Protesters occupy part of Bradford's Centenary Square

Bradford Telegraph and Argus: Occupy protestors in Centenary Square Occupy protestors in Centenary Square

Anti-capitalist campaigners are gathering in Bradford city centre tonight in protest against banks and governments failing to prevent the global financial crisis.

They set up camp as part of Occupy Bradford, joining 900 similar movements across the world, and have said they will stay indefinitely.

Tents began to spring up from 5pm tonight and a meeting of the general assembly was held to discuss how to co-ordinate the protest over the next few days.

Police officers have also visited Centenary Square to speak to the protesters.

The Bradford protest follows other high-profile protests of hundreds of people outside St Paul’s Cathedral and Wall Street in New York.

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says...

  • Score: 0

7:46pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

7:54pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Againstcuts says...

Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99% Againstcuts
  • Score: 0

8:05pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
There are other ways of making a stand, which I strongly AGREE in, but having a bunch of unemployed, cap in hand benefit scroungers pitching tents outside the Town Hall, on a Friday night, when the people who the protest is aimed at are at home sipping £30 a bottle whiskey and patting themselves on the back and wont actually be there for another two days a bit laughable!
[quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]There are other ways of making a stand, which I strongly AGREE in, but having a bunch of unemployed, cap in hand benefit scroungers pitching tents outside the Town Hall, on a Friday night, when the people who the protest is aimed at are at home sipping £30 a bottle whiskey and patting themselves on the back and wont actually be there for another two days a bit laughable! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

8:09pm Fri 28 Oct 11

jordashe says...

Tenting out overnight in the center of Bradford?...there either very brave or very stupid, and im not talking about the weather.
Tenting out overnight in the center of Bradford?...there either very brave or very stupid, and im not talking about the weather. jordashe
  • Score: 0

8:33pm Fri 28 Oct 11

sam-tyler says...

They'll be lucky if they last a week, without having their tents & possessions nicked. Will they stay around when the fountains are being tested I wonder? ;-)
They'll be lucky if they last a week, without having their tents & possessions nicked. Will they stay around when the fountains are being tested I wonder? ;-) sam-tyler
  • Score: 0

8:39pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mike Strutter says...

Yet they will all walk around with their eyes closed whilst we get screwed left, right & centre by unelected Eurocrats !!!!
Yet they will all walk around with their eyes closed whilst we get screwed left, right & centre by unelected Eurocrats !!!! Mike Strutter
  • Score: 0

8:40pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mike Strutter says...

So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't. Mike Strutter
  • Score: 0

8:41pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

sam-tyler wrote:
They'll be lucky if they last a week, without having their tents & possessions nicked. Will they stay around when the fountains are being tested I wonder? ;-)
No, what will happen is there will be a police presence, probably of some considerable size, protecting them, their possessions and the site they're on, which the bill for WONT be paid by this lot, but people like me! You see, that's what we all need, MORE EXPENDITURE!!!
[quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: They'll be lucky if they last a week, without having their tents & possessions nicked. Will they stay around when the fountains are being tested I wonder? ;-)[/p][/quote]No, what will happen is there will be a police presence, probably of some considerable size, protecting them, their possessions and the site they're on, which the bill for WONT be paid by this lot, but people like me! You see, that's what we all need, MORE EXPENDITURE!!! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

8:45pm Fri 28 Oct 11

wasteofmoney says...

There won't be a Police presence. Once the local dossers that hang round the square start to harrass or should I say 'support' them they'll soon shift their tents....not quite the same impact in Bradford as camping outside St Paul's in London!!
However I agree with the overall prinicple of the main protest.
There won't be a Police presence. Once the local dossers that hang round the square start to harrass or should I say 'support' them they'll soon shift their tents....not quite the same impact in Bradford as camping outside St Paul's in London!! However I agree with the overall prinicple of the main protest. wasteofmoney
  • Score: 0

8:55pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

8:56pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
They'll be lucky if they last a week, without having their tents & possessions nicked. Will they stay around when the fountains are being tested I wonder? ;-)
No, what will happen is there will be a police presence, probably of some considerable size, protecting them, their possessions and the site they're on, which the bill for WONT be paid by this lot, but people like me! You see, that's what we all need, MORE EXPENDITURE!!!
"people like me" blah blah, boo hoo. You really are a selfish tw@t aren't you?
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: They'll be lucky if they last a week, without having their tents & possessions nicked. Will they stay around when the fountains are being tested I wonder? ;-)[/p][/quote]No, what will happen is there will be a police presence, probably of some considerable size, protecting them, their possessions and the site they're on, which the bill for WONT be paid by this lot, but people like me! You see, that's what we all need, MORE EXPENDITURE!!![/p][/quote]"people like me" blah blah, boo hoo. You really are a selfish tw@t aren't you? Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

9:05pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

WE ARE THE 99%
WE ARE THE 99% Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

9:06pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
Sorry, but since when am I what's wrong with this country, I KEEP IT GOING ya brainless twerp! Unlike this lot, the taxes that I pay, in full, on time, every month, help pay for this lot to do this sort of pointless, empty attempt at stopping capitalism. And as for protesting on MY BEHALF! Get real, they, as well as you, are just p****d off that your "sitting on your a**e doing sod all" bonus checks might be stopped! You are what's wrong with this country, you and your constant attempt at bleeding it dry!
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.[/p][/quote]Sorry, but since when am I what's wrong with this country, I KEEP IT GOING ya brainless twerp! Unlike this lot, the taxes that I pay, in full, on time, every month, help pay for this lot to do this sort of pointless, empty attempt at stopping capitalism. And as for protesting on MY BEHALF! Get real, they, as well as you, are just p****d off that your "sitting on your a**e doing sod all" bonus checks might be stopped! You are what's wrong with this country, you and your constant attempt at bleeding it dry! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

9:12pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Avro says...

They should have planted themselves on the Westfield land
They should have planted themselves on the Westfield land Avro
  • Score: 0

9:14pm Fri 28 Oct 11

yangy8 says...

Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes.
do you really believe any of this will work?
governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!!
[quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes. do you really believe any of this will work? governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!! yangy8
  • Score: 0

9:21pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mike Strutter says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !!
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.[/p][/quote]An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !! Mike Strutter
  • Score: 0

9:22pm Fri 28 Oct 11

eebygum says...

One Law for the rich another for the poor good on em for making a stand. Would join em if it weren't for my arthritus. Bankers got away with loosing millions of investors money, they stole peoples money from their account on the pretext that they were fair charges the PPI scandle. MP's cheat the expenses allowance only 4 got done but many more were guilty the main one's who went to gaol were Labour Mp's. The rich constantly get away with prosecution where as the poor go to prison. The guy from The Stone Roses let off when doing 105 mph unbelievable.
One Law for the rich another for the poor good on em for making a stand. Would join em if it weren't for my arthritus. Bankers got away with loosing millions of investors money, they stole peoples money from their account on the pretext that they were fair charges the PPI scandle. MP's cheat the expenses allowance only 4 got done but many more were guilty the main one's who went to gaol were Labour Mp's. The rich constantly get away with prosecution where as the poor go to prison. The guy from The Stone Roses let off when doing 105 mph unbelievable. eebygum
  • Score: 0

9:25pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Just popped outside to let the cat in, wow, it's a chuffing cold one tonight, better turn the heating up I think tee hee!
Just popped outside to let the cat in, wow, it's a chuffing cold one tonight, better turn the heating up I think tee hee! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

9:26pm Fri 28 Oct 11

mad matt says...

Ah well, I suppose it will provide some entertainment for all the assylum seekers and foreign nationals that normally seem to inhabit the square.
Ah well, I suppose it will provide some entertainment for all the assylum seekers and foreign nationals that normally seem to inhabit the square. mad matt
  • Score: 0

9:31pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
Just popped outside to let the cat in, wow, it's a chuffing cold one tonight, better turn the heating up I think tee hee!
You do that matey, and think about the huge profits the power companies are making out of YOU! D1ickhead.
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Just popped outside to let the cat in, wow, it's a chuffing cold one tonight, better turn the heating up I think tee hee![/p][/quote]You do that matey, and think about the huge profits the power companies are making out of YOU! D1ickhead. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

9:33pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Mike Strutter wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP


ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !!
whilst tapping-in to a FREE wi-fi signal.
[quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.[/p][/quote]An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !![/p][/quote]whilst tapping-in to a FREE wi-fi signal. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

9:33pm Fri 28 Oct 11

justjustice says...

Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
[quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?! justjustice
  • Score: 0

9:34pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Just popped outside to let the cat in, wow, it's a chuffing cold one tonight, better turn the heating up I think tee hee!
You do that matey, and think about the huge profits the power companies are making out of YOU! D1ickhead.
And may I ask how you keep your "palace" warm and cozy?
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Just popped outside to let the cat in, wow, it's a chuffing cold one tonight, better turn the heating up I think tee hee![/p][/quote]You do that matey, and think about the huge profits the power companies are making out of YOU! D1ickhead.[/p][/quote]And may I ask how you keep your "palace" warm and cozy? SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

9:34pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mekon says...

"The Bradford protest follows other high-profile protests of hundreds of people outside St Paul’s Cathedral and Wall Street in New York. "

"Other"...lol

What exactly is this going to do. Anti capitalism? Can someone tell me a system that can successfully replace it? Socialism maybe..yeah that's worked in the past hasn't it.

Im all up for equality, but how the hell is a few tents in Bradford or London going to persuade directors to share more of their company (that they maybe started and worked extremely hard to build up) wealth?

The only way to solve equality is to look at the tax models of countries like Sweden...and the only way to do that is to DIRECTLY target the government.
"The Bradford protest follows other high-profile protests of hundreds of people outside St Paul’s Cathedral and Wall Street in New York. " "Other"...lol What exactly is this going to do. Anti capitalism? Can someone tell me a system that can successfully replace it? Socialism maybe..yeah that's worked in the past hasn't it. Im all up for equality, but how the hell is a few tents in Bradford or London going to persuade directors to share more of their company (that they maybe started and worked extremely hard to build up) wealth? The only way to solve equality is to look at the tax models of countries like Sweden...and the only way to do that is to DIRECTLY target the government. Mekon
  • Score: 0

9:36pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

And whilst we're at it, a question for the BBC's John Humphrys:

Would YOU work for Minimum Wage, John? Yes or no?

Easy to slag people off when you're on quarter of a million a year.
And whilst we're at it, a question for the BBC's John Humphrys: Would YOU work for Minimum Wage, John? Yes or no? Easy to slag people off when you're on quarter of a million a year. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

9:36pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Mekon wrote:
"The Bradford protest follows other high-profile protests of hundreds of people outside St Paul’s Cathedral and Wall Street in New York. "

"Other"...lol

What exactly is this going to do. Anti capitalism? Can someone tell me a system that can successfully replace it? Socialism maybe..yeah that's worked in the past hasn't it.

Im all up for equality, but how the hell is a few tents in Bradford or London going to persuade directors to share more of their company (that they maybe started and worked extremely hard to build up) wealth?

The only way to solve equality is to look at the tax models of countries like Sweden...and the only way to do that is to DIRECTLY target the government.
At last, someone who HAS a brain, you could learn much from this one Aunty!
[quote][p][bold]Mekon[/bold] wrote: "The Bradford protest follows other high-profile protests of hundreds of people outside St Paul’s Cathedral and Wall Street in New York. " "Other"...lol What exactly is this going to do. Anti capitalism? Can someone tell me a system that can successfully replace it? Socialism maybe..yeah that's worked in the past hasn't it. Im all up for equality, but how the hell is a few tents in Bradford or London going to persuade directors to share more of their company (that they maybe started and worked extremely hard to build up) wealth? The only way to solve equality is to look at the tax models of countries like Sweden...and the only way to do that is to DIRECTLY target the government.[/p][/quote]At last, someone who HAS a brain, you could learn much from this one Aunty! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

9:41pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mike Strutter says...

justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
[quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ? Mike Strutter
  • Score: 0

9:41pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Doubt there are many who dont fully understand what the protests are about, they are, however, pointless! Not one of the people they are protesting against will bat an eye lid at what they are doing. You dont fight a forrest fire with a fire blanket!
[quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Doubt there are many who dont fully understand what the protests are about, they are, however, pointless! Not one of the people they are protesting against will bat an eye lid at what they are doing. You dont fight a forrest fire with a fire blanket! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

9:41pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Mekon wrote:
"The Bradford protest follows other high-profile protests of hundreds of people outside St Paul’s Cathedral and Wall Street in New York. "

"Other"...lol

What exactly is this going to do. Anti capitalism? Can someone tell me a system that can successfully replace it? Socialism maybe..yeah that's worked in the past hasn't it.

Im all up for equality, but how the hell is a few tents in Bradford or London going to persuade directors to share more of their company (that they maybe started and worked extremely hard to build up) wealth?

The only way to solve equality is to look at the tax models of countries like Sweden...and the only way to do that is to DIRECTLY target the government.
De-centralize government, abandon the goal of economic growth, create small-scale cashless local economies utilizing local resources in a sustainable manner, use available technologies to improve people's lives instead of maximising profit. See E.F. Schumacher 'Small Is Beautiful'.
[quote][p][bold]Mekon[/bold] wrote: "The Bradford protest follows other high-profile protests of hundreds of people outside St Paul’s Cathedral and Wall Street in New York. " "Other"...lol What exactly is this going to do. Anti capitalism? Can someone tell me a system that can successfully replace it? Socialism maybe..yeah that's worked in the past hasn't it. Im all up for equality, but how the hell is a few tents in Bradford or London going to persuade directors to share more of their company (that they maybe started and worked extremely hard to build up) wealth? The only way to solve equality is to look at the tax models of countries like Sweden...and the only way to do that is to DIRECTLY target the government.[/p][/quote]De-centralize government, abandon the goal of economic growth, create small-scale cashless local economies utilizing local resources in a sustainable manner, use available technologies to improve people's lives instead of maximising profit. See E.F. Schumacher 'Small Is Beautiful'. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

9:43pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from!
[quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from! Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

9:44pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP



ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !!
whilst tapping-in to a FREE wi-fi signal.
Keep digging twerp!
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.[/p][/quote]An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !![/p][/quote]whilst tapping-in to a FREE wi-fi signal.[/p][/quote]Keep digging twerp! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

9:47pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP




ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !!
whilst tapping-in to a FREE wi-fi signal.
Keep digging twerp!
Dig for Victory!
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.[/p][/quote]An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !![/p][/quote]whilst tapping-in to a FREE wi-fi signal.[/p][/quote]Keep digging twerp![/p][/quote]Dig for Victory! Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

9:48pm Fri 28 Oct 11

sam-tyler says...

I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser.
.
Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we?
.
Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)
I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser. . Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we? . Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :) sam-tyler
  • Score: 0

9:54pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP





ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !!
whilst tapping-in to a FREE wi-fi signal.
Keep digging twerp!
Dig for Victory!
Oh please stop, that's hilarious.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.[/p][/quote]An anti capitalist using their smartphone in their tent, well I never !![/p][/quote]whilst tapping-in to a FREE wi-fi signal.[/p][/quote]Keep digging twerp![/p][/quote]Dig for Victory![/p][/quote]Oh please stop, that's hilarious. SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

9:55pm Fri 28 Oct 11

justjustice says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from!
First of all "sunshine", Labour obviously didnt want to tell the public that they were spending like there was no tomorrow.

And havent you been watching the news Aunty Capitalist? The euro is in crisis, and the government has had to make drastic cuts in order to try and balance the books thanks to Labour's insane spending!

Also the only way for us to complain about the government is to overthrow it, as we've seen it doesnt matter which party is in charge, they simply do not do what the people want, in fact they wont even listen! The first e-petition reached the required level and the firs thing they announced was that maybe they should increase the number of signatures!
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from![/p][/quote]First of all "sunshine", Labour obviously didnt want to tell the public that they were spending like there was no tomorrow. And havent you been watching the news Aunty Capitalist? The euro is in crisis, and the government has had to make drastic cuts in order to try and balance the books thanks to Labour's insane spending! Also the only way for us to complain about the government is to overthrow it, as we've seen it doesnt matter which party is in charge, they simply do not do what the people want, in fact they wont even listen! The first e-petition reached the required level and the firs thing they announced was that maybe they should increase the number of signatures! justjustice
  • Score: 0

10:06pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ?????

Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????

The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.
[quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed. Reality001
  • Score: 0

10:11pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

yangy8 wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes.
do you really believe any of this will work?
governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!!
Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher.

Protesting does work !!
[quote][p][bold]yangy8[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes. do you really believe any of this will work? governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!![/p][/quote]Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher. Protesting does work !! Reality001
  • Score: 0

10:11pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Reality001 wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ?????

Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????

The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.
I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!!
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.[/p][/quote]I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

10:13pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
Reality001 wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ?????

Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????

The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.
I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!!
I notice you didn't disagree with my post. Anyway I'm not one of the protestors nor did I say I was.

In the comfort of my home in Bradford
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.[/p][/quote]I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!![/p][/quote]I notice you didn't disagree with my post. Anyway I'm not one of the protestors nor did I say I was. In the comfort of my home in Bradford Reality001
  • Score: 0

10:16pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Reality001 wrote:
yangy8 wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes.
do you really believe any of this will work?
governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!!
Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher.

Protesting does work !!
Oh yeah, that's right, sorry I forgot about that, and then the government totally scrapped all plans for a nationwide tax on households to pay for.......hang on.........oh yeah.......THEY JUST RENAMED IT!
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]yangy8[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes. do you really believe any of this will work? governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!![/p][/quote]Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher. Protesting does work !![/p][/quote]Oh yeah, that's right, sorry I forgot about that, and then the government totally scrapped all plans for a nationwide tax on households to pay for.......hang on.........oh yeah.......THEY JUST RENAMED IT! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

10:20pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mike Strutter says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from!
YOU WHAT ??????????

Please tell me you are pulling my leg ?
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from![/p][/quote]YOU WHAT ?????????? Please tell me you are pulling my leg ? Mike Strutter
  • Score: 0

10:23pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
Reality001 wrote:
yangy8 wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes.
do you really believe any of this will work?
governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!!
Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher.

Protesting does work !!
Oh yeah, that's right, sorry I forgot about that, and then the government totally scrapped all plans for a nationwide tax on households to pay for.......hang on.........oh yeah.......THEY JUST RENAMED IT!
The first thing the Conservatives did when in power was raising VAT to 20%. Despite telling everyone they had no plans.

The reduces the amount of money people can spend, which means less money taken through shops etc. The double dip recession.

The Deficit was down to the amount of money the Government had to lend to banks to prop them up so people like you had access to your money in the bank.

Therefore we don't need cuts has savage as we are seeing, we simply need the banks to start paying it back instead of handing it to their Directors.
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]yangy8[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes. do you really believe any of this will work? governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!![/p][/quote]Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher. Protesting does work !![/p][/quote]Oh yeah, that's right, sorry I forgot about that, and then the government totally scrapped all plans for a nationwide tax on households to pay for.......hang on.........oh yeah.......THEY JUST RENAMED IT![/p][/quote]The first thing the Conservatives did when in power was raising VAT to 20%. Despite telling everyone they had no plans. The reduces the amount of money people can spend, which means less money taken through shops etc. The double dip recession. The Deficit was down to the amount of money the Government had to lend to banks to prop them up so people like you had access to your money in the bank. Therefore we don't need cuts has savage as we are seeing, we simply need the banks to start paying it back instead of handing it to their Directors. Reality001
  • Score: 0

10:27pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mike Strutter says...

justjustice wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from!
First of all "sunshine", Labour obviously didnt want to tell the public that they were spending like there was no tomorrow.

And havent you been watching the news Aunty Capitalist? The euro is in crisis, and the government has had to make drastic cuts in order to try and balance the books thanks to Labour's insane spending!

Also the only way for us to complain about the government is to overthrow it, as we've seen it doesnt matter which party is in charge, they simply do not do what the people want, in fact they wont even listen! The first e-petition reached the required level and the firs thing they announced was that maybe they should increase the number of signatures!
Totally agree with regards to all parties being the same but what do you replace it with ?

The trouble with Independents is that they will all bicker and nothing would get done, a bit like the coalition.

Re the NO vote on a Euro referendum. Disgusting !! The current public view seems to be for stripping an unelected EU of their powers yet MP's are given a 3 line whip. shocking and totally undemocratic
[quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from![/p][/quote]First of all "sunshine", Labour obviously didnt want to tell the public that they were spending like there was no tomorrow. And havent you been watching the news Aunty Capitalist? The euro is in crisis, and the government has had to make drastic cuts in order to try and balance the books thanks to Labour's insane spending! Also the only way for us to complain about the government is to overthrow it, as we've seen it doesnt matter which party is in charge, they simply do not do what the people want, in fact they wont even listen! The first e-petition reached the required level and the firs thing they announced was that maybe they should increase the number of signatures![/p][/quote]Totally agree with regards to all parties being the same but what do you replace it with ? The trouble with Independents is that they will all bicker and nothing would get done, a bit like the coalition. Re the NO vote on a Euro referendum. Disgusting !! The current public view seems to be for stripping an unelected EU of their powers yet MP's are given a 3 line whip. shocking and totally undemocratic Mike Strutter
  • Score: 0

10:27pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mekon says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Mekon wrote:
"The Bradford protest follows other high-profile protests of hundreds of people outside St Paul’s Cathedral and Wall Street in New York. "

"Other"...lol

What exactly is this going to do. Anti capitalism? Can someone tell me a system that can successfully replace it? Socialism maybe..yeah that's worked in the past hasn't it.

Im all up for equality, but how the hell is a few tents in Bradford or London going to persuade directors to share more of their company (that they maybe started and worked extremely hard to build up) wealth?

The only way to solve equality is to look at the tax models of countries like Sweden...and the only way to do that is to DIRECTLY target the government.
De-centralize government, abandon the goal of economic growth, create small-scale cashless local economies utilizing local resources in a sustainable manner, use available technologies to improve people's lives instead of maximising profit. See E.F. Schumacher 'Small Is Beautiful'.
So we should return to a era where local groups of people just look after themselves? Get overrun by hordes of neighbouring groups and have children / people suffering because of local crop failures, floods etc etc.

I prefer stability for me and my family thanks.

There is nothing wrong with a central government as long as that government is accountable and changeable.

