Well there's bound to be people who have suffered at her policies/those being carried on now by the Tory-led govt, carrying on 'her legacy' who are City fans.

As a City fan myself (and one who opposed her and all she stood for) and one who opposes the idea of people carrying on her 'market forces ideas', ie sell your BCAFC ticket to the 'highest bidder' and to hell with how it affects the 'other BCAFC fan', I believe I am entitled to opppose it..here!

You say that the gap between richest and poorest is bigger than ever; what measure are you using for this. Are you suggesting that the gap between Oliver Twist and the Aristocracy in the 1880's was smaller now than the gap between the minimum wage and the fat cats? It's simply not true.

The standard of living in the UK is higher than it has ever been as evidenced by the measure of poverty including having Sky TV and One foreign holiday per year. There is no doubt that some earn too much but what do you propose is done about it? Why the focus on businessmen rather than film stars and sports stars who earn much more than the CEO's of most FTSE 100 companies?

Thatcher made correct economic decisions in getting rid of mining, privatising badly managed utilities, offering right to buy on council houses, and reducing the power of the unions. The failure was not in these things but in failing to re-train those who were affected. Failing to plan in those areas most affected so that new opprtunities would be available for those who would lose their jobs.

There is no doubt that Thatcher divides opinion but to fail to see any of the wealth creation from her policies suggests an element of bias. We are human beings, we have aspirations and Thatcher wanted to allow people to fulfill their aspirations. In many respects she succeeded but there are far too many who do not know how to make things happen for themselves and hence become victims. I would still ask you to suggest a better alternative to the one that has given us Mark Lawn and Julian Rhodes; aspirational men who have created wealth for themselves.

Victor Clayton wrote:
I think we need to look after our old and vunerable but there is a balance to be struck. this is what she said in 1987 and i find it hard to disagree with:

I think we have gone through a period when too many children and people have been given to understand "I have a problem, it is the Government's job to cope with it!" or "I have a problem, I will go and get a grant to cope with it!" "I am homeless, the Government must house me!" and so they are casting their problems on society and who is society? There is no such thing! There are individual men and women and there are families and no government can do anything except through people and people look to themselves first. It is our duty to look after ourselves and then also to help look after our neighbour and life is a reciprocal business and people have got the entitlements too much in mind without the obligations.

That makes perfect sense; except Human Nature is quick to forget what someone else has done for them and never forgets what they have done for someone else. This is where the reciprocal bit falls apart and becomes idealistic. I definitely agree that Government is too big in the UK and people are too quick to expect the Government to solve their problems. I would be happier if government stuck to law & order, education and health services. As a memer of NATO and the UN we can worry about security through our allies.

There is clearly too much of a culture of "these are my rights" but most will not ask "what are my responsibilities".

If anyone has an answer that would create a genuinely fairer society then don't be shy...

KnightMcCall wrote:

Victor Clayton wrote:
I think we need to look after our old and vunerable but there is a balance to be struck. this is what she said in 1987 and i find it hard to disagree with:

I think we have gone through a period when too many children and people have been given to understand "I have a problem, it is the Government's job to cope with it!" or "I have a problem, I will go and get a grant to cope with it!" "I am homeless, the Government must house me!" and so they are casting their problems on society and who is society? There is no such thing! There are individual men and women and there are families and no government can do anything except through people and people look to themselves first. It is our duty to look after ourselves and then also to help look after our neighbour and life is a reciprocal business and people have got the entitlements too much in mind without the obligations.

That makes perfect sense; except Human Nature is quick to forget what someone else has done for them and never forgets what they have done for someone else. This is where the reciprocal bit falls apart and becomes idealistic. I definitely agree that Government is too big in the UK and people are too quick to expect the Government to solve their problems. I would be happier if government stuck to law & order, education and health services. As a memer of NATO and the UN we can worry about security through our allies.

There is clearly too much of a culture of "these are my rights" but most will not ask "what are my responsibilities".

If anyone has an answer that would create a genuinely fairer society then don't be shy...

The Germans seem to have a better way of the bosses and unions working together.

Great debate lads. Very interesting for a change.

The one point I would disagree with is the selling off of 'badly run nationalised industries'

Surely that needed more focus to make them better run and profitable for all instead of the one off sale and then the whole country pays through the nose and is at the mercy of a not so free-market as the energy/utility companies fix their prices according to shareholder reports, making their profit and our loss and even though there is a choice of utility company they do 'FIX' in agreement so they all increase wealth/profit.

What football match?

Prisoner Cell Block A wrote:
Great debate lads. Very interesting for a change. The one point I would disagree with is the selling off of 'badly run nationalised industries' Surely that needed more focus to make them better run and profitable for all instead of the one off sale and then the whole country pays through the nose and is at the mercy of a not so free-market as the energy/utility companies fix their prices according to shareholder reports, making their profit and our loss and even though there is a choice of utility company they do 'FIX' in agreement so they all increase wealth/profit. What football match?

the only utility i was dead against selling was water. it falls from heaven and should belong to the people. but did you hear the man on 5 live this morning. he was for Re privatising water but had to Concede that it was in such a mess there was no alternative. I am all for keeping things for the people but it seems to me that anything the gov/ council try to manage turns to sh*t!
For example, the Leeds bin men have an average of 8 weeks sick. How many private businesses could afford to let this go on before they went bankers?