The people get the government they deserve. And at the moment the 99% are obviously relatively happy with the situation. When there is discontent among a nation it rises up..at the moment that isn't so is this country.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mekon[/bold] wrote: "The Bradford protest follows other high-profile protests of hundreds of people outside St Paul’s Cathedral and Wall Street in New York. " "Other"...lol What exactly is this going to do. Anti capitalism? Can someone tell me a system that can successfully replace it? Socialism maybe..yeah that's worked in the past hasn't it. Im all up for equality, but how the hell is a few tents in Bradford or London going to persuade directors to share more of their company (that they maybe started and worked extremely hard to build up) wealth? The only way to solve equality is to look at the tax models of countries like Sweden...and the only way to do that is to DIRECTLY target the government.[/p][/quote]De-centralize government, abandon the goal of economic growth, create small-scale cashless local economies utilizing local resources in a sustainable manner, use available technologies to improve people's lives instead of maximising profit. See E.F. Schumacher 'Small Is Beautiful'.[/p][/quote]So we should return to a era where local groups of people just look after themselves? Get overrun by hordes of neighbouring groups and have children / people suffering because of local crop failures, floods etc etc. I prefer stability for me and my family thanks. There is nothing wrong with a central government as long as that government is accountable and changeable. The people get the government they deserve. And at the moment the 99% are obviously relatively happy with the situation. When there is discontent among a nation it rises up..at the moment that isn't so is this country. Mekon
  • Score: 0

10:28pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

Mike Strutter wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from!
YOU WHAT ??????????

Please tell me you are pulling my leg ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ?????

Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????
[quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from![/p][/quote]YOU WHAT ?????????? Please tell me you are pulling my leg ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? Reality001
  • Score: 0

10:28pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Reality001 wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Reality001 wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ?????

Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????

The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.
I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!!
I notice you didn't disagree with my post. Anyway I'm not one of the protestors nor did I say I was.

In the comfort of my home in Bradford
I dont dissagree with your post, not entirely anyway, the collapse of the Lehman Bros is only a small portion of the spark that ignited this recession. I dont actually disagree with the root of the protest, everyone should have the right to have their voice heard if they feel strongly enough to voice it. Global greed is a massive problem, but thats just it, it's massive, Trillions of Dollors worldwide are wasted, bankers and fuel companys bonuses get higher whilst the rest of us have to scrimp and save, but, pitching a few tents outside a Town Hall does not and will not make a difference. All it does is make the cause even smaller and sadly laughable!
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.[/p][/quote]I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!![/p][/quote]I notice you didn't disagree with my post. Anyway I'm not one of the protestors nor did I say I was. In the comfort of my home in Bradford[/p][/quote]I dont dissagree with your post, not entirely anyway, the collapse of the Lehman Bros is only a small portion of the spark that ignited this recession. I dont actually disagree with the root of the protest, everyone should have the right to have their voice heard if they feel strongly enough to voice it. Global greed is a massive problem, but thats just it, it's massive, Trillions of Dollors worldwide are wasted, bankers and fuel companys bonuses get higher whilst the rest of us have to scrimp and save, but, pitching a few tents outside a Town Hall does not and will not make a difference. All it does is make the cause even smaller and sadly laughable! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

10:30pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
Reality001 wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP


ound
wrote:
Reality001 wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ?????

Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????

The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.
I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!!
I notice you didn't disagree with my post. Anyway I'm not one of the protestors nor did I say I was.

In the comfort of my home in Bradford
I dont dissagree with your post, not entirely anyway, the collapse of the Lehman Bros is only a small portion of the spark that ignited this recession. I dont actually disagree with the root of the protest, everyone should have the right to have their voice heard if they feel strongly enough to voice it. Global greed is a massive problem, but thats just it, it's massive, Trillions of Dollors worldwide are wasted, bankers and fuel companys bonuses get higher whilst the rest of us have to scrimp and save, but, pitching a few tents outside a Town Hall does not and will not make a difference. All it does is make the cause even smaller and sadly laughable!
But the fact it has got us talking about it means it has worked
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.[/p][/quote]I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!![/p][/quote]I notice you didn't disagree with my post. Anyway I'm not one of the protestors nor did I say I was. In the comfort of my home in Bradford[/p][/quote]I dont dissagree with your post, not entirely anyway, the collapse of the Lehman Bros is only a small portion of the spark that ignited this recession. I dont actually disagree with the root of the protest, everyone should have the right to have their voice heard if they feel strongly enough to voice it. Global greed is a massive problem, but thats just it, it's massive, Trillions of Dollors worldwide are wasted, bankers and fuel companys bonuses get higher whilst the rest of us have to scrimp and save, but, pitching a few tents outside a Town Hall does not and will not make a difference. All it does is make the cause even smaller and sadly laughable![/p][/quote]But the fact it has got us talking about it means it has worked Reality001
  • Score: 0

10:32pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mike Strutter says...

Well is this really a story as according to the pic there are 2 tents, somebody unrolling some sickly looking sleeping bag and something that resembles one of those tin pot marquees you see in supermarket car parks when auto windscreens are doing a freebie.

Can anyone confirm how many are really there ?
Well is this really a story as according to the pic there are 2 tents, somebody unrolling some sickly looking sleeping bag and something that resembles one of those tin pot marquees you see in supermarket car parks when auto windscreens are doing a freebie. Can anyone confirm how many are really there ? Mike Strutter
  • Score: 0

10:33pm Fri 28 Oct 11

yangy8 says...

Reality001 wrote:
yangy8 wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes.
do you really believe any of this will work?
governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!!
Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher.

Protesting does work !!
no it was not, government runs in cycles.
the dopey british people just get bored after a while and change sides.
thats why labour are out now.
eventually everyone becomes stale, short lifespans in this country.
tories will do 8 years at most.
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]yangy8[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes. do you really believe any of this will work? governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!![/p][/quote]Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher. Protesting does work !![/p][/quote]no it was not, government runs in cycles. the dopey british people just get bored after a while and change sides. thats why labour are out now. eventually everyone becomes stale, short lifespans in this country. tories will do 8 years at most. yangy8
  • Score: 0

10:37pm Fri 28 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Reality001 wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Reality001 wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP



ound
wrote:
Reality001 wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ?????

Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????

The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.
I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!!
I notice you didn't disagree with my post. Anyway I'm not one of the protestors nor did I say I was.

In the comfort of my home in Bradford
I dont dissagree with your post, not entirely anyway, the collapse of the Lehman Bros is only a small portion of the spark that ignited this recession. I dont actually disagree with the root of the protest, everyone should have the right to have their voice heard if they feel strongly enough to voice it. Global greed is a massive problem, but thats just it, it's massive, Trillions of Dollors worldwide are wasted, bankers and fuel companys bonuses get higher whilst the rest of us have to scrimp and save, but, pitching a few tents outside a Town Hall does not and will not make a difference. All it does is make the cause even smaller and sadly laughable!
But the fact it has got us talking about it means it has worked
No it hasn't, because that's all this is, TALK! The days of Emily Pankhurst are long gone!
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.[/p][/quote]I get it now, it's so simple now you've explained it, that's how you fight capitalist dictators and world greed, WITH A PHONE, A FLASK, AND A TENT!!![/p][/quote]I notice you didn't disagree with my post. Anyway I'm not one of the protestors nor did I say I was. In the comfort of my home in Bradford[/p][/quote]I dont dissagree with your post, not entirely anyway, the collapse of the Lehman Bros is only a small portion of the spark that ignited this recession. I dont actually disagree with the root of the protest, everyone should have the right to have their voice heard if they feel strongly enough to voice it. Global greed is a massive problem, but thats just it, it's massive, Trillions of Dollors worldwide are wasted, bankers and fuel companys bonuses get higher whilst the rest of us have to scrimp and save, but, pitching a few tents outside a Town Hall does not and will not make a difference. All it does is make the cause even smaller and sadly laughable![/p][/quote]But the fact it has got us talking about it means it has worked[/p][/quote]No it hasn't, because that's all this is, TALK! The days of Emily Pankhurst are long gone! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

10:41pm Fri 28 Oct 11

Mike Strutter says...

Has anyone heard of divide and conquer ?

If not look it up.
Has anyone heard of divide and conquer ? If not look it up. Mike Strutter
  • Score: 0

10:59pm Fri 28 Oct 11

angry bradfordian says...

Reality001 wrote:
yangy8 wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes.
do you really believe any of this will work?
governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!!
Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher.

Protesting does work !!
I seem to remember it being Heseltine, Lawson, Howe and co (a bunch of multi-millionaires) who caused the demise of Thatcher because they wanted European integration. An excellent example of capitalism in action!
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]yangy8[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes. do you really believe any of this will work? governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!![/p][/quote]Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher. Protesting does work !![/p][/quote]I seem to remember it being Heseltine, Lawson, Howe and co (a bunch of multi-millionaires) who caused the demise of Thatcher because they wanted European integration. An excellent example of capitalism in action! angry bradfordian
  • Score: 0

12:05am Sat 29 Oct 11

same old same old says...

Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
So you would refuse a 49% pay rise then Againstcuts?
[quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]So you would refuse a 49% pay rise then Againstcuts? same old same old
  • Score: 0

12:23am Sat 29 Oct 11

Clowny says...

I take it whoever wrote this story is for the protest, they've opted for a camera scene, lighting setup etc to sort of glorify sleeping on Centenary Square when it's freezing.
.
The story reads like it's the start of a bigger protest, no it's not, that picture is the complete protest, the two people at the front of the photo were using the Lloyds bank cash machine, hmm hyprocracy there I think.
I take it whoever wrote this story is for the protest, they've opted for a camera scene, lighting setup etc to sort of glorify sleeping on Centenary Square when it's freezing. . The story reads like it's the start of a bigger protest, no it's not, that picture is the complete protest, the two people at the front of the photo were using the Lloyds bank cash machine, hmm hyprocracy there I think. Clowny
  • Score: 0

4:38am Sat 29 Oct 11

pcbradford says...

Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"
Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good" pcbradford
  • Score: 0

5:30am Sat 29 Oct 11

Zonalslim says...

Is it just me or is anyone else fed up of tree huggin, dole dossin hippies trying to speak for the people?

Why dont you just get a job pay some taxes and hep support our failing economy (a lot of wich is caused by people like you taking and not giving).

As to if a woker irrespective of job deserves a bonus after working 90hrs a week while you sit in your hippy tent playing on your capitalist phone paying for airtime to a capitalist company with your free hand out from the dole office. NO F**KIN CONTEST.

As for the person who mentioned a cashless system GET REAL , try topping up your phone with 2 chickens and a potatoe IT WONT WORK.

Get a F**KIN job like the rest of us.

Rant over
Is it just me or is anyone else fed up of tree huggin, dole dossin hippies trying to speak for the people? Why dont you just get a job pay some taxes and hep support our failing economy (a lot of wich is caused by people like you taking and not giving). As to if a woker irrespective of job deserves a bonus after working 90hrs a week while you sit in your hippy tent playing on your capitalist phone paying for airtime to a capitalist company with your free hand out from the dole office. NO F**KIN CONTEST. As for the person who mentioned a cashless system GET REAL , try topping up your phone with 2 chickens and a potatoe IT WONT WORK. Get a F**KIN job like the rest of us. Rant over Zonalslim
  • Score: 0

6:34am Sat 29 Oct 11

Zonalslim says...

Correct me if I am wrong...


But is protesting in a tent actually classed as activley seeking employment?

(which I belive is one of the main criteria for receiving state benefit)

Also if you are going to be there for a couple of weeks or more you will not require housing benefit for those weeks.

(mind working overtime, plan brewing)

If the above are correct then could you call a couple of hundred of your friends (asuming you have some) to join you?

Between us we could solve Bradfords cash crisis by not paying un-needed benifits,

By the way

PILL'S AT THE READY

there's a comet coming.
Correct me if I am wrong... But is protesting in a tent actually classed as activley seeking employment? (which I belive is one of the main criteria for receiving state benefit) Also if you are going to be there for a couple of weeks or more you will not require housing benefit for those weeks. (mind working overtime, plan brewing) If the above are correct then could you call a couple of hundred of your friends (asuming you have some) to join you? Between us we could solve Bradfords cash crisis by not paying un-needed benifits, By the way PILL'S AT THE READY there's a comet coming. Zonalslim
  • Score: 0

8:02am Sat 29 Oct 11

ISO-PATH says...

Firstly at least someone is doing something!!!!!!!!! Secondly the welfare system is not the cause of the economic meltdown, whilst I agree that sponging and scrounging and general work shy behaviour is unacceptable let us not forget how or who put us where we are now. The amount of money and debt Governments are banging on about is simply incomprehensible to the average person, and it’s completely unfeasible to say that the average Bear be he a sponger or an excessive Credit Card user is anyway a contributor to this CRISIS. Consider the fiscal cost of the so called war Terror and I’d be willing to bet a pound to a penny that the total is major factor. Add that to the amount that the greedy banks have cost almost every Country on the Face of the earth, and I surmise that you would be far off the mark of the root cause and the Sum of the debt. Of course you could always blame it on the pittance the Government hands out in social benefits. Did you ever ask yourself why you think that the cause of the problems is the so called CHAVS? Did you work it out all by yourself, using your clever little mind? Or was it spoon fed to you by the media over a time period of about 10 years? Coincidentally around the time of the start of the war on terror!!!!! So label the protestors workshy, dope smoking, scroungers, waste of space, great unwashed, etc. etc. etc., but they aren't wrong are they? What’s it got to do with capitalism? Think about it this War is about profit and not justice.
Firstly at least someone is doing something!!!!!!!!! Secondly the welfare system is not the cause of the economic meltdown, whilst I agree that sponging and scrounging and general work shy behaviour is unacceptable let us not forget how or who put us where we are now. The amount of money and debt Governments are banging on about is simply incomprehensible to the average person, and it’s completely unfeasible to say that the average Bear be he a sponger or an excessive Credit Card user is anyway a contributor to this CRISIS. Consider the fiscal cost of the so called war Terror and I’d be willing to bet a pound to a penny that the total is major factor. Add that to the amount that the greedy banks have cost almost every Country on the Face of the earth, and I surmise that you would be far off the mark of the root cause and the Sum of the debt. Of course you could always blame it on the pittance the Government hands out in social benefits. Did you ever ask yourself why you think that the cause of the problems is the so called CHAVS? Did you work it out all by yourself, using your clever little mind? Or was it spoon fed to you by the media over a time period of about 10 years? Coincidentally around the time of the start of the war on terror!!!!! So label the protestors workshy, dope smoking, scroungers, waste of space, great unwashed, etc. etc. etc., but they aren't wrong are they? What’s it got to do with capitalism? Think about it this War is about profit and not justice. ISO-PATH
  • Score: 0

8:02am Sat 29 Oct 11

Yorkshire Lass says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
Does anyone think that a few people protesting in a tent will stop the every greedy capitalists change their attitude? I think not. This is just a waste of public money which the normal, working person can ill afford to spend for policing etc. It has been proved that the protest in London is a sham because at night they are not actually there. Also the recent riots were mainly foreign nationalists so are they taking back England or what?
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.[/p][/quote]Does anyone think that a few people protesting in a tent will stop the every greedy capitalists change their attitude? I think not. This is just a waste of public money which the normal, working person can ill afford to spend for policing etc. It has been proved that the protest in London is a sham because at night they are not actually there. Also the recent riots were mainly foreign nationalists so are they taking back England or what? Yorkshire Lass
  • Score: 0

8:05am Sat 29 Oct 11

Yorkshire Lass says...

Reality001 wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ?????

Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????

The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.
the last Labour government lined their own pockets e.g. Tony Blair and John Prescott and others. Now there is a very true example of capitalism.
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.[/p][/quote]the last Labour government lined their own pockets e.g. Tony Blair and John Prescott and others. Now there is a very true example of capitalism. Yorkshire Lass
  • Score: 0

8:05am Sat 29 Oct 11

Againstcuts says...

pcbradford wrote:
Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"
Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses!

I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'.

An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments.

A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99!
[quote][p][bold]pcbradford[/bold] wrote: Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"[/p][/quote]Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses! I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'. An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments. A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99! Againstcuts
  • Score: 0

8:08am Sat 29 Oct 11

Againstcuts says...

Should say % at the end there.
Should say % at the end there. Againstcuts
  • Score: 0

8:10am Sat 29 Oct 11

Mike Strutter says...

Againstcuts wrote:
Should say % at the end there.
By eck it's cold this morning.

How are you managing to type with those thick woolly gloves on ?

Don't tell me you have wired a heater up to the mains in Centenary sq !
[quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Should say % at the end there.[/p][/quote]By eck it's cold this morning. How are you managing to type with those thick woolly gloves on ? Don't tell me you have wired a heater up to the mains in Centenary sq ! Mike Strutter
  • Score: 0

8:23am Sat 29 Oct 11

Zonalslim says...

Mike Strutter wrote:
Againstcuts wrote: Should say % at the end there.
By eck it's cold this morning. How are you managing to type with those thick woolly gloves on ? Don't tell me you have wired a heater up to the mains in Centenary sq !
Hmmm I wonder....

How does a tree hugger keep warm?

1. Burn wood (but that would be against the ethics)

2. Use a portable gas heater or camping stove (with gas supplied by a large capitalist company)

I suppose they just live on hugs or freeze.

Just 1 sec while I turn the stat up another 15deg afterall it is a chilly morning.

Right time for a full monty me thinks.
[quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Should say % at the end there.[/p][/quote]By eck it's cold this morning. How are you managing to type with those thick woolly gloves on ? Don't tell me you have wired a heater up to the mains in Centenary sq ![/p][/quote]Hmmm I wonder.... How does a tree hugger keep warm? 1. Burn wood (but that would be against the ethics) 2. Use a portable gas heater or camping stove (with gas supplied by a large capitalist company) I suppose they just live on hugs or freeze. Just 1 sec while I turn the stat up another 15deg afterall it is a chilly morning. Right time for a full monty me thinks. Zonalslim
  • Score: 0

8:42am Sat 29 Oct 11

ISO-PATH says...

Well said against the cuts !!!!!!!!
Well said against the cuts !!!!!!!! ISO-PATH
  • Score: 0

8:53am Sat 29 Oct 11

Joedavid says...

So there will be people in Bradford center today isn't that a good thing.
So there will be people in Bradford center today isn't that a good thing. Joedavid
  • Score: 0

9:48am Sat 29 Oct 11

gaffzilla says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be. gaffzilla
  • Score: 0

11:20am Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Zonalslim wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
Againstcuts wrote: Should say % at the end there.
By eck it's cold this morning. How are you managing to type with those thick woolly gloves on ? Don't tell me you have wired a heater up to the mains in Centenary sq !
Hmmm I wonder....

How does a tree hugger keep warm?

1. Burn wood (but that would be against the ethics)

2. Use a portable gas heater or camping stove (with gas supplied by a large capitalist company)

I suppose they just live on hugs or freeze.

Just 1 sec while I turn the stat up another 15deg afterall it is a chilly morning.

Right time for a full monty me thinks.
Yes, you turn up the heating, and think of the huge profits the foreign-owned power companies are making out of YOU! Prat.
[quote][p][bold]Zonalslim[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Should say % at the end there.[/p][/quote]By eck it's cold this morning. How are you managing to type with those thick woolly gloves on ? Don't tell me you have wired a heater up to the mains in Centenary sq ![/p][/quote]Hmmm I wonder.... How does a tree hugger keep warm? 1. Burn wood (but that would be against the ethics) 2. Use a portable gas heater or camping stove (with gas supplied by a large capitalist company) I suppose they just live on hugs or freeze. Just 1 sec while I turn the stat up another 15deg afterall it is a chilly morning. Right time for a full monty me thinks.[/p][/quote]Yes, you turn up the heating, and think of the huge profits the foreign-owned power companies are making out of YOU! Prat. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:20am Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
The way this government is carrying one, no one will have work on Monday, you included. Think about it. Can you think?
[quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]The way this government is carrying one, no one will have work on Monday, you included. Think about it. Can you think? Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:23am Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

sam-tyler wrote:
I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser.
.
Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we?
.
Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)
The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.
[quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser. . Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we? . Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)[/p][/quote]The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:24am Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Reality001 wrote:
yangy8 wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes.
do you really believe any of this will work?
governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!!
Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher.

Protesting does work !!
AND NEVER FORGET THE PETERLOO MASSACRE!
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]yangy8[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]get stuffed! i work for a living, pay my taxes. do you really believe any of this will work? governments decide this stuff and they have not listened for 20 years!!![/p][/quote]Check your history - It was the sight of police horses trampling on a woman during the protests over the Poll Tax which caused the demise of Margaret Thatcher. Protesting does work !![/p][/quote]AND NEVER FORGET THE PETERLOO MASSACRE! Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:43am Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

gaffzilla wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.
Well said, I agree. He/she is obviously either very warped or not very intelligent. Probably just a pathetic troll, best ignored.
[quote][p][bold]gaffzilla[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.[/p][/quote]Well said, I agree. He/she is obviously either very warped or not very intelligent. Probably just a pathetic troll, best ignored. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:12pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

I hope they are posting guards around the tent's, as they are camped very close to the disgusting Lloyds Bar, very dodggy.
I hope they are posting guards around the tent's, as they are camped very close to the disgusting Lloyds Bar, very dodggy. NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

12:29pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Move along sheeple, nothing to see here, go back to sleep Britain, X-Factor's on TV, your Government is in control....
Move along sheeple, nothing to see here, go back to sleep Britain, X-Factor's on TV, your Government is in control.... Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:58pm Sat 29 Oct 11

BD16 says...

Againstcuts wrote:
pcbradford wrote: Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"
Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses! I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'. An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments. A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99!
No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct.
[quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]pcbradford[/bold] wrote: Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"[/p][/quote]Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses! I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'. An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments. A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99![/p][/quote]No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct. BD16
  • Score: 0

1:14pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Againstcuts says...

BD16 wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
pcbradford wrote: Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"
Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses! I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'. An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments. A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99!
No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct.
'No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct'

Sorry BD16 but the 99% doesn't refer to people supporting the worldwide anti-capitalist protests, although many, many people do byt the fact that globally 99% of people are being done over by the richest 1%. I doubt if any of the contributors to this debate are in the richest 1% you're all just dancing to their tune. Wake up folks!!
[quote][p][bold]BD16[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]pcbradford[/bold] wrote: Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"[/p][/quote]Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses! I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'. An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments. A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99![/p][/quote]No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct.[/p][/quote]'No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct' Sorry BD16 but the 99% doesn't refer to people supporting the worldwide anti-capitalist protests, although many, many people do byt the fact that globally 99% of people are being done over by the richest 1%. I doubt if any of the contributors to this debate are in the richest 1% you're all just dancing to their tune. Wake up folks!! Againstcuts
  • Score: 0

1:25pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

I'd like to be part of the richest 1%, because I'd kiss this p1ss pot of a country off, and go live in Beverly Hills C.A.
I'd like to be part of the richest 1%, because I'd kiss this p1ss pot of a country off, and go live in Beverly Hills C.A. NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

1:54pm Sat 29 Oct 11

cormon says...

Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!!
The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have -
a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority
b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity
c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one.
d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did.
As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner.
Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!! The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have - a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one. d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did. As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner. cormon
  • Score: 0

2:01pm Sat 29 Oct 11

basil fawlty says...

I support the protestors. The capitalist system is collapsing, mainly because it has not been subject to sufficient controls. Yet the response from government is to penalise the poorest by taking away their livelihoods in order to prop up the corrupt banks.
Communisn collapsed because of its corruption and excesses. The same is happening with capitalism.
I support the protestors. The capitalist system is collapsing, mainly because it has not been subject to sufficient controls. Yet the response from government is to penalise the poorest by taking away their livelihoods in order to prop up the corrupt banks. Communisn collapsed because of its corruption and excesses. The same is happening with capitalism. basil fawlty
  • Score: 0

2:08pm Sat 29 Oct 11

E.goldstein says...

It is commendable that people are prepared to get off there backsides and protest about something, instead of just whinging into their beer. This country needs more people like this.
It is commendable that people are prepared to get off there backsides and protest about something, instead of just whinging into their beer. This country needs more people like this. E.goldstein
  • Score: 0

2:08pm Sat 29 Oct 11

cormon says...

For those who believe in the lemming perspective, the Occupancy Movement has just tabled the first part of its charter - a series of policy intiatives to remove power and privilege from City institutions. I wonder how many people knew that the City had its own Police Force? How many knew that super rich Corporates have been acting as sugar daddies to ALL the major parties over the past 30 years; framing policies that affect every individual's life; harnessing over 40% of the wealth to serve 1% of the population and being treated under the law in a different manner than any of the posters on this site and 99% of the public. The real issues relating to neo-liberalism as a failed project are clear to be seen, even if knowing what to do about them are not.
For those who believe in the lemming perspective, the Occupancy Movement has just tabled the first part of its charter - a series of policy intiatives to remove power and privilege from City institutions. I wonder how many people knew that the City had its own Police Force? How many knew that super rich Corporates have been acting as sugar daddies to ALL the major parties over the past 30 years; framing policies that affect every individual's life; harnessing over 40% of the wealth to serve 1% of the population and being treated under the law in a different manner than any of the posters on this site and 99% of the public. The real issues relating to neo-liberalism as a failed project are clear to be seen, even if knowing what to do about them are not. cormon
  • Score: 0

2:20pm Sat 29 Oct 11

sam-tyler says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser.
.
Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we?
.
Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)
The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.
Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks.
I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits.
.
Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water!
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser. . Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we? . Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)[/p][/quote]The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.[/p][/quote]Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks. I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits. . Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water! sam-tyler
  • Score: 0

2:35pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
There are other ways of making a stand, which I strongly AGREE in, but having a bunch of unemployed, cap in hand benefit scroungers pitching tents outside the Town Hall, on a Friday night, when the people who the protest is aimed at are at home sipping £30 a bottle whiskey and patting themselves on the back and wont actually be there for another two days a bit laughable!
Prove it!
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]There are other ways of making a stand, which I strongly AGREE in, but having a bunch of unemployed, cap in hand benefit scroungers pitching tents outside the Town Hall, on a Friday night, when the people who the protest is aimed at are at home sipping £30 a bottle whiskey and patting themselves on the back and wont actually be there for another two days a bit laughable![/p][/quote]Prove it! NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

2:38pm Sat 29 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
gaffzilla wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP


ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.
Well said, I agree. He/she is obviously either very warped or not very intelligent. Probably just a pathetic troll, best ignored.
So why didn't you, moron?
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]gaffzilla[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.[/p][/quote]Well said, I agree. He/she is obviously either very warped or not very intelligent. Probably just a pathetic troll, best ignored.[/p][/quote]So why didn't you, moron? SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

2:40pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

cormon wrote:
Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!!
The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have -
a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority
b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity
c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one.
d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did.
As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner.
Hey Cormon: Brilliant, Fantastic and a well thought out and written comment - thumbs up, 10/10
[quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!! The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have - a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one. d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did. As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner.[/p][/quote]Hey Cormon: Brilliant, Fantastic and a well thought out and written comment - thumbs up, 10/10 NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

2:43pm Sat 29 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

gaffzilla wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.
Why?
[quote][p][bold]gaffzilla[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.[/p][/quote]Why? SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

2:47pm Sat 29 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

NCC.1701A wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%
There are other ways of making a stand, which I strongly AGREE in, but having a bunch of unemployed, cap in hand benefit scroungers pitching tents outside the Town Hall, on a Friday night, when the people who the protest is aimed at are at home sipping £30 a bottle whiskey and patting themselves on the back and wont actually be there for another two days a bit laughable!
Prove it!
I dont need to prove anything, your attempt at a p**s poor revolution is doing it for me!
[quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: Selling England by the pound just about sums it up mate. On a day when it's announced that FTSE listed company directors had an average 49% rise & Britain performa badly in a 'fairness league' of wealthy nations because of child poverty & inequality more power to the occupiers! We are the 99%[/p][/quote]There are other ways of making a stand, which I strongly AGREE in, but having a bunch of unemployed, cap in hand benefit scroungers pitching tents outside the Town Hall, on a Friday night, when the people who the protest is aimed at are at home sipping £30 a bottle whiskey and patting themselves on the back and wont actually be there for another two days a bit laughable![/p][/quote]Prove it![/p][/quote]I dont need to prove anything, your attempt at a p**s poor revolution is doing it for me! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

2:50pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

All I can say is, you must have a poor record of 'doing it' - are you with me ladies?
All I can say is, you must have a poor record of 'doing it' - are you with me ladies? NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

3:06pm Sat 29 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

NCC.1701A wrote:
All I can say is, you must have a poor record of 'doing it' - are you with me ladies?
Suggest you stick to cucumbers love!
[quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: All I can say is, you must have a poor record of 'doing it' - are you with me ladies?[/p][/quote]Suggest you stick to cucumbers love! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

3:17pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Clowny says...

NCC.1701A wrote:
I hope they are posting guards around the tent's, as they are camped very close to the disgusting Lloyds Bar, very dodggy.
A few of them have been using the cash machine, I was stood behind them last night. Total hypocrites, it's laughable really.
[quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: I hope they are posting guards around the tent's, as they are camped very close to the disgusting Lloyds Bar, very dodggy.[/p][/quote]A few of them have been using the cash machine, I was stood behind them last night. Total hypocrites, it's laughable really. Clowny
  • Score: 0

3:18pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

Yorkshire Lass wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP


ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
Does anyone think that a few people protesting in a tent will stop the every greedy capitalists change their attitude? I think not. This is just a waste of public money which the normal, working person can ill afford to spend for policing etc. It has been proved that the protest in London is a sham because at night they are not actually there. Also the recent riots were mainly foreign nationalists so are they taking back England or what?
And what planet do you live on?
[quote][p][bold]Yorkshire Lass[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.[/p][/quote]Does anyone think that a few people protesting in a tent will stop the every greedy capitalists change their attitude? I think not. This is just a waste of public money which the normal, working person can ill afford to spend for policing etc. It has been proved that the protest in London is a sham because at night they are not actually there. Also the recent riots were mainly foreign nationalists so are they taking back England or what?[/p][/quote]And what planet do you live on? NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

3:19pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Clowny says...

That's Lloyds TSB, BTW. You'd think they'd hate that even more. Apart from the fact they're work shy hypocrites.
That's Lloyds TSB, BTW. You'd think they'd hate that even more. Apart from the fact they're work shy hypocrites. Clowny
  • Score: 0

3:26pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
NCC.1701A wrote:
All I can say is, you must have a poor record of 'doing it' - are you with me ladies?
Suggest you stick to cucumbers love!
Ohhh! nice, the bigger the better, and when I squeeze it fills me with so much more that any man could!
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: All I can say is, you must have a poor record of 'doing it' - are you with me ladies?[/p][/quote]Suggest you stick to cucumbers love![/p][/quote]Ohhh! nice, the bigger the better, and when I squeeze it fills me with so much more that any man could! NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

3:29pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

Oh and yes, SIZE DOES MATTER!
Oh and yes, SIZE DOES MATTER! NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

3:36pm Sat 29 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

E.goldstein wrote:
It is commendable that people are prepared to get off there backsides and protest about something, instead of just whinging into their beer. This country needs more people like this.
People like who? People who pitch tents outside a CLOSED Town Hall, and then do NOTHING! Just sit there, doing nothing. "Nothing" is what it is, "nothing" is what the Politicians look upon it as, "Half A***d at best! Watch these wonderful pillars of society on giro day, on when they are told their money might be cut because they haven't had a job since they've left school, watch them be half a***d then!
[quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: It is commendable that people are prepared to get off there backsides and protest about something, instead of just whinging into their beer. This country needs more people like this.[/p][/quote]People like who? People who pitch tents outside a CLOSED Town Hall, and then do NOTHING! Just sit there, doing nothing. "Nothing" is what it is, "nothing" is what the Politicians look upon it as, "Half A***d at best! Watch these wonderful pillars of society on giro day, on when they are told their money might be cut because they haven't had a job since they've left school, watch them be half a***d then! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

3:38pm Sat 29 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

NCC.1701A wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
NCC.1701A wrote:
All I can say is, you must have a poor record of 'doing it' - are you with me ladies?
Suggest you stick to cucumbers love!
Ohhh! nice, the bigger the better, and when I squeeze it fills me with so much more that any man could!
Can I come and watch, I own a tent and a flask!
[quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: All I can say is, you must have a poor record of 'doing it' - are you with me ladies?[/p][/quote]Suggest you stick to cucumbers love![/p][/quote]Ohhh! nice, the bigger the better, and when I squeeze it fills me with so much more that any man could![/p][/quote]Can I come and watch, I own a tent and a flask! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

3:45pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Clowny wrote:
NCC.1701A wrote:
I hope they are posting guards around the tent's, as they are camped very close to the disgusting Lloyds Bar, very dodggy.
A few of them have been using the cash machine, I was stood behind them last night. Total hypocrites, it's laughable really.
What's so laughable about that? You can't exist outside of the system, but you can subvert it from within.
[quote][p][bold]Clowny[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: I hope they are posting guards around the tent's, as they are camped very close to the disgusting Lloyds Bar, very dodggy.[/p][/quote]A few of them have been using the cash machine, I was stood behind them last night. Total hypocrites, it's laughable really.[/p][/quote]What's so laughable about that? You can't exist outside of the system, but you can subvert it from within. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

3:47pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

sam-tyler wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser.
.
Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we?
.
Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)
The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.
Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks.
I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits.
.
Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water!
For God's sake grow up.
[quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser. . Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we? . Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)[/p][/quote]The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.[/p][/quote]Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks. I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits. . Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water![/p][/quote]For God's sake grow up. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

3:49pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
E.goldstein wrote:
It is commendable that people are prepared to get off there backsides and protest about something, instead of just whinging into their beer. This country needs more people like this.
People like who? People who pitch tents outside a CLOSED Town Hall, and then do NOTHING! Just sit there, doing nothing. "Nothing" is what it is, "nothing" is what the Politicians look upon it as, "Half A***d at best! Watch these wonderful pillars of society on giro day, on when they are told their money might be cut because they haven't had a job since they've left school, watch them be half a***d then!
Have you ever stopped to think that YOU may one day (soon) be unemployed? I'd say it's pretty inevitable. See where your inane wisecracks get you then smarty pants.
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: It is commendable that people are prepared to get off there backsides and protest about something, instead of just whinging into their beer. This country needs more people like this.[/p][/quote]People like who? People who pitch tents outside a CLOSED Town Hall, and then do NOTHING! Just sit there, doing nothing. "Nothing" is what it is, "nothing" is what the Politicians look upon it as, "Half A***d at best! Watch these wonderful pillars of society on giro day, on when they are told their money might be cut because they haven't had a job since they've left school, watch them be half a***d then![/p][/quote]Have you ever stopped to think that YOU may one day (soon) be unemployed? I'd say it's pretty inevitable. See where your inane wisecracks get you then smarty pants. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

3:53pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Some of you reactionary morons seem to be under the impression that being unemployed is a crime. The fact is, there will always be unemployment so long as we live in a Capitalist system. Capitalism itself relies upon unemployment. For Capitalism to function there must be more workers than jobs, in order to maintain the balance of power in favour of the Capitalists and not the workers. That is why we have immigration. Do you see now?
Some of you reactionary morons seem to be under the impression that being unemployed is a crime. The fact is, there will always be unemployment so long as we live in a Capitalist system. Capitalism itself relies upon unemployment. For Capitalism to function there must be more workers than jobs, in order to maintain the balance of power in favour of the Capitalists and not the workers. That is why we have immigration. Do you see now? Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

3:57pm Sat 29 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
E.goldstein wrote:
It is commendable that people are prepared to get off there backsides and protest about something, instead of just whinging into their beer. This country needs more people like this.
People like who? People who pitch tents outside a CLOSED Town Hall, and then do NOTHING! Just sit there, doing nothing. "Nothing" is what it is, "nothing" is what the Politicians look upon it as, "Half A***d at best! Watch these wonderful pillars of society on giro day, on when they are told their money might be cut because they haven't had a job since they've left school, watch them be half a***d then!
Have you ever stopped to think that YOU may one day (soon) be unemployed? I'd say it's pretty inevitable. See where your inane wisecracks get you then smarty pants.
Why is it inevitable that I will soon be unemployed, you have no idea what I do for a living or what industry i'm part of! And can you also answer a 3rd question which I asked earlier on, why are you still posting comments towards me when you have told others that I'm best ignored?
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: It is commendable that people are prepared to get off there backsides and protest about something, instead of just whinging into their beer. This country needs more people like this.[/p][/quote]People like who? People who pitch tents outside a CLOSED Town Hall, and then do NOTHING! Just sit there, doing nothing. "Nothing" is what it is, "nothing" is what the Politicians look upon it as, "Half A***d at best! Watch these wonderful pillars of society on giro day, on when they are told their money might be cut because they haven't had a job since they've left school, watch them be half a***d then![/p][/quote]Have you ever stopped to think that YOU may one day (soon) be unemployed? I'd say it's pretty inevitable. See where your inane wisecracks get you then smarty pants.[/p][/quote]Why is it inevitable that I will soon be unemployed, you have no idea what I do for a living or what industry i'm part of! And can you also answer a 3rd question which I asked earlier on, why are you still posting comments towards me when you have told others that I'm best ignored? SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

4:24pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

cormon wrote:
Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!!
The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have -
a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority
b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity
c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one.
d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did.
As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner.
I guess I must be one of your lemmings. Your gross over generalisation is an insult BTW. I'm one of the people who works to help to fund your way of life (conveniently not mentioned in your well practised diatribe ). I guess you class yourself as a Futurist? This is the section that has given itself the most compliments, so I assume this is the category that you fall into.

I'd like you to answer a few questions for me, they're not difficult.

Where do you live and what is the source of your income?
What do your parents do for a living?


What is your source of income?
[quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!! The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have - a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one. d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did. As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner.[/p][/quote]I guess I must be one of your lemmings. Your gross over generalisation is an insult BTW. I'm one of the people who works to help to fund your way of life (conveniently not mentioned in your well practised diatribe ). I guess you class yourself as a Futurist? This is the section that has given itself the most compliments, so I assume this is the category that you fall into. I'd like you to answer a few questions for me, they're not difficult. Where do you live and what is the source of your income? What do your parents do for a living? What is your source of income? Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

5:13pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

Did anyone see Question Time on BBC1 this week?
.
Ian Duncan Smith MP got off lightly again - where were all the questions about his 'Work Programme' then?
.
Oh I'm sorry the BBC were probably told to censor anything relating to the new useless Work Programme.
.
Ian Duncan Smith MP - you are the most nastiest piece of feces - anybody could ever hope to pass.
Did anyone see Question Time on BBC1 this week? . Ian Duncan Smith MP got off lightly again - where were all the questions about his 'Work Programme' then? . Oh I'm sorry the BBC were probably told to censor anything relating to the new useless Work Programme. . Ian Duncan Smith MP - you are the most nastiest piece of feces - anybody could ever hope to pass. NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

5:35pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

Ian Duncan Smith MP, you are the most confirmed hiderence to the benefits system since it was first conceived, I really hope you live long enough to experience the system you have created. i.e being sacked and having to go make a claim for JSA, nothing would make me more happy.
Ian Duncan Smith MP, you are the most confirmed hiderence to the benefits system since it was first conceived, I really hope you live long enough to experience the system you have created. i.e being sacked and having to go make a claim for JSA, nothing would make me more happy. NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

5:45pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there.
.
Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.
Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP. NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

5:47pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

NCC.1701A wrote:
Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there.
.
Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.
I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....
[quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.[/p][/quote]I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive.... Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

5:57pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
NCC.1701A wrote:
Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there.
.
Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.
I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....
What? So would you have murdered him then?
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.[/p][/quote]I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....[/p][/quote]What? So would you have murdered him then? Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

5:58pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

NCC.1701A wrote:
Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there.
.
Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.
I wouldn't worry too much about the so-called "Work Programme", it's nothing but Tory hot-air. Simply that thye are privatising the Benefits system. I have been assigned to W.P. for 3 months now but have only met my "Work Coach" once so far and nothing happened other than we sat and had a nice chat about this & that. They have no job opportunities to offer and no training whatsoever. It's a load of B.S.

And, in any case, the W.P. is doomed to failure, according to a report by the Social Market Foundation, the providers will be made bankrupt ! (ha, ha):

http://liberalconspi
racy.org/2011/08/22/
governments-work-pro
gramme-at-risk-of-co
llapse-say-experts/
[quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.[/p][/quote]I wouldn't worry too much about the so-called "Work Programme", it's nothing but Tory hot-air. Simply that thye are privatising the Benefits system. I have been assigned to W.P. for 3 months now but have only met my "Work Coach" once so far and nothing happened other than we sat and had a nice chat about this & that. They have no job opportunities to offer and no training whatsoever. It's a load of B.S. And, in any case, the W.P. is doomed to failure, according to a report by the Social Market Foundation, the providers will be made bankrupt ! (ha, ha): http://liberalconspi racy.org/2011/08/22/ governments-work-pro gramme-at-risk-of-co llapse-say-experts/ Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

6:00pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Oldwestbowling wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
NCC.1701A wrote:
Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there.
.
Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.
I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....
What? So would you have murdered him then?
Hopefully...and I'm not the only one to express such strong sentiments. People I know are queueing up to kill the Tory b'stards. We need another Guy Fawkes.
[quote][p][bold]Oldwestbowling[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.[/p][/quote]I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....[/p][/quote]What? So would you have murdered him then?[/p][/quote]Hopefully...and I'm not the only one to express such strong sentiments. People I know are queueing up to kill the Tory b'stards. We need another Guy Fawkes. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

6:03pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

The Tories represent the greatest threat to our existence since WW2. The line has been drawn. They have declared war. It's us or them.
The Tories represent the greatest threat to our existence since WW2. The line has been drawn. They have declared war. It's us or them. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

6:12pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
NCC.1701A wrote:
Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there.
.
Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.
I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....
As I'm sure many more would agree with you, however I offically can't advocate violent behaviour.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.[/p][/quote]I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....[/p][/quote]As I'm sure many more would agree with you, however I offically can't advocate violent behaviour. NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

6:14pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
The Tories represent the greatest threat to our existence since WW2. The line has been drawn. They have declared war. It's us or them.
So, apart from your static protest,what do you propose to do about it?
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: The Tories represent the greatest threat to our existence since WW2. The line has been drawn. They have declared war. It's us or them.[/p][/quote]So, apart from your static protest,what do you propose to do about it? Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

6:16pm Sat 29 Oct 11

wobbley-bob says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser.
.
Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we?
.
Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)
The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.
Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks.
I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits.
.
Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water!
For God's sake grow up.
A rebel without a clue.... lol,.
Seriously mate, you want to watch the insults. You're a stranger in Bradford.....lawless Bradford at that, not many bobby men set foot in the city centre. You could be making the headlines in other ways if you're not careful. ;)
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser. . Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we? . Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)[/p][/quote]The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.[/p][/quote]Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks. I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits. . Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water![/p][/quote]For God's sake grow up.[/p][/quote]A rebel without a clue.... lol,. Seriously mate, you want to watch the insults. You're a stranger in Bradford.....lawless Bradford at that, not many bobby men set foot in the city centre. You could be making the headlines in other ways if you're not careful. ;) wobbley-bob
  • Score: 0

6:16pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

NCC.1701A wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
NCC.1701A wrote:
Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there.
.
Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.
I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....
As I'm sure many more would agree with you, however I offically can't advocate violent behaviour.
LOL I wouldn't really have murdered him (though I might have eaten him). I said to my mate that I would have thrown eggs at him, my mate said "I'd have gone for him with an iron bar". That's how people are feeling right now, so someone somewhere will do it I'm sure.
[quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.[/p][/quote]I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....[/p][/quote]As I'm sure many more would agree with you, however I offically can't advocate violent behaviour.[/p][/quote]LOL I wouldn't really have murdered him (though I might have eaten him). I said to my mate that I would have thrown eggs at him, my mate said "I'd have gone for him with an iron bar". That's how people are feeling right now, so someone somewhere will do it I'm sure. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

6:17pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Oldwestbowling wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
NCC.1701A wrote:
Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there.
.
Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.
I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....
What? So would you have murdered him then?
Hopefully...and I'm not the only one to express such strong sentiments. People I know are queueing up to kill the Tory b'stards. We need another Guy Fawkes.
You've wandered into the realms of fantasy. And we're supposed to take you seriously?
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Oldwestbowling[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.[/p][/quote]I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....[/p][/quote]What? So would you have murdered him then?[/p][/quote]Hopefully...and I'm not the only one to express such strong sentiments. People I know are queueing up to kill the Tory b'stards. We need another Guy Fawkes.[/p][/quote]You've wandered into the realms of fantasy. And we're supposed to take you seriously? Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

6:19pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

wobbley-bob wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser.
.
Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we?
.
Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)
The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.
Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks.
I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits.
.
Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water!
For God's sake grow up.
A rebel without a clue.... lol,.
Seriously mate, you want to watch the insults. You're a stranger in Bradford.....lawless Bradford at that, not many bobby men set foot in the city centre. You could be making the headlines in other ways if you're not careful. ;)
Is that a threat? and how do you know I'm not from Bradford? Bradford is where it all began, the origins of the Labour/Union movement, and still the site of the most infamous anarchist organization in Europe.
[quote][p][bold]wobbley-bob[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser. . Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we? . Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)[/p][/quote]The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.[/p][/quote]Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks. I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits. . Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water![/p][/quote]For God's sake grow up.[/p][/quote]A rebel without a clue.... lol,. Seriously mate, you want to watch the insults. You're a stranger in Bradford.....lawless Bradford at that, not many bobby men set foot in the city centre. You could be making the headlines in other ways if you're not careful. ;)[/p][/quote]Is that a threat? and how do you know I'm not from Bradford? Bradford is where it all began, the origins of the Labour/Union movement, and still the site of the most infamous anarchist organization in Europe. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

6:20pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Oldwestbowling wrote:
cormon wrote:
Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!!
The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have -
a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority
b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity
c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one.
d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did.
As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner.
I guess I must be one of your lemmings. Your gross over generalisation is an insult BTW. I'm one of the people who works to help to fund your way of life (conveniently not mentioned in your well practised diatribe ). I guess you class yourself as a Futurist? This is the section that has given itself the most compliments, so I assume this is the category that you fall into.

I'd like you to answer a few questions for me, they're not difficult.

Where do you live and what is the source of your income?
What do your parents do for a living?


What is your source of income?
Has Cormon gone home for his tea?
[quote][p][bold]Oldwestbowling[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!! The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have - a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one. d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did. As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner.[/p][/quote]I guess I must be one of your lemmings. Your gross over generalisation is an insult BTW. I'm one of the people who works to help to fund your way of life (conveniently not mentioned in your well practised diatribe ). I guess you class yourself as a Futurist? This is the section that has given itself the most compliments, so I assume this is the category that you fall into. I'd like you to answer a few questions for me, they're not difficult. Where do you live and what is the source of your income? What do your parents do for a living? What is your source of income?[/p][/quote]Has Cormon gone home for his tea? Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

6:21pm Sat 29 Oct 11

NCC.1701A says...

All I will say is if anyone throughout England,Scotland,Wal
es and Northern Ireland should happen to see Baldy on one of their Work Programmes, be sure to thank the whole of the United Kingdom for his disgusting idea of the Work Programme aproppriatley - you guy's and gal's know what I mean.
All I will say is if anyone throughout England,Scotland,Wal es and Northern Ireland should happen to see Baldy on one of their Work Programmes, be sure to thank the whole of the United Kingdom for his disgusting idea of the Work Programme aproppriatley - you guy's and gal's know what I mean. NCC.1701A
  • Score: 0

6:31pm Sat 29 Oct 11

ISO-PATH says...

I have visited the town for the first time in years. It is a very small protest. It’s almost laughable, but the Spark is there. It could be a catalyst, LAUGH at them all you want but in the end they are right. This thread proves people care and have opinions. Some good points have been raised here over the last few days. For example why are our Governments allowing energy companies to rip us off? Or why is any Government? It might take 100 years but Governments will yield eventually. One thing is for certain they won’t if we don’t stand up to them or mock those who do.
I have visited the town for the first time in years. It is a very small protest. It’s almost laughable, but the Spark is there. It could be a catalyst, LAUGH at them all you want but in the end they are right. This thread proves people care and have opinions. Some good points have been raised here over the last few days. For example why are our Governments allowing energy companies to rip us off? Or why is any Government? It might take 100 years but Governments will yield eventually. One thing is for certain they won’t if we don’t stand up to them or mock those who do. ISO-PATH
  • Score: 0

6:31pm Sat 29 Oct 11

wobbley-bob says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
wobbley-bob wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser.
.
Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we?
.
Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)
The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.
Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks.
I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits.
.
Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water!
For God's sake grow up.
A rebel without a clue.... lol,.
Seriously mate, you want to watch the insults. You're a stranger in Bradford.....lawless Bradford at that, not many bobby men set foot in the city centre. You could be making the headlines in other ways if you're not careful. ;)
Is that a threat? and how do you know I'm not from Bradford? Bradford is where it all began, the origins of the Labour/Union movement, and still the site of the most infamous anarchist organization in Europe.
No, not a threat from me, but like I said, be careful, Bradford really is lawless these days.
Oh, it sticks out like a burka in a snow storm that you're not a BD native, as I'm sure we'd have had the pleasure of your ramblings before now. . :)
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]wobbley-bob[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: I wonder if Rolandsmoke will be joining them?...He seems to be a bit of a dosser. . Hey, Tent boy..... Keep an eye out for the Good Lads driving their cars across the square. Wouldn't want your scruffy dreads getting caught up in their wheels would we? . Erm, that could be quite amusing actually. :)[/p][/quote]The level of intelligence of *some* comments on here beggar belief. You lot are the problem. WAKE UP.[/p][/quote]Get a job, you lazy scruffy oiks. I do hope you've all told the DWP you're 'protesting' so they can stop your job seekers & housing benefits. . Oh, & be careful what you say, I might just come down to Centenary Square, & threaten you with a bar of soap & a bucket of water![/p][/quote]For God's sake grow up.[/p][/quote]A rebel without a clue.... lol,. Seriously mate, you want to watch the insults. You're a stranger in Bradford.....lawless Bradford at that, not many bobby men set foot in the city centre. You could be making the headlines in other ways if you're not careful. ;)[/p][/quote]Is that a threat? and how do you know I'm not from Bradford? Bradford is where it all began, the origins of the Labour/Union movement, and still the site of the most infamous anarchist organization in Europe.[/p][/quote]No, not a threat from me, but like I said, be careful, Bradford really is lawless these days. Oh, it sticks out like a burka in a snow storm that you're not a BD native, as I'm sure we'd have had the pleasure of your ramblings before now. . :) wobbley-bob
  • Score: 0

7:59pm Sat 29 Oct 11

dearymeee says...

99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other.
99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other. dearymeee
  • Score: 0

8:14pm Sat 29 Oct 11

BD16 says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Oldwestbowling wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
NCC.1701A wrote: Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.
I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....
What? So would you have murdered him then?
Hopefully...and I'm not the only one to express such strong sentiments. People I know are queueing up to kill the Tory b'stards. We need another Guy Fawkes.
I thought your user name was an "amusing" play on words at first. Now I'm not so sure.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Oldwestbowling[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: Oh, and then being signed up to your own Work Programme - then you can suffer your own making, trust me, where ever you end up - god help you for bringing this down on the unemployed - you will definiately need police protection for the 2 years you are at the course integrating with the people you have sent there. . Something to think about Mr Ian Duncan Smith MP.[/p][/quote]I wish to God I'd had advanced notice about Chris Grayling visiting Bradford B.E.S.T. the other day, he wouldn't have got out alive....[/p][/quote]What? So would you have murdered him then?[/p][/quote]Hopefully...and I'm not the only one to express such strong sentiments. People I know are queueing up to kill the Tory b'stards. We need another Guy Fawkes.[/p][/quote]I thought your user name was an "amusing" play on words at first. Now I'm not so sure. BD16
  • Score: 0

8:18pm Sat 29 Oct 11

E.goldstein says...

I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not?
I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not? E.goldstein
  • Score: 0

8:18pm Sat 29 Oct 11

E.goldstein says...

I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not?
I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not? E.goldstein
  • Score: 0

9:17pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

I take it people who think people claiming benefits are scum must have been laughing their heads of at the news that terminally ill cancer patients have had their benefits cut by this Government.

Well at least the Directors of Banks wont have had to worry about their shopping bills.
I take it people who think people claiming benefits are scum must have been laughing their heads of at the news that terminally ill cancer patients have had their benefits cut by this Government. Well at least the Directors of Banks wont have had to worry about their shopping bills. Reality001
  • Score: 0

9:18pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

I take it people who think people claiming benefits are scum must have been laughing their heads of at the news that terminally ill cancer patients have had their benefits cut by this Government.

Well at least the Directors of Banks wont have had to worry about their shopping bills.
I take it people who think people claiming benefits are scum must have been laughing their heads of at the news that terminally ill cancer patients have had their benefits cut by this Government. Well at least the Directors of Banks wont have had to worry about their shopping bills. Reality001
  • Score: 0

9:50pm Sat 29 Oct 11

wobbley-bob says...

Is there an echo round here?
.
You only need to submit your drivel once.
Is there an echo round here? . You only need to submit your drivel once. wobbley-bob
  • Score: 0

10:28pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

E.goldstein wrote:
I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not?
Yes it does, but obviously not to the loonytune right wing reactionaries that feel compelled to comment on here.
[quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not?[/p][/quote]Yes it does, but obviously not to the loonytune right wing reactionaries that feel compelled to comment on here. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

10:29pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

E.goldstein wrote:
I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not?
Yes it does, but obviously not to the loonytune right wing reactionaries that feel compelled to comment on here.
[quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not?[/p][/quote]Yes it does, but obviously not to the loonytune right wing reactionaries that feel compelled to comment on here. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

10:29pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

E.goldstein wrote:
I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not?
Yes it does, but obviously not to the loonytune right wing reactionaries that feel compelled to comment on here.
[quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: I've no idea whether any of the protestors have paid jobs or not, but I don't see that makes what they are saying less, or more valid. The idea that you should be in paid employment before expressing your views in public seems curious does it not?[/p][/quote]Yes it does, but obviously not to the loonytune right wing reactionaries that feel compelled to comment on here. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

10:30pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

wobbley-bob wrote:
Is there an echo round here?
.
You only need to submit your drivel once.
It's the T&A website screwing up. As for "drivel" speak for yourself.
[quote][p][bold]wobbley-bob[/bold] wrote: Is there an echo round here? . You only need to submit your drivel once.[/p][/quote]It's the T&A website screwing up. As for "drivel" speak for yourself. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

10:32pm Sat 29 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

dearymeee wrote:
99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other.
*rolls eyes* don't you have anything valid to say? if not please stfu.
[quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: 99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other.[/p][/quote]*rolls eyes* don't you have anything valid to say? if not please stfu. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:04am Sun 30 Oct 11

dearymeee says...

Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say.

What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights.

All going great isn't it.
Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it. dearymeee
  • Score: 0

12:22am Sun 30 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
dearymeee wrote:
99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other.
*rolls eyes* don't you have anything valid to say? if not please stfu.
You still have yet to answer mine or Eastwestbowling's questions, and this is because you cant without embarressing yourself and proving to the rest of us what you are! You see Aunty "Landless Peasant" Capitalist, all you are or ever have been is a lost little soul with ideals still set in the 14th century. You openly blame others for your situation, and blame others for not digging yourself out of that situation. I am sick and tired of low life little worms like youself thinking that you have the right to a free lunch, thinking that everything must be handed to you on a silver platter whilst you wollow in the filth that you have put yourself in. You enjoy where you are, because it gives you purpose, it's the only reason why you exist. You blame me for the capitalist crisis, why, without people like me it would be a **** site worse, and a **** site worse for you! You said in an earlier post that you weren't actually at Centenery Square and that you were at home, some protester you are, cant be a***d I take it. No, much easier,safer, and warmer to protest over the internet, that "OTHERS" pay for, heating the home you reside in, that "OTHERS" pay for, eating the food, that "OTHERS" pay for. Understand one thing, when "WE" stop paying, you stop existing. No more hand outs, no more free lunch! I have said before, you will never change anything by protesting in this way, all you do is belittle the very reason why you are protesting. Do you think those idiots who dressed as Batman and scaled the walls of The Houses Of Parliament in the name of "Fathers For Justice" actually changed the face of this country's child custody system, or did they just prove the fact that the Mothers were right in the first place! You want to grow some b***s and protest to the manner that this massive situation deserves, then i'll be happy to stand side by side with you, but until then, YOU shut the **** up and crawl back under your stone!
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: 99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other.[/p][/quote]*rolls eyes* don't you have anything valid to say? if not please stfu.[/p][/quote]You still have yet to answer mine or Eastwestbowling's questions, and this is because you cant without embarressing yourself and proving to the rest of us what you are! You see Aunty "Landless Peasant" Capitalist, all you are or ever have been is a lost little soul with ideals still set in the 14th century. You openly blame others for your situation, and blame others for not digging yourself out of that situation. I am sick and tired of low life little worms like youself thinking that you have the right to a free lunch, thinking that everything must be handed to you on a silver platter whilst you wollow in the filth that you have put yourself in. You enjoy where you are, because it gives you purpose, it's the only reason why you exist. You blame me for the capitalist crisis, why, without people like me it would be a **** site worse, and a **** site worse for you! You said in an earlier post that you weren't actually at Centenery Square and that you were at home, some protester you are, cant be a***d I take it. No, much easier,safer, and warmer to protest over the internet, that "OTHERS" pay for, heating the home you reside in, that "OTHERS" pay for, eating the food, that "OTHERS" pay for. Understand one thing, when "WE" stop paying, you stop existing. No more hand outs, no more free lunch! I have said before, you will never change anything by protesting in this way, all you do is belittle the very reason why you are protesting. Do you think those idiots who dressed as Batman and scaled the walls of The Houses Of Parliament in the name of "Fathers For Justice" actually changed the face of this country's child custody system, or did they just prove the fact that the Mothers were right in the first place! You want to grow some b***s and protest to the manner that this massive situation deserves, then i'll be happy to stand side by side with you, but until then, YOU shut the **** up and crawl back under your stone! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

12:29am Sun 30 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

dearymeee wrote:
Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.
Actually prior to last May the right wing Tories have run Bradford Council for a decade.

Remember their Masterplan for Bradford. Yes it's the Tories who brought you the City Park.
[quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.[/p][/quote]Actually prior to last May the right wing Tories have run Bradford Council for a decade. Remember their Masterplan for Bradford. Yes it's the Tories who brought you the City Park. Reality001
  • Score: 0

12:35am Sun 30 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

dearymeee wrote:
Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.
Who allowed the demolition of Broadway before contracts were signed for a shopping centre.

That's right - A Tory led Bradford Council
[quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.[/p][/quote]Who allowed the demolition of Broadway before contracts were signed for a shopping centre. That's right - A Tory led Bradford Council Reality001
  • Score: 0

1:00am Sun 30 Oct 11

Reality001 says...

dearymeee wrote:
Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say.

What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights.

All going great isn't it.
Under Margaret Thatcher unemployment reached 3.6 million.

Cameron is catching up with 2.57 million with leading economists calling for a plan b.

So becareful because your job might be the next to go, and with long term unemployment set to rise, under your rules, you might not get the chance to vote Cameron back in.
[quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.[/p][/quote]Under Margaret Thatcher unemployment reached 3.6 million. Cameron is catching up with 2.57 million with leading economists calling for a plan b. So becareful because your job might be the next to go, and with long term unemployment set to rise, under your rules, you might not get the chance to vote Cameron back in. Reality001
  • Score: 0

2:28am Sun 30 Oct 11

pcbradford says...

Againstcuts wrote:
pcbradford wrote: Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"
Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses! I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'. An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments. A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99!
I agree with most of what you are saying. However you are deflecting the issue, im talking about if these people deserve their money, you are talking about unemployment. You seem to have all the problems figured out, yet no solution. What would you have them do, spread the wealth so these bankers run away to wall street or hong kong, and then as a result we cant collect their taxes. I still dont understand what all these protestors want, i know what they would like but use some common sense you and i know none of their demands will ever be met.
[quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]pcbradford[/bold] wrote: Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"[/p][/quote]Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses! I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'. An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments. A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99![/p][/quote]I agree with most of what you are saying. However you are deflecting the issue, im talking about if these people deserve their money, you are talking about unemployment. You seem to have all the problems figured out, yet no solution. What would you have them do, spread the wealth so these bankers run away to wall street or hong kong, and then as a result we cant collect their taxes. I still dont understand what all these protestors want, i know what they would like but use some common sense you and i know none of their demands will ever be met. pcbradford
  • Score: 0

7:54am Sun 30 Oct 11

E.goldstein says...

dearymeee wrote:
Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say.

What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights.

All going great isn't it.
That argument assumes that by not being in paid work you aren't contributing to society. I have 2 neighbours who've been on benefits and not lifted a finger for over 10 years. Yet they are still contributing to there own existence by growing food on an allotment, one does voluntary work in a charity shop, and they pay their taxes every time they hand over money in a shop in the form of VAT. They just happen to be called pensioners.

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with being "right wing" as you put it; part of the current mess we are in may be down to Socialism having ridden to the rescue of Capitalism in the form of bank bailouts. Had the Govt allowed the held their nerve and allowed the banks to go under then would things be worse now?

As for blaming immigrants I think that is a little tired. If any finger can be pointed in that general direction surely it should be at the emigrants who have been born in this country, cared for, educated, and protected at taxpayers' expense.....and who then leave to live in the likes of Spain and Australia. But hey that's economic migrancy and probably a subject for another day!
[quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.[/p][/quote]That argument assumes that by not being in paid work you aren't contributing to society. I have 2 neighbours who've been on benefits and not lifted a finger for over 10 years. Yet they are still contributing to there own existence by growing food on an allotment, one does voluntary work in a charity shop, and they pay their taxes every time they hand over money in a shop in the form of VAT. They just happen to be called pensioners. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with being "right wing" as you put it; part of the current mess we are in may be down to Socialism having ridden to the rescue of Capitalism in the form of bank bailouts. Had the Govt allowed the held their nerve and allowed the banks to go under then would things be worse now? As for blaming immigrants I think that is a little tired. If any finger can be pointed in that general direction surely it should be at the emigrants who have been born in this country, cared for, educated, and protected at taxpayers' expense.....and who then leave to live in the likes of Spain and Australia. But hey that's economic migrancy and probably a subject for another day! E.goldstein
  • Score: 0

8:02am Sun 30 Oct 11

john.c says...

Reality001 wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.
What about the open door policy on Immigration the Labour party brought in ? Do you think that had any effect ? Flooding the country with s**t from all over Europe and third world dumps like Pakistan,Afghanistan etc etc, all cheap votes for the labour party but why would they care, the Labour party detest the English and our culture. Gordon Brown selling all our gold off at rock bottom prices too, yeah, boom and bust of the pathetically, anti-Engliah Labour party really worked, hope all the socialist scum in their tents get attacked and beaten up by all the asylum seekers,oh the irony.......
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ???? The financial crisis was caused by capitalist greed.[/p][/quote]What about the open door policy on Immigration the Labour party brought in ? Do you think that had any effect ? Flooding the country with s**t from all over Europe and third world dumps like Pakistan,Afghanistan etc etc, all cheap votes for the labour party but why would they care, the Labour party detest the English and our culture. Gordon Brown selling all our gold off at rock bottom prices too, yeah, boom and bust of the pathetically, anti-Engliah Labour party really worked, hope all the socialist scum in their tents get attacked and beaten up by all the asylum seekers,oh the irony....... john.c
  • Score: 0

8:09am Sun 30 Oct 11

john.c says...

gaffzilla wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP ound wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.
I actually agree with him, as well as dropping below zero i hope all the asylum seekers their bleeding heart, left wing policies brought here kick the s**t out of them too, now even a lefty like you would laugh at that !!!
[quote][p][bold]gaffzilla[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.[/p][/quote]I actually agree with him, as well as dropping below zero i hope all the asylum seekers their bleeding heart, left wing policies brought here kick the s**t out of them too, now even a lefty like you would laugh at that !!! john.c
  • Score: 0

8:15am Sun 30 Oct 11

john.c says...

NCC.1701A wrote:
Oh and yes, SIZE DOES MATTER!
Probably does with you, a cucumber eh ?? Bet it's like throwing a lollipop stick up Thornton rd !!!
[quote][p][bold]NCC.1701A[/bold] wrote: Oh and yes, SIZE DOES MATTER![/p][/quote]Probably does with you, a cucumber eh ?? Bet it's like throwing a lollipop stick up Thornton rd !!! john.c
  • Score: 0

8:22am Sun 30 Oct 11

john.c says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
The Tories represent the greatest threat to our existence since WW2. The line has been drawn. They have declared war. It's us or them.
Don't include me in your 'us', i'll be too busy fighting Islam in all its forms, the actual real threat to the British way of life, you left-wing scum think that Islam will let you protest feely or allow same sex marriages ? You actually think they will side with you ? Pathetic, socialist p***k.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: The Tories represent the greatest threat to our existence since WW2. The line has been drawn. They have declared war. It's us or them.[/p][/quote]Don't include me in your 'us', i'll be too busy fighting Islam in all its forms, the actual real threat to the British way of life, you left-wing scum think that Islam will let you protest feely or allow same sex marriages ? You actually think they will side with you ? Pathetic, socialist p***k. john.c
  • Score: 0

8:25am Sun 30 Oct 11

dearymeee says...

Well obviously a pensioner isn't the same as a benefit scrounger. They have paid into the system all their lives and deserve help when they can no longer earn. My point is that if you've been out of work for over 6 months, when you are clearly fit and able, then you shouldn't be entitled to benefits or even a vote. We have too many people who think benefits are a way of live. There are people coming to this country with the sole purpose of defrauding our welfare system. This has to stop, we simply can't afford it.

If you think the Tories are Right Wing then you have an awful lot to learn. All the leading parties have principally been the same for as long as I can remember. There is one reason alone that no party can come out and issue a strong stance toward immigrants and the long term unemployed...and that is because they can vote too. It needs amending.

And no, I don't need to worry about my job in the slightest thanks. I have never been unemployed and I never will be...because I WANT to work and I'm prepared to do any job if I was ever desperate.
Well obviously a pensioner isn't the same as a benefit scrounger. They have paid into the system all their lives and deserve help when they can no longer earn. My point is that if you've been out of work for over 6 months, when you are clearly fit and able, then you shouldn't be entitled to benefits or even a vote. We have too many people who think benefits are a way of live. There are people coming to this country with the sole purpose of defrauding our welfare system. This has to stop, we simply can't afford it. If you think the Tories are Right Wing then you have an awful lot to learn. All the leading parties have principally been the same for as long as I can remember. There is one reason alone that no party can come out and issue a strong stance toward immigrants and the long term unemployed...and that is because they can vote too. It needs amending. And no, I don't need to worry about my job in the slightest thanks. I have never been unemployed and I never will be...because I WANT to work and I'm prepared to do any job if I was ever desperate. dearymeee
  • Score: 0

8:33am Sun 30 Oct 11

dearymeee says...

And John C above is absolutely right, if we're getting onto liberals and their open door policy. They protest and defend the most oppressive, extreme, violent and disgusting religion on the planet. How can you be so liberal as to tolerate a people who's belief is that you should convert to their way of life or be killed?!

Madness
And John C above is absolutely right, if we're getting onto liberals and their open door policy. They protest and defend the most oppressive, extreme, violent and disgusting religion on the planet. How can you be so liberal as to tolerate a people who's belief is that you should convert to their way of life or be killed?! Madness dearymeee
  • Score: 0

9:18am Sun 30 Oct 11

Yorkshire Lass says...

Reality001 wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
justjustice wrote:
Mike Strutter wrote:
So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ?

Oh silly me, of course they haven't.
Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they.

Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job!

So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?!
Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question.

Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?
erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from!
YOU WHAT ??????????

Please tell me you are pulling my leg ?
So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ?????

Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????
Some of you people writing on here must have a short memory. The last Labour Government of course increased the police numbers, more hospitals, more schools, etc, to accommodate all the immigrants that they allowed into this Country. A lot of these same immigrants are not earning nor paying taxes, making a further strain of the hard working classes. Do you remember them hard working people who are probably paying you as well to do your so called "protesting" which nobody really cares about. So get to work, and pay some taxes to help pay off the debt that we are in, like the rest of us!
[quote][p][bold]Reality001[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]justjustice[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mike Strutter[/bold] wrote: So if they are planning to stay indefinitely then I assume they don't have work on Monday ? Oh silly me, of course they haven't.[/p][/quote]Someone just doesnt get what these protests are about do they. Part of the protest is that yes they are unemployed, thanks to the 1% making risky decisions and ruining the country resulting in so many losing their jobs; whilst the government uses the taxes they paid to bail the banks out whilst letting them run under; whilst the same bankers who ruining the country give themselves record breaking bonuses for doing such a bang up job! So ask yourself, are you defending the bankers, or would you rather see people stand up for change?![/p][/quote]Yes I do get it sunshine but please do the honour of answering me one question. Why weren't these protests happening when Labour were busy bankrupting the country and turning a blind eye to the bankers activities ?[/p][/quote]erm..I don't think Labour were "bankrupting the country", don't know where you get that one from![/p][/quote]YOU WHAT ?????????? Please tell me you are pulling my leg ?[/p][/quote]So are you really suggesting that the Labour Party investing in more police, better NHS and education caused Lehman Brothers in America to go bankrupt which caused the global banking crisis ????? Did having more ambulances cause Northern Rock to go bust ????[/p][/quote]Some of you people writing on here must have a short memory. The last Labour Government of course increased the police numbers, more hospitals, more schools, etc, to accommodate all the immigrants that they allowed into this Country. A lot of these same immigrants are not earning nor paying taxes, making a further strain of the hard working classes. Do you remember them hard working people who are probably paying you as well to do your so called "protesting" which nobody really cares about. So get to work, and pay some taxes to help pay off the debt that we are in, like the rest of us! Yorkshire Lass
  • Score: 0

9:26am Sun 30 Oct 11

Yorkshire Lass says...

Againstcuts wrote:
BD16 wrote:
Againstcuts wrote:
pcbradford wrote: Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"
Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses! I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'. An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments. A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99!
No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct.
'No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct'

Sorry BD16 but the 99% doesn't refer to people supporting the worldwide anti-capitalist protests, although many, many people do byt the fact that globally 99% of people are being done over by the richest 1%. I doubt if any of the contributors to this debate are in the richest 1% you're all just dancing to their tune. Wake up folks!!
sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.
[quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BD16[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Againstcuts[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]pcbradford[/bold] wrote: Most of the 49% payrise is actually from bonuses, why do you all think they get big bonuses, its because they earn alot of money for their respective companies, they're working just like the rest of us, i think if they work hard then they deserve it, and perhaps its time for the rest of us to get more greedy, "Greed is Good"[/p][/quote]Just like the Royal Bank of Scotland lost 950 million last year paid out a billion in bonuses! I wonder how much of the 'profits' in the FTSE companies are made from cutting costs, reducing wages, & employing children somewhere in the world. So someone somewhere is paying for these 'profits'. An interesting local fact - nationally unemployment went up 8% last year (September -September) & over 15% in the Bradford district. I wish some of the contributors would try & think a bit beforw making their offensive & often racist comments. A few tents in Bradford might not seem much but it is part of people accross the world saying our current system is unjust & unfair. Everybody should have access to food, water, housing, education & health care. The right to make a contribution for the common good, have political, cultural & religious freedoms respected & get a bit of fun out of life! We have the technology to do this & should concentrate on this rather than wars & making a tiny elite ever richer. Currently for most people, even those in the West in relatively well paid jobs live a precarious existence. Most of us are only a couple of pay checks away from homelessness. So stop hating & join in - we are the 99![/p][/quote]No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct.[/p][/quote]'No you are not the 99. It looks like you are the 10 if the picture at the top of the page is correct' Sorry BD16 but the 99% doesn't refer to people supporting the worldwide anti-capitalist protests, although many, many people do byt the fact that globally 99% of people are being done over by the richest 1%. I doubt if any of the contributors to this debate are in the richest 1% you're all just dancing to their tune. Wake up folks!![/p][/quote]sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye. Yorkshire Lass
  • Score: 0

9:27am Sun 30 Oct 11

Yorkshire Lass says...

sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.
sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye. Yorkshire Lass
  • Score: 0

9:30am Sun 30 Oct 11

BD16 says...

E.goldstein wrote:
dearymeee wrote: Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.
That argument assumes that by not being in paid work you aren't contributing to society. I have 2 neighbours who've been on benefits and not lifted a finger for over 10 years. Yet they are still contributing to there own existence by growing food on an allotment, one does voluntary work in a charity shop, and they pay their taxes every time they hand over money in a shop in the form of VAT. They just happen to be called pensioners. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with being "right wing" as you put it; part of the current mess we are in may be down to Socialism having ridden to the rescue of Capitalism in the form of bank bailouts. Had the Govt allowed the held their nerve and allowed the banks to go under then would things be worse now? As for blaming immigrants I think that is a little tired. If any finger can be pointed in that general direction surely it should be at the emigrants who have been born in this country, cared for, educated, and protected at taxpayers' expense.....and who then leave to live in the likes of Spain and Australia. But hey that's economic migrancy and probably a subject for another day!
I have to take issue with some of what you say.
.
"Socialism having ridden to the rescue of Capitalism in the form of bank bailouts" is a bit rich. Gordon Brown had the opportunity to reform the FSA from 1997 onwards and continually failed to do so. I agree with a lot of left wing beliefs but, being of a northern working class background, spending more than you earn is not one of them. This is what Labour did and is a major source of the debt problems we have today, along with capitalist banks.
.
Immigration. I have no problem with it as such but when it's decided by a prsons ability to get to our borders rather than what value that person can offer our country it's a seriousy flawed system.
[quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.[/p][/quote]That argument assumes that by not being in paid work you aren't contributing to society. I have 2 neighbours who've been on benefits and not lifted a finger for over 10 years. Yet they are still contributing to there own existence by growing food on an allotment, one does voluntary work in a charity shop, and they pay their taxes every time they hand over money in a shop in the form of VAT. They just happen to be called pensioners. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with being "right wing" as you put it; part of the current mess we are in may be down to Socialism having ridden to the rescue of Capitalism in the form of bank bailouts. Had the Govt allowed the held their nerve and allowed the banks to go under then would things be worse now? As for blaming immigrants I think that is a little tired. If any finger can be pointed in that general direction surely it should be at the emigrants who have been born in this country, cared for, educated, and protected at taxpayers' expense.....and who then leave to live in the likes of Spain and Australia. But hey that's economic migrancy and probably a subject for another day![/p][/quote]I have to take issue with some of what you say. . "Socialism having ridden to the rescue of Capitalism in the form of bank bailouts" is a bit rich. Gordon Brown had the opportunity to reform the FSA from 1997 onwards and continually failed to do so. I agree with a lot of left wing beliefs but, being of a northern working class background, spending more than you earn is not one of them. This is what Labour did and is a major source of the debt problems we have today, along with capitalist banks. . Immigration. I have no problem with it as such but when it's decided by a prsons ability to get to our borders rather than what value that person can offer our country it's a seriousy flawed system. BD16
  • Score: 0

10:44am Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Yorkshire Lass wrote:
sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.
It's alright, don't worry your little head, go back to sleep, X-Factor is on television, your government is in control, move along....
[quote][p][bold]Yorkshire Lass[/bold] wrote: sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.[/p][/quote]It's alright, don't worry your little head, go back to sleep, X-Factor is on television, your government is in control, move along.... Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

10:46am Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
dearymeee wrote:
99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other.
*rolls eyes* don't you have anything valid to say? if not please stfu.
You still have yet to answer mine or Eastwestbowling's questions, and this is because you cant without embarressing yourself and proving to the rest of us what you are! You see Aunty "Landless Peasant" Capitalist, all you are or ever have been is a lost little soul with ideals still set in the 14th century. You openly blame others for your situation, and blame others for not digging yourself out of that situation. I am sick and tired of low life little worms like youself thinking that you have the right to a free lunch, thinking that everything must be handed to you on a silver platter whilst you wollow in the filth that you have put yourself in. You enjoy where you are, because it gives you purpose, it's the only reason why you exist. You blame me for the capitalist crisis, why, without people like me it would be a **** site worse, and a **** site worse for you! You said in an earlier post that you weren't actually at Centenery Square and that you were at home, some protester you are, cant be a***d I take it. No, much easier,safer, and warmer to protest over the internet, that "OTHERS" pay for, heating the home you reside in, that "OTHERS" pay for, eating the food, that "OTHERS" pay for. Understand one thing, when "WE" stop paying, you stop existing. No more hand outs, no more free lunch! I have said before, you will never change anything by protesting in this way, all you do is belittle the very reason why you are protesting. Do you think those idiots who dressed as Batman and scaled the walls of The Houses Of Parliament in the name of "Fathers For Justice" actually changed the face of this country's child custody system, or did they just prove the fact that the Mothers were right in the first place! You want to grow some b***s and protest to the manner that this massive situation deserves, then i'll be happy to stand side by side with you, but until then, YOU shut the **** up and crawl back under your stone!
Yawn...
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: 99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other.[/p][/quote]*rolls eyes* don't you have anything valid to say? if not please stfu.[/p][/quote]You still have yet to answer mine or Eastwestbowling's questions, and this is because you cant without embarressing yourself and proving to the rest of us what you are! You see Aunty "Landless Peasant" Capitalist, all you are or ever have been is a lost little soul with ideals still set in the 14th century. You openly blame others for your situation, and blame others for not digging yourself out of that situation. I am sick and tired of low life little worms like youself thinking that you have the right to a free lunch, thinking that everything must be handed to you on a silver platter whilst you wollow in the filth that you have put yourself in. You enjoy where you are, because it gives you purpose, it's the only reason why you exist. You blame me for the capitalist crisis, why, without people like me it would be a **** site worse, and a **** site worse for you! You said in an earlier post that you weren't actually at Centenery Square and that you were at home, some protester you are, cant be a***d I take it. No, much easier,safer, and warmer to protest over the internet, that "OTHERS" pay for, heating the home you reside in, that "OTHERS" pay for, eating the food, that "OTHERS" pay for. Understand one thing, when "WE" stop paying, you stop existing. No more hand outs, no more free lunch! I have said before, you will never change anything by protesting in this way, all you do is belittle the very reason why you are protesting. Do you think those idiots who dressed as Batman and scaled the walls of The Houses Of Parliament in the name of "Fathers For Justice" actually changed the face of this country's child custody system, or did they just prove the fact that the Mothers were right in the first place! You want to grow some b***s and protest to the manner that this massive situation deserves, then i'll be happy to stand side by side with you, but until then, YOU shut the **** up and crawl back under your stone![/p][/quote]Yawn... Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

10:47am Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

dearymeee wrote:
Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say.

What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights.

All going great isn't it.
There is no point in voting in any case. Ever heard of the Hegelian Dialectic? Democracy is a sham.
[quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.[/p][/quote]There is no point in voting in any case. Ever heard of the Hegelian Dialectic? Democracy is a sham. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

10:59am Sun 30 Oct 11

E.goldstein says...

Dear BD16,

I hadn't intended my comments as a defense of Gordon Brown or his ilk; my point is that the state intervening to support the mistakes of any business, be they banks or car factories, (and using taxes collected coercively to do so) is state socialism by any other name. A large part of the existing deficit is due to repayments of the interest on the monies borrowed to support the banks. I would argue that when a person makes a decision in life that they know to be risky, eg gambling, then they should be free to make that decision so long as they are fully exposed to the consequences. The message sent out by the Govt was one of , don't worry if you've made enormous mistakes, the taxpayer will bail you out so that you can carry on as before.
Regarding immigrants and their conduct; one cannot help but notice the number of eastern Europeans, Asian, African, and antipodean people doing minimum wage jobs around the country. London's economy would sieze up otherwise. What personal qualities do they possess that the idigenous population perhaps lack?
If a person behaves like knuckle dragging trash then it matters not whether they are an Asian Muslim who has lived here for a week, or a white and supposedly" English" person whose ancestry can be traced 500 years. If someone is going to be part of the solution then I would want more such people to be living here irrespective of their place of birth.
Dear BD16, I hadn't intended my comments as a defense of Gordon Brown or his ilk; my point is that the state intervening to support the mistakes of any business, be they banks or car factories, (and using taxes collected coercively to do so) is state socialism by any other name. A large part of the existing deficit is due to repayments of the interest on the monies borrowed to support the banks. I would argue that when a person makes a decision in life that they know to be risky, eg gambling, then they should be free to make that decision so long as they are fully exposed to the consequences. The message sent out by the Govt was one of , don't worry if you've made enormous mistakes, the taxpayer will bail you out so that you can carry on as before. Regarding immigrants and their conduct; one cannot help but notice the number of eastern Europeans, Asian, African, and antipodean people doing minimum wage jobs around the country. London's economy would sieze up otherwise. What personal qualities do they possess that the idigenous population perhaps lack? If a person behaves like knuckle dragging trash then it matters not whether they are an Asian Muslim who has lived here for a week, or a white and supposedly" English" person whose ancestry can be traced 500 years. If someone is going to be part of the solution then I would want more such people to be living here irrespective of their place of birth. E.goldstein
  • Score: 0

11:58am Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

dearymeee wrote:
Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say.

What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights.

All going great isn't it.
What's wrong with being Right Wing? For the benefit of the hard-of-thinking, allow me to explain....(true) Socialism is about caring about the plight of others. Conservatism is all about caring about oneself, ultimate selfishness. The teachings of Jesus are entirely compatible with Socialism, for example, whereas the ideology of Hitler is comparable with Conservatism. Now do you see?
[quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: Yeah I do actually think that if you have been out of work for over 6 months and claiming benefits you shouldn't be allowed to vote. If you don't contribute to society then why should you have a say. What's wrong with being right wing? Look at where you lefties have got Bradford. Blame/claim shops on every corner. Immigrants living off our hard work because anything else breaches their human rights. All going great isn't it.[/p][/quote]What's wrong with being Right Wing? For the benefit of the hard-of-thinking, allow me to explain....(true) Socialism is about caring about the plight of others. Conservatism is all about caring about oneself, ultimate selfishness. The teachings of Jesus are entirely compatible with Socialism, for example, whereas the ideology of Hitler is comparable with Conservatism. Now do you see? Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

2:27pm Sun 30 Oct 11

dearymeee says...

I see that you seem to live in a fairy tale. I agree Socialism or even Communism are fantastic ideologies. However, it doesn't work does it?! These ideals revolve around everyone doing their bit for society. If people don't contribute then they are resented by those that do. That is human nature.

Comparing Jesus and Hitler to illustrate your point is absolutely laughable. Firstly, one of those is a fictional character. Or at best an exaggeration of a real person.

I don't think too highly of Hitler either to be honest. Perhaps you are confusing Right Wing politics with a one off regime. There is a middle ground you moron
I see that you seem to live in a fairy tale. I agree Socialism or even Communism are fantastic ideologies. However, it doesn't work does it?! These ideals revolve around everyone doing their bit for society. If people don't contribute then they are resented by those that do. That is human nature. Comparing Jesus and Hitler to illustrate your point is absolutely laughable. Firstly, one of those is a fictional character. Or at best an exaggeration of a real person. I don't think too highly of Hitler either to be honest. Perhaps you are confusing Right Wing politics with a one off regime. There is a middle ground you moron dearymeee
  • Score: 0

4:05pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Yorkshire Lass says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Yorkshire Lass wrote:
sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.
It's alright, don't worry your little head, go back to sleep, X-Factor is on television, your government is in control, move along....
you really are brain washed. But there again maybe you are not old enough to understand politics unless someone is pulling your strings. As for X Factor - what is that?>
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Yorkshire Lass[/bold] wrote: sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.[/p][/quote]It's alright, don't worry your little head, go back to sleep, X-Factor is on television, your government is in control, move along....[/p][/quote]you really are brain washed. But there again maybe you are not old enough to understand politics unless someone is pulling your strings. As for X Factor - what is that?> Yorkshire Lass
  • Score: 0

4:37pm Sun 30 Oct 11

BD16 says...

E.goldstein wrote:
Dear BD16, I hadn't intended my comments as a defense of Gordon Brown or his ilk; my point is that the state intervening to support the mistakes of any business, be they banks or car factories, (and using taxes collected coercively to do so) is state socialism by any other name. A large part of the existing deficit is due to repayments of the interest on the monies borrowed to support the banks. I would argue that when a person makes a decision in life that they know to be risky, eg gambling, then they should be free to make that decision so long as they are fully exposed to the consequences. The message sent out by the Govt was one of , don't worry if you've made enormous mistakes, the taxpayer will bail you out so that you can carry on as before. Regarding immigrants and their conduct; one cannot help but notice the number of eastern Europeans, Asian, African, and antipodean people doing minimum wage jobs around the country. London's economy would sieze up otherwise. What personal qualities do they possess that the idigenous population perhaps lack? If a person behaves like knuckle dragging trash then it matters not whether they are an Asian Muslim who has lived here for a week, or a white and supposedly" English" person whose ancestry can be traced 500 years. If someone is going to be part of the solution then I would want more such people to be living here irrespective of their place of birth.
Sadly, it seems the banks were allowed to become "too big to fail" I don't know enough about economics to argue whether this was genuinely true but enough people who do seemed to think so, so I go along with them. For the future I think we need far stronger regulation so that this doesn't happen again. The thing to remember about the banks that did fail is that it was the ordinary workers who suffered. The multi million £ bonus earners were long gone. If you read the views of many expressed on here they vary from the extreme right to the extreme left. Economically, the sensible way forward is probably somewhere between the two.
[quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: Dear BD16, I hadn't intended my comments as a defense of Gordon Brown or his ilk; my point is that the state intervening to support the mistakes of any business, be they banks or car factories, (and using taxes collected coercively to do so) is state socialism by any other name. A large part of the existing deficit is due to repayments of the interest on the monies borrowed to support the banks. I would argue that when a person makes a decision in life that they know to be risky, eg gambling, then they should be free to make that decision so long as they are fully exposed to the consequences. The message sent out by the Govt was one of , don't worry if you've made enormous mistakes, the taxpayer will bail you out so that you can carry on as before. Regarding immigrants and their conduct; one cannot help but notice the number of eastern Europeans, Asian, African, and antipodean people doing minimum wage jobs around the country. London's economy would sieze up otherwise. What personal qualities do they possess that the idigenous population perhaps lack? If a person behaves like knuckle dragging trash then it matters not whether they are an Asian Muslim who has lived here for a week, or a white and supposedly" English" person whose ancestry can be traced 500 years. If someone is going to be part of the solution then I would want more such people to be living here irrespective of their place of birth.[/p][/quote]Sadly, it seems the banks were allowed to become "too big to fail" I don't know enough about economics to argue whether this was genuinely true but enough people who do seemed to think so, so I go along with them. For the future I think we need far stronger regulation so that this doesn't happen again. The thing to remember about the banks that did fail is that it was the ordinary workers who suffered. The multi million £ bonus earners were long gone. If you read the views of many expressed on here they vary from the extreme right to the extreme left. Economically, the sensible way forward is probably somewhere between the two. BD16
  • Score: 0

6:18pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

BD16 wrote:
E.goldstein wrote:
Dear BD16, I hadn't intended my comments as a defense of Gordon Brown or his ilk; my point is that the state intervening to support the mistakes of any business, be they banks or car factories, (and using taxes collected coercively to do so) is state socialism by any other name. A large part of the existing deficit is due to repayments of the interest on the monies borrowed to support the banks. I would argue that when a person makes a decision in life that they know to be risky, eg gambling, then they should be free to make that decision so long as they are fully exposed to the consequences. The message sent out by the Govt was one of , don't worry if you've made enormous mistakes, the taxpayer will bail you out so that you can carry on as before. Regarding immigrants and their conduct; one cannot help but notice the number of eastern Europeans, Asian, African, and antipodean people doing minimum wage jobs around the country. London's economy would sieze up otherwise. What personal qualities do they possess that the idigenous population perhaps lack? If a person behaves like knuckle dragging trash then it matters not whether they are an Asian Muslim who has lived here for a week, or a white and supposedly" English" person whose ancestry can be traced 500 years. If someone is going to be part of the solution then I would want more such people to be living here irrespective of their place of birth.
Sadly, it seems the banks were allowed to become "too big to fail" I don't know enough about economics to argue whether this was genuinely true but enough people who do seemed to think so, so I go along with them. For the future I think we need far stronger regulation so that this doesn't happen again. The thing to remember about the banks that did fail is that it was the ordinary workers who suffered. The multi million £ bonus earners were long gone. If you read the views of many expressed on here they vary from the extreme right to the extreme left. Economically, the sensible way forward is probably somewhere between the two.
It is Capitalism itself that has failed. Bailing out the banks is like trying to give crutches to a man with no legs.
[quote][p][bold]BD16[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: Dear BD16, I hadn't intended my comments as a defense of Gordon Brown or his ilk; my point is that the state intervening to support the mistakes of any business, be they banks or car factories, (and using taxes collected coercively to do so) is state socialism by any other name. A large part of the existing deficit is due to repayments of the interest on the monies borrowed to support the banks. I would argue that when a person makes a decision in life that they know to be risky, eg gambling, then they should be free to make that decision so long as they are fully exposed to the consequences. The message sent out by the Govt was one of , don't worry if you've made enormous mistakes, the taxpayer will bail you out so that you can carry on as before. Regarding immigrants and their conduct; one cannot help but notice the number of eastern Europeans, Asian, African, and antipodean people doing minimum wage jobs around the country. London's economy would sieze up otherwise. What personal qualities do they possess that the idigenous population perhaps lack? If a person behaves like knuckle dragging trash then it matters not whether they are an Asian Muslim who has lived here for a week, or a white and supposedly" English" person whose ancestry can be traced 500 years. If someone is going to be part of the solution then I would want more such people to be living here irrespective of their place of birth.[/p][/quote]Sadly, it seems the banks were allowed to become "too big to fail" I don't know enough about economics to argue whether this was genuinely true but enough people who do seemed to think so, so I go along with them. For the future I think we need far stronger regulation so that this doesn't happen again. The thing to remember about the banks that did fail is that it was the ordinary workers who suffered. The multi million £ bonus earners were long gone. If you read the views of many expressed on here they vary from the extreme right to the extreme left. Economically, the sensible way forward is probably somewhere between the two.[/p][/quote]It is Capitalism itself that has failed. Bailing out the banks is like trying to give crutches to a man with no legs. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

6:25pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Yorkshire Lass wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Yorkshire Lass wrote:
sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.
It's alright, don't worry your little head, go back to sleep, X-Factor is on television, your government is in control, move along....
you really are brain washed. But there again maybe you are not old enough to understand politics unless someone is pulling your strings. As for X Factor - what is that?>
Me brainwashed? LOL Persist in your delusions if you must. And I am probably a lot older than you think. I understand that Politics is a game, that modern western democracy is a sham, that the Hegelian Dialectic (Thesis Vs. Anti-thesis produces Synthesis) has been in play since the announcement of the Fama Fraternitatis, and that Democracy is merely a stop-gap until such a time when people are truly capable of governing themselves, at which point Utopia will have been established. David Cameron knows what I mean (oh yes, he knows alright, the first thing he did upon gaining power was to throw a garden party for the Freemasons). I know that the circle is being squared, and the Pyramid constructed. I don't expect you to understand any of that btw.
[quote][p][bold]Yorkshire Lass[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Yorkshire Lass[/bold] wrote: sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.[/p][/quote]It's alright, don't worry your little head, go back to sleep, X-Factor is on television, your government is in control, move along....[/p][/quote]you really are brain washed. But there again maybe you are not old enough to understand politics unless someone is pulling your strings. As for X Factor - what is that?>[/p][/quote]Me brainwashed? LOL Persist in your delusions if you must. And I am probably a lot older than you think. I understand that Politics is a game, that modern western democracy is a sham, that the Hegelian Dialectic (Thesis Vs. Anti-thesis produces Synthesis) has been in play since the announcement of the Fama Fraternitatis, and that Democracy is merely a stop-gap until such a time when people are truly capable of governing themselves, at which point Utopia will have been established. David Cameron knows what I mean (oh yes, he knows alright, the first thing he did upon gaining power was to throw a garden party for the Freemasons). I know that the circle is being squared, and the Pyramid constructed. I don't expect you to understand any of that btw. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

6:36pm Sun 30 Oct 11

BD16 says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
BD16 wrote:
E.goldstein wrote: Dear BD16, I hadn't intended my comments as a defense of Gordon Brown or his ilk; my point is that the state intervening to support the mistakes of any business, be they banks or car factories, (and using taxes collected coercively to do so) is state socialism by any other name. A large part of the existing deficit is due to repayments of the interest on the monies borrowed to support the banks. I would argue that when a person makes a decision in life that they know to be risky, eg gambling, then they should be free to make that decision so long as they are fully exposed to the consequences. The message sent out by the Govt was one of , don't worry if you've made enormous mistakes, the taxpayer will bail you out so that you can carry on as before. Regarding immigrants and their conduct; one cannot help but notice the number of eastern Europeans, Asian, African, and antipodean people doing minimum wage jobs around the country. London's economy would sieze up otherwise. What personal qualities do they possess that the idigenous population perhaps lack? If a person behaves like knuckle dragging trash then it matters not whether they are an Asian Muslim who has lived here for a week, or a white and supposedly" English" person whose ancestry can be traced 500 years. If someone is going to be part of the solution then I would want more such people to be living here irrespective of their place of birth.
Sadly, it seems the banks were allowed to become "too big to fail" I don't know enough about economics to argue whether this was genuinely true but enough people who do seemed to think so, so I go along with them. For the future I think we need far stronger regulation so that this doesn't happen again. The thing to remember about the banks that did fail is that it was the ordinary workers who suffered. The multi million £ bonus earners were long gone. If you read the views of many expressed on here they vary from the extreme right to the extreme left. Economically, the sensible way forward is probably somewhere between the two.
It is Capitalism itself that has failed. Bailing out the banks is like trying to give crutches to a man with no legs.
What's the alternative to capitalism? Socialism? Yeah, that's worked a treat before hasn't it.
.
"De-centralize government, abandon the goal of economic growth, create small-scale cashless local economies utilizing local resources in a sustainable manner, use available technologies to improve people's lives instead of maximising profit" With a population of 60 million on a small over populated island. We'll all starve in 2 months.
.
The system we have isn't perfect but it's the only one that will keep the most people with a higher quality of life. It's just how we tune it that is to be decided.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BD16[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: Dear BD16, I hadn't intended my comments as a defense of Gordon Brown or his ilk; my point is that the state intervening to support the mistakes of any business, be they banks or car factories, (and using taxes collected coercively to do so) is state socialism by any other name. A large part of the existing deficit is due to repayments of the interest on the monies borrowed to support the banks. I would argue that when a person makes a decision in life that they know to be risky, eg gambling, then they should be free to make that decision so long as they are fully exposed to the consequences. The message sent out by the Govt was one of , don't worry if you've made enormous mistakes, the taxpayer will bail you out so that you can carry on as before. Regarding immigrants and their conduct; one cannot help but notice the number of eastern Europeans, Asian, African, and antipodean people doing minimum wage jobs around the country. London's economy would sieze up otherwise. What personal qualities do they possess that the idigenous population perhaps lack? If a person behaves like knuckle dragging trash then it matters not whether they are an Asian Muslim who has lived here for a week, or a white and supposedly" English" person whose ancestry can be traced 500 years. If someone is going to be part of the solution then I would want more such people to be living here irrespective of their place of birth.[/p][/quote]Sadly, it seems the banks were allowed to become "too big to fail" I don't know enough about economics to argue whether this was genuinely true but enough people who do seemed to think so, so I go along with them. For the future I think we need far stronger regulation so that this doesn't happen again. The thing to remember about the banks that did fail is that it was the ordinary workers who suffered. The multi million £ bonus earners were long gone. If you read the views of many expressed on here they vary from the extreme right to the extreme left. Economically, the sensible way forward is probably somewhere between the two.[/p][/quote]It is Capitalism itself that has failed. Bailing out the banks is like trying to give crutches to a man with no legs.[/p][/quote]What's the alternative to capitalism? Socialism? Yeah, that's worked a treat before hasn't it. . "De-centralize government, abandon the goal of economic growth, create small-scale cashless local economies utilizing local resources in a sustainable manner, use available technologies to improve people's lives instead of maximising profit" With a population of 60 million on a small over populated island. We'll all starve in 2 months. . The system we have isn't perfect but it's the only one that will keep the most people with a higher quality of life. It's just how we tune it that is to be decided. BD16
  • Score: 0

7:09pm Sun 30 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
dearymeee wrote:
99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other.
*rolls eyes* don't you have anything valid to say? if not please stfu.
You still have yet to answer mine or Eastwestbowling's questions, and this is because you cant without embarressing yourself and proving to the rest of us what you are! You see Aunty "Landless Peasant" Capitalist, all you are or ever have been is a lost little soul with ideals still set in the 14th century. You openly blame others for your situation, and blame others for not digging yourself out of that situation. I am sick and tired of low life little worms like youself thinking that you have the right to a free lunch, thinking that everything must be handed to you on a silver platter whilst you wollow in the filth that you have put yourself in. You enjoy where you are, because it gives you purpose, it's the only reason why you exist. You blame me for the capitalist crisis, why, without people like me it would be a **** site worse, and a **** site worse for you! You said in an earlier post that you weren't actually at Centenery Square and that you were at home, some protester you are, cant be a***d I take it. No, much easier,safer, and warmer to protest over the internet, that "OTHERS" pay for, heating the home you reside in, that "OTHERS" pay for, eating the food, that "OTHERS" pay for. Understand one thing, when "WE" stop paying, you stop existing. No more hand outs, no more free lunch! I have said before, you will never change anything by protesting in this way, all you do is belittle the very reason why you are protesting. Do you think those idiots who dressed as Batman and scaled the walls of The Houses Of Parliament in the name of "Fathers For Justice" actually changed the face of this country's child custody system, or did they just prove the fact that the Mothers were right in the first place! You want to grow some b***s and protest to the manner that this massive situation deserves, then i'll be happy to stand side by side with you, but until then, YOU shut the **** up and crawl back under your stone!
Yawn...
Funny, but I actually expected that from someone like you, empty. Good luck, you'll need it!
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: 99% of the protestors will be jobless gobshoights who spend their life protesting over something or other.[/p][/quote]*rolls eyes* don't you have anything valid to say? if not please stfu.[/p][/quote]You still have yet to answer mine or Eastwestbowling's questions, and this is because you cant without embarressing yourself and proving to the rest of us what you are! You see Aunty "Landless Peasant" Capitalist, all you are or ever have been is a lost little soul with ideals still set in the 14th century. You openly blame others for your situation, and blame others for not digging yourself out of that situation. I am sick and tired of low life little worms like youself thinking that you have the right to a free lunch, thinking that everything must be handed to you on a silver platter whilst you wollow in the filth that you have put yourself in. You enjoy where you are, because it gives you purpose, it's the only reason why you exist. You blame me for the capitalist crisis, why, without people like me it would be a **** site worse, and a **** site worse for you! You said in an earlier post that you weren't actually at Centenery Square and that you were at home, some protester you are, cant be a***d I take it. No, much easier,safer, and warmer to protest over the internet, that "OTHERS" pay for, heating the home you reside in, that "OTHERS" pay for, eating the food, that "OTHERS" pay for. Understand one thing, when "WE" stop paying, you stop existing. No more hand outs, no more free lunch! I have said before, you will never change anything by protesting in this way, all you do is belittle the very reason why you are protesting. Do you think those idiots who dressed as Batman and scaled the walls of The Houses Of Parliament in the name of "Fathers For Justice" actually changed the face of this country's child custody system, or did they just prove the fact that the Mothers were right in the first place! You want to grow some b***s and protest to the manner that this massive situation deserves, then i'll be happy to stand side by side with you, but until then, YOU shut the **** up and crawl back under your stone![/p][/quote]Yawn...[/p][/quote]Funny, but I actually expected that from someone like you, empty. Good luck, you'll need it! SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

7:13pm Sun 30 Oct 11

The Straight talker says...

Looks like there intent on staying
Looks like there intent on staying The Straight talker
  • Score: 0

7:26pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Andy2010 says...

The Straight talker wrote:
Looks like there intent on staying
Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers
[quote][p][bold]The Straight talker[/bold] wrote: Looks like there intent on staying[/p][/quote]Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers Andy2010
  • Score: 0

7:45pm Sun 30 Oct 11

E.goldstein says...

Andy2010 wrote:
The Straight talker wrote:
Looks like there intent on staying
Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers
I am struck by the levels of antipathy and bitterness on here from some of the correspondents; so out of interest, would you like the protestors to die because you oppose their cause and opinions, or would you still feel that way irrespective of what they were protesting about? It's a genuine question.
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Straight talker[/bold] wrote: Looks like there intent on staying[/p][/quote]Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers[/p][/quote]I am struck by the levels of antipathy and bitterness on here from some of the correspondents; so out of interest, would you like the protestors to die because you oppose their cause and opinions, or would you still feel that way irrespective of what they were protesting about? It's a genuine question. E.goldstein
  • Score: 0

8:16pm Sun 30 Oct 11

SellingEnglandByThePound says...

E.goldstein wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
The Straight talker wrote:
Looks like there intent on staying
Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers
I am struck by the levels of antipathy and bitterness on here from some of the correspondents; so out of interest, would you like the protestors to die because you oppose their cause and opinions, or would you still feel that way irrespective of what they were protesting about? It's a genuine question.
I never once said I oppose their cause, I actually believe in it! Any one who is willing to oppose to the fact that this country is being screwed into the ground (too many different areas to type) has my utmost support. What "I" protest about, and I believe it was me who posted first, are to the section of society who seam to protest the most about and want the downfall of a Government who, FOR YEARS, has fead, clothed, housed & supported them! You dont bite the hand that feeds, most of the reactionary drivel that is posted by these so called "Freedom Crusaders" is posted by people who have never supported in any way the structure that helps them to survive and wouldn't dream of ever so much as walking a picket line, let alone doing anything remotely radical, as they might run the risk of being caught, being named and listed on a database somewhere and possibly losing their giro cheque! Aunty "Landless Peasent" Capitalism, being one such person, a "Keyboard Crusader" I believe they are called! And to suggest that someone on here wants another human dead for standing up for their rights is a strange conclusion, wonder why you came to that????
[quote][p][bold]E.goldstein[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Straight talker[/bold] wrote: Looks like there intent on staying[/p][/quote]Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers[/p][/quote]I am struck by the levels of antipathy and bitterness on here from some of the correspondents; so out of interest, would you like the protestors to die because you oppose their cause and opinions, or would you still feel that way irrespective of what they were protesting about? It's a genuine question.[/p][/quote]I never once said I oppose their cause, I actually believe in it! Any one who is willing to oppose to the fact that this country is being screwed into the ground (too many different areas to type) has my utmost support. What "I" protest about, and I believe it was me who posted first, are to the section of society who seam to protest the most about and want the downfall of a Government who, FOR YEARS, has fead, clothed, housed & supported them! You dont bite the hand that feeds, most of the reactionary drivel that is posted by these so called "Freedom Crusaders" is posted by people who have never supported in any way the structure that helps them to survive and wouldn't dream of ever so much as walking a picket line, let alone doing anything remotely radical, as they might run the risk of being caught, being named and listed on a database somewhere and possibly losing their giro cheque! Aunty "Landless Peasent" Capitalism, being one such person, a "Keyboard Crusader" I believe they are called! And to suggest that someone on here wants another human dead for standing up for their rights is a strange conclusion, wonder why you came to that???? SellingEnglandByThePound
  • Score: 0

8:24pm Sun 30 Oct 11

WHAT ! says...

dearymeee wrote:
And John C above is absolutely right, if we're getting onto liberals and their open door policy. They protest and defend the most oppressive, extreme, violent and disgusting religion on the planet. How can you be so liberal as to tolerate a people who's belief is that you should convert to their way of life or be killed?!

Madness
Yeh, total MADNESS that you only know the News Of The World version of Islam, you must be confused with Free Masons or even just totally lost & confused....
[quote][p][bold]dearymeee[/bold] wrote: And John C above is absolutely right, if we're getting onto liberals and their open door policy. They protest and defend the most oppressive, extreme, violent and disgusting religion on the planet. How can you be so liberal as to tolerate a people who's belief is that you should convert to their way of life or be killed?! Madness[/p][/quote]Yeh, total MADNESS that you only know the News Of The World version of Islam, you must be confused with Free Masons or even just totally lost & confused.... WHAT !
  • Score: 0

8:37pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Yorkshire Lass says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Yorkshire Lass wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Yorkshire Lass wrote:
sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.
It's alright, don't worry your little head, go back to sleep, X-Factor is on television, your government is in control, move along....
you really are brain washed. But there again maybe you are not old enough to understand politics unless someone is pulling your strings. As for X Factor - what is that?>
Me brainwashed? LOL Persist in your delusions if you must. And I am probably a lot older than you think. I understand that Politics is a game, that modern western democracy is a sham, that the Hegelian Dialectic (Thesis Vs. Anti-thesis produces Synthesis) has been in play since the announcement of the Fama Fraternitatis, and that Democracy is merely a stop-gap until such a time when people are truly capable of governing themselves, at which point Utopia will have been established. David Cameron knows what I mean (oh yes, he knows alright, the first thing he did upon gaining power was to throw a garden party for the Freemasons). I know that the circle is being squared, and the Pyramid constructed. I don't expect you to understand any of that btw.
No comment on the above. As it would appear that you hate the English way of life may I suggest you toddle off to another Country which is run by a despot capitalist and see how long you last spouting this absolute poison like someone possessed. The end!
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Yorkshire Lass[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Yorkshire Lass[/bold] wrote: sounds to me like you are jealous. Would you like to be part of your so called estimation of 1%. Me thinks so. So go back to sleep as a lot of us are quite content with our lot. People like you do not speak for the majority of this city, so go home and get a life in the real world. Bye.[/p][/quote]It's alright, don't worry your little head, go back to sleep, X-Factor is on television, your government is in control, move along....[/p][/quote]you really are brain washed. But there again maybe you are not old enough to understand politics unless someone is pulling your strings. As for X Factor - what is that?>[/p][/quote]Me brainwashed? LOL Persist in your delusions if you must. And I am probably a lot older than you think. I understand that Politics is a game, that modern western democracy is a sham, that the Hegelian Dialectic (Thesis Vs. Anti-thesis produces Synthesis) has been in play since the announcement of the Fama Fraternitatis, and that Democracy is merely a stop-gap until such a time when people are truly capable of governing themselves, at which point Utopia will have been established. David Cameron knows what I mean (oh yes, he knows alright, the first thing he did upon gaining power was to throw a garden party for the Freemasons). I know that the circle is being squared, and the Pyramid constructed. I don't expect you to understand any of that btw.[/p][/quote]No comment on the above. As it would appear that you hate the English way of life may I suggest you toddle off to another Country which is run by a despot capitalist and see how long you last spouting this absolute poison like someone possessed. The end! Yorkshire Lass
  • Score: 0

8:48pm Sun 30 Oct 11

E.goldstein says...

Thanks for your response. My query about for what reasons the protestors were wished dead was based on the entry I quoted where someone "hopes they all freeze to death". Hence my question. The comment may have been in jest but even so it seemed harsh to wish for the deaths of others.
Thanks for your response. My query about for what reasons the protestors were wished dead was based on the entry I quoted where someone "hopes they all freeze to death". Hence my question. The comment may have been in jest but even so it seemed harsh to wish for the deaths of others. E.goldstein
  • Score: 0

10:37pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Andy2010 wrote:
The Straight talker wrote:
Looks like there intent on staying
Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers
But you obviously don't mind the fact that Billionaires like Lord Ashcroft get away with paying NO tax? Or that we are all being screwed by the privately owned power companies who make extortionate profits out of providing an essential basic service? or that the Bankers STILL get their million pound bonuses for doing zilch? idiot.
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Straight talker[/bold] wrote: Looks like there intent on staying[/p][/quote]Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers[/p][/quote]But you obviously don't mind the fact that Billionaires like Lord Ashcroft get away with paying NO tax? Or that we are all being screwed by the privately owned power companies who make extortionate profits out of providing an essential basic service? or that the Bankers STILL get their million pound bonuses for doing zilch? idiot. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

10:44pm Sun 30 Oct 11

RollandSmoke says...

The cap doffers on here are amusing. "Don't rock the boat, you'll make master angry". Sorry folks but your master is taking the p1ss out of you. When the companys outsourced work or downsized their workforce due to the shiny new equipment that they paid for through government tax breaks, they knew **** well that the tax bill for the unemployment they created was coming to you. They knew that people would get annoyed so they filled the media with storys of benefit cheats and bogus asylum seekers to deflect that anger from them. When the banks failed and were bailed out, no-one questioned why, due to most of them being based in the "city" of London, they had been tax exempt for years and had been paying next to nothing. But no, all our ills are the fault of the unemployed who should go out and get a minimum wage or part time job so as the taxpayer can subsidise their wages and master can make a nice profit. I think there's a bit of Stockholm syndrome going on with the right wing drones. We don't have a choice of politicians anymore, all we have is different shades of Zionists and they are too busy keeping their paymasters happy to give a monkeys about you whether you doff your cap to them or stick your fingers up at them. It doesn't have to be this way and kudos to the occupiers worldwide that are making a stand.
The cap doffers on here are amusing. "Don't rock the boat, you'll make master angry". Sorry folks but your master is taking the p1ss out of you. When the companys outsourced work or downsized their workforce due to the shiny new equipment that they paid for through government tax breaks, they knew **** well that the tax bill for the unemployment they created was coming to you. They knew that people would get annoyed so they filled the media with storys of benefit cheats and bogus asylum seekers to deflect that anger from them. When the banks failed and were bailed out, no-one questioned why, due to most of them being based in the "city" of London, they had been tax exempt for years and had been paying next to nothing. But no, all our ills are the fault of the unemployed who should go out and get a minimum wage or part time job so as the taxpayer can subsidise their wages and master can make a nice profit. I think there's a bit of Stockholm syndrome going on with the right wing drones. We don't have a choice of politicians anymore, all we have is different shades of Zionists and they are too busy keeping their paymasters happy to give a monkeys about you whether you doff your cap to them or stick your fingers up at them. It doesn't have to be this way and kudos to the occupiers worldwide that are making a stand. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

11:06pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Patrick Bateman says...

Wehay! Rolly's back!!
Wehay! Rolly's back!! Patrick Bateman
  • Score: 0

11:13pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

RollandSmoke wrote:
The cap doffers on here are amusing. "Don't rock the boat, you'll make master angry". Sorry folks but your master is taking the p1ss out of you. When the companys outsourced work or downsized their workforce due to the shiny new equipment that they paid for through government tax breaks, they knew **** well that the tax bill for the unemployment they created was coming to you. They knew that people would get annoyed so they filled the media with storys of benefit cheats and bogus asylum seekers to deflect that anger from them. When the banks failed and were bailed out, no-one questioned why, due to most of them being based in the "city" of London, they had been tax exempt for years and had been paying next to nothing. But no, all our ills are the fault of the unemployed who should go out and get a minimum wage or part time job so as the taxpayer can subsidise their wages and master can make a nice profit. I think there's a bit of Stockholm syndrome going on with the right wing drones. We don't have a choice of politicians anymore, all we have is different shades of Zionists and they are too busy keeping their paymasters happy to give a monkeys about you whether you doff your cap to them or stick your fingers up at them. It doesn't have to be this way and kudos to the occupiers worldwide that are making a stand.
WELL SAID. AT LAST SOMEONE WHO UNDERSTANDS (unlike the rest of the brain-dead Tory **** on this thread).
[quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: The cap doffers on here are amusing. "Don't rock the boat, you'll make master angry". Sorry folks but your master is taking the p1ss out of you. When the companys outsourced work or downsized their workforce due to the shiny new equipment that they paid for through government tax breaks, they knew **** well that the tax bill for the unemployment they created was coming to you. They knew that people would get annoyed so they filled the media with storys of benefit cheats and bogus asylum seekers to deflect that anger from them. When the banks failed and were bailed out, no-one questioned why, due to most of them being based in the "city" of London, they had been tax exempt for years and had been paying next to nothing. But no, all our ills are the fault of the unemployed who should go out and get a minimum wage or part time job so as the taxpayer can subsidise their wages and master can make a nice profit. I think there's a bit of Stockholm syndrome going on with the right wing drones. We don't have a choice of politicians anymore, all we have is different shades of Zionists and they are too busy keeping their paymasters happy to give a monkeys about you whether you doff your cap to them or stick your fingers up at them. It doesn't have to be this way and kudos to the occupiers worldwide that are making a stand.[/p][/quote]WELL SAID. AT LAST SOMEONE WHO UNDERSTANDS (unlike the rest of the brain-dead Tory **** on this thread). Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:19pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Patrick Bateman says...

Maybe you and Rolly should get down Centenary square and pitch a tent together and 'get all friendly-like'?
Maybe you and Rolly should get down Centenary square and pitch a tent together and 'get all friendly-like'? Patrick Bateman
  • Score: 0

11:24pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

FTSE 100 directors' earnings rose by almost half last year

Latest survey of boardroom pay finds average compensation went up by 49% to £2.7m



"Total earnings for directors of FTSE 100 companies increased by 49% last year, far outpacing pay claims for workers outside the boardroom.

A FTSE 100 executive typically received an average of £2.7m in 2010, according to the research by Incomes Data Services, which analysed payouts of salaries, bonuses and long-term incentive plans the last financial year.

For chief executives, the average total pay deal was £3.8m – an average rise of 43.5% – while IDS calculated that finance directors received an average increase of 34.1%,to take their average to £2m, while all other directors received an average increase of 66.5%, to take their average to £2.2m.

The directors enjoyed such large increases in the total take-home pay as bonus schemes compensated for the average 3.2% rise in base salaries that they were awarded last year. Inflation is running at 5.2% while data from IDS shows that pay deals in the private sector are running at 2.6%.

Steve Tatton, editor of the IDS report, said: "At a time when employees are experiencing real wage cuts and risk losing their livelihoods, without further explanation it may be difficult for FTSE 100 companies to justify the significant increase in earnings awarded to their directors.

"The pay gap between the boardroom and the shop floor does not yet show any signs of closing."

WE'RE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER!?
FTSE 100 directors' earnings rose by almost half last year Latest survey of boardroom pay finds average compensation went up by 49% to £2.7m "Total earnings for directors of FTSE 100 companies increased by 49% last year, far outpacing pay claims for workers outside the boardroom. A FTSE 100 executive typically received an average of £2.7m in 2010, according to the research by Incomes Data Services, which analysed payouts of salaries, bonuses and long-term incentive plans the last financial year. For chief executives, the average total pay deal was £3.8m – an average rise of 43.5% – while IDS calculated that finance directors received an average increase of 34.1%,to take their average to £2m, while all other directors received an average increase of 66.5%, to take their average to £2.2m. The directors enjoyed such large increases in the total take-home pay as bonus schemes compensated for the average 3.2% rise in base salaries that they were awarded last year. Inflation is running at 5.2% while data from IDS shows that pay deals in the private sector are running at 2.6%. Steve Tatton, editor of the IDS report, said: "At a time when employees are experiencing real wage cuts and risk losing their livelihoods, without further explanation it may be difficult for FTSE 100 companies to justify the significant increase in earnings awarded to their directors. "The pay gap between the boardroom and the shop floor does not yet show any signs of closing." WE'RE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER!? Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:28pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

http://www.guardian.
co.uk/business/2011/
oct/28/ftse-100-dire
ctors-earnings-rose-
by-almost-half
http://www.guardian. co.uk/business/2011/ oct/28/ftse-100-dire ctors-earnings-rose- by-almost-half Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:30pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Exposing the myth of ‘ordinary bloke’ David Cameron and his ‘Mr Average’ friends...

http://www.socialist
worker.co.uk/art.php
?id=22748
Exposing the myth of ‘ordinary bloke’ David Cameron and his ‘Mr Average’ friends... http://www.socialist worker.co.uk/art.php ?id=22748 Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:33pm Sun 30 Oct 11

RollandSmoke says...

Patrick Bateman wrote:
Wehay! Rolly's back!!
Only on here Patrick, they can stuff the forum where the sun don't shine.
[quote][p][bold]Patrick Bateman[/bold] wrote: Wehay! Rolly's back!![/p][/quote]Only on here Patrick, they can stuff the forum where the sun don't shine. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

11:40pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

General leaflet for workplaces:

http://swpresources.
posterous.com/genera
l-leaflet-for-workpl
aces-oct-19
General leaflet for workplaces: http://swpresources. posterous.com/genera l-leaflet-for-workpl aces-oct-19 Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:43pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

All in it together?

Bosses pay: up 49%

Workers pay: up 2.6%

Inflation: up 5.6%

http://swpresources.
posterous.com/sw-pos
ter-for-paper-sales-
bosses-pay
All in it together? Bosses pay: up 49% Workers pay: up 2.6% Inflation: up 5.6% http://swpresources. posterous.com/sw-pos ter-for-paper-sales- bosses-pay Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:48pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Andy2010 says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
The Straight talker wrote:
Looks like there intent on staying
Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers
But you obviously don't mind the fact that Billionaires like Lord Ashcroft get away with paying NO tax? Or that we are all being screwed by the privately owned power companies who make extortionate profits out of providing an essential basic service? or that the Bankers STILL get their million pound bonuses for doing zilch? idiot.
Short answer no....

Anyone...yes anyone can study and work hard to make a success of their lives and make money...lots of it. Power companies make profit for their shareholders which you are entitled to become..anyone is. Bankers earn billions for the companies they they work for and as anyone who earns money from effectively commission driven profit why shouldnt they earn a lot if they contributed to their employers bottom line not to mention the huge amount of tax they paid back on any of these bonuses. In turn these bank pay billions on profits in tax back to the ecomony. Even if the Government has bailed some of these out they will make vastly more back in taxation. Your and these stupid protestors never stop to consider the bigger picture ever.

These protestors and the others around the globe have every oppurtunity to make something of their lives but choose instead to moan about what is given to them. You know what if you dont like it then move to another country where everything is all fair and lovely....thought not because that place doesnt exist.

People on here moaning about bonuses make me laugh as if for example your company you worked for announced for example a profit share scheme you are all telling me you would turn round and refuse it...of course you wouldnt

The only way this country is going to get back on its feet is by everyone working hard and striving to make something better for themselves and their families. Will it be easy..of course not but rather than pointless protests that will achieve absolutely nothing or rioting just get on with it.

We will love in a democracy and if you dont like it then vote accordingly or why not either stand for election yourselves if you disagree with what all the parties offer.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Straight talker[/bold] wrote: Looks like there intent on staying[/p][/quote]Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers[/p][/quote]But you obviously don't mind the fact that Billionaires like Lord Ashcroft get away with paying NO tax? Or that we are all being screwed by the privately owned power companies who make extortionate profits out of providing an essential basic service? or that the Bankers STILL get their million pound bonuses for doing zilch? idiot.[/p][/quote]Short answer no.... Anyone...yes anyone can study and work hard to make a success of their lives and make money...lots of it. Power companies make profit for their shareholders which you are entitled to become..anyone is. Bankers earn billions for the companies they they work for and as anyone who earns money from effectively commission driven profit why shouldnt they earn a lot if they contributed to their employers bottom line not to mention the huge amount of tax they paid back on any of these bonuses. In turn these bank pay billions on profits in tax back to the ecomony. Even if the Government has bailed some of these out they will make vastly more back in taxation. Your and these stupid protestors never stop to consider the bigger picture ever. These protestors and the others around the globe have every oppurtunity to make something of their lives but choose instead to moan about what is given to them. You know what if you dont like it then move to another country where everything is all fair and lovely....thought not because that place doesnt exist. People on here moaning about bonuses make me laugh as if for example your company you worked for announced for example a profit share scheme you are all telling me you would turn round and refuse it...of course you wouldnt The only way this country is going to get back on its feet is by everyone working hard and striving to make something better for themselves and their families. Will it be easy..of course not but rather than pointless protests that will achieve absolutely nothing or rioting just get on with it. We will love in a democracy and if you dont like it then vote accordingly or why not either stand for election yourselves if you disagree with what all the parties offer. Andy2010
  • Score: 0

11:52pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Goldman Sachs Rule The World, Not Governments. BBC Sept 26 2011

"I go to bed at night and I dream of another recession...if you have a right plan you can make a lot of money from this...Governments don't rule the world, Goldman Sachs rules the world..."


http://youtu.be/kpg7
6VjTa58


Sleep well folks, don't be late for work in the morning.....
Goldman Sachs Rule The World, Not Governments. BBC Sept 26 2011 "I go to bed at night and I dream of another recession...if you have a right plan you can make a lot of money from this...Governments don't rule the world, Goldman Sachs rules the world..." http://youtu.be/kpg7 6VjTa58 Sleep well folks, don't be late for work in the morning..... Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:56pm Sun 30 Oct 11

pe@ce1st says...

Thank you for being there in solidarity with the occupy protests all over the world! Go Bradford!
Thank you for being there in solidarity with the occupy protests all over the world! Go Bradford! pe@ce1st
  • Score: 0

11:56pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Andy2010 wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
The Straight talker wrote:
Looks like there intent on staying
Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers
But you obviously don't mind the fact that Billionaires like Lord Ashcroft get away with paying NO tax? Or that we are all being screwed by the privately owned power companies who make extortionate profits out of providing an essential basic service? or that the Bankers STILL get their million pound bonuses for doing zilch? idiot.
Short answer no....

Anyone...yes anyone can study and work hard to make a success of their lives and make money...lots of it. Power companies make profit for their shareholders which you are entitled to become..anyone is. Bankers earn billions for the companies they they work for and as anyone who earns money from effectively commission driven profit why shouldnt they earn a lot if they contributed to their employers bottom line not to mention the huge amount of tax they paid back on any of these bonuses. In turn these bank pay billions on profits in tax back to the ecomony. Even if the Government has bailed some of these out they will make vastly more back in taxation. Your and these stupid protestors never stop to consider the bigger picture ever.

These protestors and the others around the globe have every oppurtunity to make something of their lives but choose instead to moan about what is given to them. You know what if you dont like it then move to another country where everything is all fair and lovely....thought not because that place doesnt exist.

People on here moaning about bonuses make me laugh as if for example your company you worked for announced for example a profit share scheme you are all telling me you would turn round and refuse it...of course you wouldnt

The only way this country is going to get back on its feet is by everyone working hard and striving to make something better for themselves and their families. Will it be easy..of course not but rather than pointless protests that will achieve absolutely nothing or rioting just get on with it.

We will love in a democracy and if you dont like it then vote accordingly or why not either stand for election yourselves if you disagree with what all the parties offer.
It's you who doesn't stop to appreciate the bigger picture. You are completely asleep. Your head is in the sand. You will work all your life (if you're lucky) and still die in debt. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The country is NOT skint, it is a lie. The rich have taken all the wealth for themselves and you have believed their B.S. You are an idiot.
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Straight talker[/bold] wrote: Looks like there intent on staying[/p][/quote]Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers[/p][/quote]But you obviously don't mind the fact that Billionaires like Lord Ashcroft get away with paying NO tax? Or that we are all being screwed by the privately owned power companies who make extortionate profits out of providing an essential basic service? or that the Bankers STILL get their million pound bonuses for doing zilch? idiot.[/p][/quote]Short answer no.... Anyone...yes anyone can study and work hard to make a success of their lives and make money...lots of it. Power companies make profit for their shareholders which you are entitled to become..anyone is. Bankers earn billions for the companies they they work for and as anyone who earns money from effectively commission driven profit why shouldnt they earn a lot if they contributed to their employers bottom line not to mention the huge amount of tax they paid back on any of these bonuses. In turn these bank pay billions on profits in tax back to the ecomony. Even if the Government has bailed some of these out they will make vastly more back in taxation. Your and these stupid protestors never stop to consider the bigger picture ever. These protestors and the others around the globe have every oppurtunity to make something of their lives but choose instead to moan about what is given to them. You know what if you dont like it then move to another country where everything is all fair and lovely....thought not because that place doesnt exist. People on here moaning about bonuses make me laugh as if for example your company you worked for announced for example a profit share scheme you are all telling me you would turn round and refuse it...of course you wouldnt The only way this country is going to get back on its feet is by everyone working hard and striving to make something better for themselves and their families. Will it be easy..of course not but rather than pointless protests that will achieve absolutely nothing or rioting just get on with it. We will love in a democracy and if you dont like it then vote accordingly or why not either stand for election yourselves if you disagree with what all the parties offer.[/p][/quote]It's you who doesn't stop to appreciate the bigger picture. You are completely asleep. Your head is in the sand. You will work all your life (if you're lucky) and still die in debt. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The country is NOT skint, it is a lie. The rich have taken all the wealth for themselves and you have believed their B.S. You are an idiot. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

11:57pm Sun 30 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

pe@ce1st wrote:
Thank you for being there in solidarity with the occupy protests all over the world! Go Bradford!
WE ARE THE 99%
[quote][p][bold]pe@ce1st[/bold] wrote: Thank you for being there in solidarity with the occupy protests all over the world! Go Bradford![/p][/quote]WE ARE THE 99% Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:07am Mon 31 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Poverty - the key facts:

http://www.poverty.o
rg.uk/summary/key%20
facts.shtml
Poverty - the key facts: http://www.poverty.o rg.uk/summary/key%20 facts.shtml Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:09am Mon 31 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

The Cameron Millions: Family fortunes the Tories don't want you to see:

http://www.mirror.co
.uk/news/top-stories
/2010/03/09/the-cam-
ron-millions-115875-
22096598/
The Cameron Millions: Family fortunes the Tories don't want you to see: http://www.mirror.co .uk/news/top-stories /2010/03/09/the-cam- ron-millions-115875- 22096598/ Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:13am Mon 31 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Npower condemned after price hike helps double profits

"ENERGY firm Npower more than doubled profits after jacking up bills to customers.

The German-owned giant banked £306million in the first six months of the year, despite customers slashing their energy use."

http://www.mirror.co
.uk/advice/money/ene
rgy/2011/08/10/npowe
r-condemned-after-pr
ice-hike-helps-doubl
e-profits-115875-233
33084/
Npower condemned after price hike helps double profits "ENERGY firm Npower more than doubled profits after jacking up bills to customers. The German-owned giant banked £306million in the first six months of the year, despite customers slashing their energy use." http://www.mirror.co .uk/advice/money/ene rgy/2011/08/10/npowe r-condemned-after-pr ice-hike-helps-doubl e-profits-115875-233 33084/ Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:16am Mon 31 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Yorkshire Water is sold in £3bn deal


"Bradford-based Yorkshire Water's owner Kelda has revealed a huge growth in profits on the day it announced it was to be sold for more than £3 billion.

Bosses have agreed to sell all of its shares to a newly-founded consortium called Saltaire Water, which includes banking giant HSBC.

The group is also made up of Citigroup unit Citi Infrastructure Investors, GIC Special Investments and Infracapital Partners and has offered 1,090p in cash per share plus the right to a 10.65p interim dividend.

The announcement caused bosses to bring forward the publication of the interim results. Kelda boosted operating profits by 8.7 per cent to £184.8 million in the six month period ending on September 30.

The figures increased the interim dividend per share by 15.1 per cent and revenue levels soared to £434.9 million - 5.6 per cent up on last year."

http://mobile.thetel
egraphandargus.co.uk
/business/1860926.Yo
rkshire_Water_is_sol
d_in___3bn_deal/
Yorkshire Water is sold in £3bn deal "Bradford-based Yorkshire Water's owner Kelda has revealed a huge growth in profits on the day it announced it was to be sold for more than £3 billion. Bosses have agreed to sell all of its shares to a newly-founded consortium called Saltaire Water, which includes banking giant HSBC. The group is also made up of Citigroup unit Citi Infrastructure Investors, GIC Special Investments and Infracapital Partners and has offered 1,090p in cash per share plus the right to a 10.65p interim dividend. The announcement caused bosses to bring forward the publication of the interim results. Kelda boosted operating profits by 8.7 per cent to £184.8 million in the six month period ending on September 30. The figures increased the interim dividend per share by 15.1 per cent and revenue levels soared to £434.9 million - 5.6 per cent up on last year." http://mobile.thetel egraphandargus.co.uk /business/1860926.Yo rkshire_Water_is_sol d_in___3bn_deal/ Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:22am Mon 31 Oct 11

RollandSmoke says...

Andy2010 you obviously didn't see my post where I explained that all the banks based in the "City" of London don't pay taxes as the "City" is an independant soverign state, just like the Vatican and the District of Columbia in America. they are exempt from UK taxes. As regards the power companys we all were share holders until Maggie sold them all off. Share holders nowardays hold them shares for on average 10 minuites so how is their input productive to the long term success of the companys? The banks arn't lending money to small businesses any more and even if they did it only takes an Asda or Tescos in a small town to drive a great number of those businesses to the wall. The corruption is rife in this country and all some people can say is "this is just the way it is" or "If you don't like the way the public is getting screwed here we should leave so you can get screwed in peace". I'm glad your enjoying it but your promiscuity is spreading a desease throughout society and if not treated it will cause greater suffering for everyone down the line
Andy2010 you obviously didn't see my post where I explained that all the banks based in the "City" of London don't pay taxes as the "City" is an independant soverign state, just like the Vatican and the District of Columbia in America. they are exempt from UK taxes. As regards the power companys we all were share holders until Maggie sold them all off. Share holders nowardays hold them shares for on average 10 minuites so how is their input productive to the long term success of the companys? The banks arn't lending money to small businesses any more and even if they did it only takes an Asda or Tescos in a small town to drive a great number of those businesses to the wall. The corruption is rife in this country and all some people can say is "this is just the way it is" or "If you don't like the way the public is getting screwed here we should leave so you can get screwed in peace". I'm glad your enjoying it but your promiscuity is spreading a desease throughout society and if not treated it will cause greater suffering for everyone down the line RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

7:35am Mon 31 Oct 11

BD16 says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
RollandSmoke wrote: The cap doffers on here are amusing. "Don't rock the boat, you'll make master angry". Sorry folks but your master is taking the p1ss out of you. When the companys outsourced work or downsized their workforce due to the shiny new equipment that they paid for through government tax breaks, they knew **** well that the tax bill for the unemployment they created was coming to you. They knew that people would get annoyed so they filled the media with storys of benefit cheats and bogus asylum seekers to deflect that anger from them. When the banks failed and were bailed out, no-one questioned why, due to most of them being based in the "city" of London, they had been tax exempt for years and had been paying next to nothing. But no, all our ills are the fault of the unemployed who should go out and get a minimum wage or part time job so as the taxpayer can subsidise their wages and master can make a nice profit. I think there's a bit of Stockholm syndrome going on with the right wing drones. We don't have a choice of politicians anymore, all we have is different shades of Zionists and they are too busy keeping their paymasters happy to give a monkeys about you whether you doff your cap to them or stick your fingers up at them. It doesn't have to be this way and kudos to the occupiers worldwide that are making a stand.
WELL SAID. AT LAST SOMEONE WHO UNDERSTANDS (unlike the rest of the brain-dead Tory **** on this thread).
Talking to yourself. Now that's a sign of madness. Not that we needed any more.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: The cap doffers on here are amusing. "Don't rock the boat, you'll make master angry". Sorry folks but your master is taking the p1ss out of you. When the companys outsourced work or downsized their workforce due to the shiny new equipment that they paid for through government tax breaks, they knew **** well that the tax bill for the unemployment they created was coming to you. They knew that people would get annoyed so they filled the media with storys of benefit cheats and bogus asylum seekers to deflect that anger from them. When the banks failed and were bailed out, no-one questioned why, due to most of them being based in the "city" of London, they had been tax exempt for years and had been paying next to nothing. But no, all our ills are the fault of the unemployed who should go out and get a minimum wage or part time job so as the taxpayer can subsidise their wages and master can make a nice profit. I think there's a bit of Stockholm syndrome going on with the right wing drones. We don't have a choice of politicians anymore, all we have is different shades of Zionists and they are too busy keeping their paymasters happy to give a monkeys about you whether you doff your cap to them or stick your fingers up at them. It doesn't have to be this way and kudos to the occupiers worldwide that are making a stand.[/p][/quote]WELL SAID. AT LAST SOMEONE WHO UNDERSTANDS (unlike the rest of the brain-dead Tory **** on this thread).[/p][/quote]Talking to yourself. Now that's a sign of madness. Not that we needed any more. BD16
  • Score: 0

8:22am Mon 31 Oct 11

TirNaNog says...

SellingEnglandByTheP
ound
wrote:
gaffzilla wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP


ound
wrote:
Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.
Why?
Genetics,probably!
[quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]gaffzilla[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]That is a vile comment. What a repellent piece of crap you must be.[/p][/quote]Why?[/p][/quote]Genetics,probably! TirNaNog
  • Score: 0

8:28am Mon 31 Oct 11

Andy2010 says...

RollandSmoke wrote:
Andy2010 you obviously didn't see my post where I explained that all the banks based in the "City" of London don't pay taxes as the "City" is an independant soverign state, just like the Vatican and the District of Columbia in America. they are exempt from UK taxes. As regards the power companys we all were share holders until Maggie sold them all off. Share holders nowardays hold them shares for on average 10 minuites so how is their input productive to the long term success of the companys? The banks arn't lending money to small businesses any more and even if they did it only takes an Asda or Tescos in a small town to drive a great number of those businesses to the wall. The corruption is rife in this country and all some people can say is "this is just the way it is" or "If you don't like the way the public is getting screwed here we should leave so you can get screwed in peace". I'm glad your enjoying it but your promiscuity is spreading a desease throughout society and if not treated it will cause greater suffering for everyone down the line
What the hell are you on about !!. My wife works for an auditors which audits the banks and works out taxes on profit. Of course they pay tax on profits...billions in fact.

And as you agreed with if you dont like the business ethics of the power companies become a shareholder yourself and and attend the AGM. Your other claims of banks not lending money to small businesses is also completely without substance. Banks are lending millions to small businesses but you know what...they are lending it to businesses with a sound business plan to back to their investment....gone are the heady days of lending money to any tom dick and harry for anything and this is is good thing as is this hadnt been the fiscal policy for years we wouldnt be a mess we are in now.

Also your state corruption is rife everywhere!!....well if it is then do something about it rather than sit behind a keyboard or erect a tent out Bradford Town Hall. Started your own politicial party....is you can back up what you claim and other the public a better way of life then obviously you will win hands down. Cant be bothered ? thought not
[quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: Andy2010 you obviously didn't see my post where I explained that all the banks based in the "City" of London don't pay taxes as the "City" is an independant soverign state, just like the Vatican and the District of Columbia in America. they are exempt from UK taxes. As regards the power companys we all were share holders until Maggie sold them all off. Share holders nowardays hold them shares for on average 10 minuites so how is their input productive to the long term success of the companys? The banks arn't lending money to small businesses any more and even if they did it only takes an Asda or Tescos in a small town to drive a great number of those businesses to the wall. The corruption is rife in this country and all some people can say is "this is just the way it is" or "If you don't like the way the public is getting screwed here we should leave so you can get screwed in peace". I'm glad your enjoying it but your promiscuity is spreading a desease throughout society and if not treated it will cause greater suffering for everyone down the line[/p][/quote]What the hell are you on about !!. My wife works for an auditors which audits the banks and works out taxes on profit. Of course they pay tax on profits...billions in fact. And as you agreed with if you dont like the business ethics of the power companies become a shareholder yourself and and attend the AGM. Your other claims of banks not lending money to small businesses is also completely without substance. Banks are lending millions to small businesses but you know what...they are lending it to businesses with a sound business plan to back to their investment....gone are the heady days of lending money to any tom dick and harry for anything and this is is good thing as is this hadnt been the fiscal policy for years we wouldnt be a mess we are in now. Also your state corruption is rife everywhere!!....well if it is then do something about it rather than sit behind a keyboard or erect a tent out Bradford Town Hall. Started your own politicial party....is you can back up what you claim and other the public a better way of life then obviously you will win hands down. Cant be bothered ? thought not Andy2010
  • Score: 0

8:32am Mon 31 Oct 11

Andy2010 says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
The Straight talker wrote:
Looks like there intent on staying
Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers
But you obviously don't mind the fact that Billionaires like Lord Ashcroft get away with paying NO tax? Or that we are all being screwed by the privately owned power companies who make extortionate profits out of providing an essential basic service? or that the Bankers STILL get their million pound bonuses for doing zilch? idiot.
Short answer no....

Anyone...yes anyone can study and work hard to make a success of their lives and make money...lots of it. Power companies make profit for their shareholders which you are entitled to become..anyone is. Bankers earn billions for the companies they they work for and as anyone who earns money from effectively commission driven profit why shouldnt they earn a lot if they contributed to their employers bottom line not to mention the huge amount of tax they paid back on any of these bonuses. In turn these bank pay billions on profits in tax back to the ecomony. Even if the Government has bailed some of these out they will make vastly more back in taxation. Your and these stupid protestors never stop to consider the bigger picture ever.

These protestors and the others around the globe have every oppurtunity to make something of their lives but choose instead to moan about what is given to them. You know what if you dont like it then move to another country where everything is all fair and lovely....thought not because that place doesnt exist.

People on here moaning about bonuses make me laugh as if for example your company you worked for announced for example a profit share scheme you are all telling me you would turn round and refuse it...of course you wouldnt

The only way this country is going to get back on its feet is by everyone working hard and striving to make something better for themselves and their families. Will it be easy..of course not but rather than pointless protests that will achieve absolutely nothing or rioting just get on with it.

We will love in a democracy and if you dont like it then vote accordingly or why not either stand for election yourselves if you disagree with what all the parties offer.
It's you who doesn't stop to appreciate the bigger picture. You are completely asleep. Your head is in the sand. You will work all your life (if you're lucky) and still die in debt. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The country is NOT skint, it is a lie. The rich have taken all the wealth for themselves and you have believed their B.S. You are an idiot.
I work all my life...yes...is it not my responsibility as a father and husband to provide a good life for my family? or should I moan about everything and claim benefits?

The countries not "skint" is it ? would be interesting to see you back up this wild claim of yours.

Also as stated in earlier posts if you dont like this country and are sick of the "rich" getting richer then do something about it for gods sake.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Straight talker[/bold] wrote: Looks like there intent on staying[/p][/quote]Hope they all freeze to death...lessers the tax payers burden at least....workshy lazy t*ssers[/p][/quote]But you obviously don't mind the fact that Billionaires like Lord Ashcroft get away with paying NO tax? Or that we are all being screwed by the privately owned power companies who make extortionate profits out of providing an essential basic service? or that the Bankers STILL get their million pound bonuses for doing zilch? idiot.[/p][/quote]Short answer no.... Anyone...yes anyone can study and work hard to make a success of their lives and make money...lots of it. Power companies make profit for their shareholders which you are entitled to become..anyone is. Bankers earn billions for the companies they they work for and as anyone who earns money from effectively commission driven profit why shouldnt they earn a lot if they contributed to their employers bottom line not to mention the huge amount of tax they paid back on any of these bonuses. In turn these bank pay billions on profits in tax back to the ecomony. Even if the Government has bailed some of these out they will make vastly more back in taxation. Your and these stupid protestors never stop to consider the bigger picture ever. These protestors and the others around the globe have every oppurtunity to make something of their lives but choose instead to moan about what is given to them. You know what if you dont like it then move to another country where everything is all fair and lovely....thought not because that place doesnt exist. People on here moaning about bonuses make me laugh as if for example your company you worked for announced for example a profit share scheme you are all telling me you would turn round and refuse it...of course you wouldnt The only way this country is going to get back on its feet is by everyone working hard and striving to make something better for themselves and their families. Will it be easy..of course not but rather than pointless protests that will achieve absolutely nothing or rioting just get on with it. We will love in a democracy and if you dont like it then vote accordingly or why not either stand for election yourselves if you disagree with what all the parties offer.[/p][/quote]It's you who doesn't stop to appreciate the bigger picture. You are completely asleep. Your head is in the sand. You will work all your life (if you're lucky) and still die in debt. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The country is NOT skint, it is a lie. The rich have taken all the wealth for themselves and you have believed their B.S. You are an idiot.[/p][/quote]I work all my life...yes...is it not my responsibility as a father and husband to provide a good life for my family? or should I moan about everything and claim benefits? The countries not "skint" is it ? would be interesting to see you back up this wild claim of yours. Also as stated in earlier posts if you dont like this country and are sick of the "rich" getting richer then do something about it for gods sake. Andy2010
  • Score: 0

8:56am Mon 31 Oct 11

Casual Hero says...

"I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job !
To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts.

I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own.
Nuff Said.
"I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job ! To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts. I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own. Nuff Said. Casual Hero
  • Score: 0

9:21am Mon 31 Oct 11

Thee Voice of Reason says...

Why are the tories getting all the blame when Labour didn't do anything about tax evasion in 14 years of being in power?
Why are the tories getting all the blame when Labour didn't do anything about tax evasion in 14 years of being in power? Thee Voice of Reason
  • Score: 0

9:33am Mon 31 Oct 11

Andy2010 says...

Casual Hero wrote:
"I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job !
To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts.

I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own.
Nuff Said.
Well for the record i did actually lose a well paid job a couple of years ago and after taking any job including security and cleaning to make ends meet after a couple of years of trying and about 50 interviews I finally got back to the level I was at so yes I do understand its tough but to blame anyone other than yourself and wallow in self pity is counter productive and achieves nothing.

As for the protestors get behind them all you want...they will achieve nothing..absolutely zilch and would be better of spending their time bettering themselves instead of this timewasting.

As for the youth not being able to achieve anything...what the hell are you on about ? With hard work, study and managing their own finances they can afford everything everyone else can.....but as the riots earlier this year have shown they would much rather have it handed to them all on a plate and think the world owes them a living....well as one taxpayer that has never claimed anything in my life I'm sick of supporting this element of society
[quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: "I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job ! To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts. I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own. Nuff Said.[/p][/quote]Well for the record i did actually lose a well paid job a couple of years ago and after taking any job including security and cleaning to make ends meet after a couple of years of trying and about 50 interviews I finally got back to the level I was at so yes I do understand its tough but to blame anyone other than yourself and wallow in self pity is counter productive and achieves nothing. As for the protestors get behind them all you want...they will achieve nothing..absolutely zilch and would be better of spending their time bettering themselves instead of this timewasting. As for the youth not being able to achieve anything...what the hell are you on about ? With hard work, study and managing their own finances they can afford everything everyone else can.....but as the riots earlier this year have shown they would much rather have it handed to them all on a plate and think the world owes them a living....well as one taxpayer that has never claimed anything in my life I'm sick of supporting this element of society Andy2010
  • Score: 0

9:52am Mon 31 Oct 11

Casual Hero says...

Andy 2010
All very valid observations, however you seem to be ignoring the longer view which is the unsustainability of this economic model - Or should we simply print money (quantitative easing) That would be the Schoolboy solution. The last round of QE converted every £1 of all our money into around 95p. QE used to be called 'devaluation'
The fact is that in 1979 when Maggie and Reagan defettered the Financial sector, it was already broken beyond repair. All they achieved was to defer the inevitable meltdown and make it bigger than it might have been. When the US pulled out of Bretton Woods it was the beginning of the end for Capitalism - Welcome to the end.
Andy 2010 All very valid observations, however you seem to be ignoring the longer view which is the unsustainability of this economic model - Or should we simply print money (quantitative easing) That would be the Schoolboy solution. The last round of QE converted every £1 of all our money into around 95p. QE used to be called 'devaluation' The fact is that in 1979 when Maggie and Reagan defettered the Financial sector, it was already broken beyond repair. All they achieved was to defer the inevitable meltdown and make it bigger than it might have been. When the US pulled out of Bretton Woods it was the beginning of the end for Capitalism - Welcome to the end. Casual Hero
  • Score: 0

10:09am Mon 31 Oct 11

E.goldstein says...

Thee Voice of Reason wrote:
Why are the tories getting all the blame when Labour didn't do anything about tax evasion in 14 years of being in power?
Amen to that. Unfortunately no government in this country is going to radically alter things. The labour government of 1997 onwards had nothing whatsoever in common with the labour Govt of 1945 onward, save for the name. People may still believe they are on the side of working class people, but they proved themselves to be more authoritarian than Thatcher's Tories and took us into 2 dreadful wars. Sone Labour party members are no doubt sincere and compassionate but nothing they do as a party will ever be of consequence ever again.
[quote][p][bold]Thee Voice of Reason[/bold] wrote: Why are the tories getting all the blame when Labour didn't do anything about tax evasion in 14 years of being in power?[/p][/quote]Amen to that. Unfortunately no government in this country is going to radically alter things. The labour government of 1997 onwards had nothing whatsoever in common with the labour Govt of 1945 onward, save for the name. People may still believe they are on the side of working class people, but they proved themselves to be more authoritarian than Thatcher's Tories and took us into 2 dreadful wars. Sone Labour party members are no doubt sincere and compassionate but nothing they do as a party will ever be of consequence ever again. E.goldstein
  • Score: 0

1:50pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Andy2010 wrote:
Casual Hero wrote:
"I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job !
To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts.

I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own.
Nuff Said.
Well for the record i did actually lose a well paid job a couple of years ago and after taking any job including security and cleaning to make ends meet after a couple of years of trying and about 50 interviews I finally got back to the level I was at so yes I do understand its tough but to blame anyone other than yourself and wallow in self pity is counter productive and achieves nothing.

As for the protestors get behind them all you want...they will achieve nothing..absolutely zilch and would be better of spending their time bettering themselves instead of this timewasting.

As for the youth not being able to achieve anything...what the hell are you on about ? With hard work, study and managing their own finances they can afford everything everyone else can.....but as the riots earlier this year have shown they would much rather have it handed to them all on a plate and think the world owes them a living....well as one taxpayer that has never claimed anything in my life I'm sick of supporting this element of society
The riots were inevitable, I saw it coming and had predicted it a year in advance. What's more, that was just the tip of the iceberg, there will undoubtedly be more riots, perhaps even civil war. We are about to witness the total breakdown of society. There will be tens of millions out of work, many millions made homeless, and complete lawlessness will ensue.
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: "I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job ! To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts. I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own. Nuff Said.[/p][/quote]Well for the record i did actually lose a well paid job a couple of years ago and after taking any job including security and cleaning to make ends meet after a couple of years of trying and about 50 interviews I finally got back to the level I was at so yes I do understand its tough but to blame anyone other than yourself and wallow in self pity is counter productive and achieves nothing. As for the protestors get behind them all you want...they will achieve nothing..absolutely zilch and would be better of spending their time bettering themselves instead of this timewasting. As for the youth not being able to achieve anything...what the hell are you on about ? With hard work, study and managing their own finances they can afford everything everyone else can.....but as the riots earlier this year have shown they would much rather have it handed to them all on a plate and think the world owes them a living....well as one taxpayer that has never claimed anything in my life I'm sick of supporting this element of society[/p][/quote]The riots were inevitable, I saw it coming and had predicted it a year in advance. What's more, that was just the tip of the iceberg, there will undoubtedly be more riots, perhaps even civil war. We are about to witness the total breakdown of society. There will be tens of millions out of work, many millions made homeless, and complete lawlessness will ensue. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

2:50pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Andy2010 says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
Casual Hero wrote:
"I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job !
To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts.

I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own.
Nuff Said.
Well for the record i did actually lose a well paid job a couple of years ago and after taking any job including security and cleaning to make ends meet after a couple of years of trying and about 50 interviews I finally got back to the level I was at so yes I do understand its tough but to blame anyone other than yourself and wallow in self pity is counter productive and achieves nothing.

As for the protestors get behind them all you want...they will achieve nothing..absolutely zilch and would be better of spending their time bettering themselves instead of this timewasting.

As for the youth not being able to achieve anything...what the hell are you on about ? With hard work, study and managing their own finances they can afford everything everyone else can.....but as the riots earlier this year have shown they would much rather have it handed to them all on a plate and think the world owes them a living....well as one taxpayer that has never claimed anything in my life I'm sick of supporting this element of society
The riots were inevitable, I saw it coming and had predicted it a year in advance. What's more, that was just the tip of the iceberg, there will undoubtedly be more riots, perhaps even civil war. We are about to witness the total breakdown of society. There will be tens of millions out of work, many millions made homeless, and complete lawlessness will ensue.
And fire will decend from heaven, the oceans will rise and we will all die....u watch too many films....idiot
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: "I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job ! To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts. I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own. Nuff Said.[/p][/quote]Well for the record i did actually lose a well paid job a couple of years ago and after taking any job including security and cleaning to make ends meet after a couple of years of trying and about 50 interviews I finally got back to the level I was at so yes I do understand its tough but to blame anyone other than yourself and wallow in self pity is counter productive and achieves nothing. As for the protestors get behind them all you want...they will achieve nothing..absolutely zilch and would be better of spending their time bettering themselves instead of this timewasting. As for the youth not being able to achieve anything...what the hell are you on about ? With hard work, study and managing their own finances they can afford everything everyone else can.....but as the riots earlier this year have shown they would much rather have it handed to them all on a plate and think the world owes them a living....well as one taxpayer that has never claimed anything in my life I'm sick of supporting this element of society[/p][/quote]The riots were inevitable, I saw it coming and had predicted it a year in advance. What's more, that was just the tip of the iceberg, there will undoubtedly be more riots, perhaps even civil war. We are about to witness the total breakdown of society. There will be tens of millions out of work, many millions made homeless, and complete lawlessness will ensue.[/p][/quote]And fire will decend from heaven, the oceans will rise and we will all die....u watch too many films....idiot Andy2010
  • Score: 0

4:22pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Waynus71 says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP ound wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight!
Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.
You going to take a week off work to join the fight then? No, instead you are happy for the dole-dossing scroungers to do it for you.
.
I think we should have a separate 'camp-out' in protest to these protesters being paid "job seekers allowance", when it is obvious they have NO INTENTION of seeking employment.
.
It's things like that that have put this country in the mess it is, NOT JUST the City Bankers.....!!!
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: Another gathering of the great unwashed, hope it poors it down and then drops below zero tonight![/p][/quote]Your attitude stinks mate. People like you disgust me. You are what's wrong with this country. We should all support those brave souls who take it upon themselves to protest on YOUR behalf, you cretin. The company directors give themselves a 50% pay rise whilst everyone else has their pay frozen or cut, or have lost their jobs. Capitalism is based upon pure greed and it must now stop. The bankers still get their millions of££ bonuses, while others have to decide whether to buy food or warmth. Workers are treeted like sh1te and expected to work for minimum wage until they drop. Enough is enough. Stand up for what you believe in, stand up for your rights, take back what belongs to you, ie. ENGLAND.[/p][/quote]You going to take a week off work to join the fight then? No, instead you are happy for the dole-dossing scroungers to do it for you. . I think we should have a separate 'camp-out' in protest to these protesters being paid "job seekers allowance", when it is obvious they have NO INTENTION of seeking employment. . It's things like that that have put this country in the mess it is, NOT JUST the City Bankers.....!!! Waynus71
  • Score: 0

4:28pm Mon 31 Oct 11

lonniejockstrap says...

cormon wrote:
Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!!
The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have -
a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority
b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity
c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one.
d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did.
As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner.
Nice one!
[quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Amazing isn't it? Three tents go up in Centenary Square and we have the biggest outpouring of political expression since the Poll Tax riots!! The antagonistic views show just how polarised the public have become. We have - a) The lemmings - those who can't stand to own up to the obvious fact that they have been consistently ripped off by the uber rich and greedy for the past 30 years. They read the 'Daily Drivel', work hard doing two or three jobs to make ends meet; always pay their taxes, believe democracy still exists; would never ask a serious question if their lives depended on it, believe in Little England and always defer to authority b) - The atavists. They believe that democracy still works and that all that needs to be done is to have another election and hope that Miliband turns into Miliorchestra and waves a magic wand to restore some sanity c) - The conventional Left - firmly believe in the principles of Marx. It's now time for the Revolution and we won't get fooled again if we have one. d) - The Futurists - including the Occupancy Movement, elements of the thinking and informed young, the wise and the cynical. They know the system is structurally flawed. They know we've got 8 trillion poundsworth of debt (7 times more than Italy which is considered to be in financial difficulty); they know the system is unsustainable; they know that politicians are part of the problem, not a solution. They don't know the answers, but they do know that questions need to be asked, and they do know that supporting Greed as humanity's primary value, will guarantee that we don't remain as a species for a fraction of the time that the dinosaurs did. As most people in the uk fall into category a) I guess that complete social and economic collapse is just round the corner.[/p][/quote]Nice one! lonniejockstrap
  • Score: 0

5:24pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

It would be even nicer if Corman could answer the couple of simple questions I asked him earlier in the thread. Unfortunately this seems to be beyond his capabilities. There is absolutely no point in posting all these fine words if you are not prepared to be questioned on your lifestyle. If you want the public to take notice you have to be transparent and honest, otherwise, you are no better than the politicians that you despise. You just have a different disguise.
It would be even nicer if Corman could answer the couple of simple questions I asked him earlier in the thread. Unfortunately this seems to be beyond his capabilities. There is absolutely no point in posting all these fine words if you are not prepared to be questioned on your lifestyle. If you want the public to take notice you have to be transparent and honest, otherwise, you are no better than the politicians that you despise. You just have a different disguise. Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

5:35pm Mon 31 Oct 11

RollandSmoke says...

I was just about to set off into Bradford to attend the event advertised on facebook for 6:30pm. Luckly I checked facebook and found out that 2 hours ago they changed the time of the event to the 6th of January. Why? Are protesters going to camp out for over two months before trying to get the momentum going? I should imagine that in two months time the whole movement will have either have made their point or been crushed by the powers that be. There are another 66 people supposed to be attending this event and if they don't get the message that it's been postponed will be annoyed by the wasted trip. This does nothing for the credibility of the occupy Bradford protesters.
I was just about to set off into Bradford to attend the event advertised on facebook for 6:30pm. Luckly I checked facebook and found out that 2 hours ago they changed the time of the event to the 6th of January. Why? Are protesters going to camp out for over two months before trying to get the momentum going? I should imagine that in two months time the whole movement will have either have made their point or been crushed by the powers that be. There are another 66 people supposed to be attending this event and if they don't get the message that it's been postponed will be annoyed by the wasted trip. This does nothing for the credibility of the occupy Bradford protesters. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

5:41pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

RollandSmoke wrote:
I was just about to set off into Bradford to attend the event advertised on facebook for 6:30pm. Luckly I checked facebook and found out that 2 hours ago they changed the time of the event to the 6th of January. Why? Are protesters going to camp out for over two months before trying to get the momentum going? I should imagine that in two months time the whole movement will have either have made their point or been crushed by the powers that be. There are another 66 people supposed to be attending this event and if they don't get the message that it's been postponed will be annoyed by the wasted trip. This does nothing for the credibility of the occupy Bradford protesters.
I hope you get a valid response from Aunty, Rolly.......but I wouldn't hold your breath.
[quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: I was just about to set off into Bradford to attend the event advertised on facebook for 6:30pm. Luckly I checked facebook and found out that 2 hours ago they changed the time of the event to the 6th of January. Why? Are protesters going to camp out for over two months before trying to get the momentum going? I should imagine that in two months time the whole movement will have either have made their point or been crushed by the powers that be. There are another 66 people supposed to be attending this event and if they don't get the message that it's been postponed will be annoyed by the wasted trip. This does nothing for the credibility of the occupy Bradford protesters.[/p][/quote]I hope you get a valid response from Aunty, Rolly.......but I wouldn't hold your breath. Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

6:12pm Mon 31 Oct 11

lonniejockstrap says...

Where has all the money being pumped into the Banks in order to stop them going Bankrupt come from? What is it that is backing the value of all that 'invented' money? Gold? Silver? Nup! Somebody simply types a few numbers followed by a dozen or so zeros into a computer and hey presto! the Banks are saved. BUT, BUT, BUT!!!! If there is no Gold, no Silver etc to support the value of this invented money -produced from thin air- what IS being used as security for all this computer money? Well, it is you dear Tax-payer! You and your ability to pay Tax on your wage, Tax on the clothes you buy, the Tax you pay for driving on the roads, the Tax on the interest on your savings, Inheritance Tax, Capital gains Tax, Council Tax, etc, etc, etc.
.
You dear Tax-payers are the 'Gold and Silver' that is helping to prop-up a very one-sided economic system whereby we pay for all the mismanagement and corruption costs -not to mention wars- through paying Tax. The big money INVENTING and lending boys of course charge interest on this magically created money. What's to stop OUR 'Government' deciding to print/invent IT'S OWN MONEY without, thus, having to pay interest on EVERY SINGLE PENNY that it created?
.
Do you think we would still have to be Taxed to death? Do you think our Governments would be less or more democratic? And,would it be less influenced by the 'organisations' that it has effectively borrowed this invented money from?
.
And before anyone asks, yes, I am and have worked for 99% of my working life, paid and are still paying my Taxes, I have no debt, and yes, I support the protesters that are camping in Centenary Square.
.
'In a way, the world-view of the Party imposed itself most successfully on people incapable of understanding it. They could be made to accept the most flagrant violations of reality, because they never fully grasped the enormity of what was demanded of them, and were not sufficiently interested in public events to notice what was happening. By lack of understanding they remained sane. They simply swallowed everything, and what they swallowed did them no harm, because it left no residue behind, just as a grain of corn will pass undigested through the body of a bird'. (George Orwell's 1984)
Where has all the money being pumped into the Banks in order to stop them going Bankrupt come from? What is it that is backing the value of all that 'invented' money? Gold? Silver? Nup! Somebody simply types a few numbers followed by a dozen or so zeros into a computer and hey presto! the Banks are saved. BUT, BUT, BUT!!!! If there is no Gold, no Silver etc to support the value of this invented money -produced from thin air- what IS being used as security for all this computer money? Well, it is you dear Tax-payer! You and your ability to pay Tax on your wage, Tax on the clothes you buy, the Tax you pay for driving on the roads, the Tax on the interest on your savings, Inheritance Tax, Capital gains Tax, Council Tax, etc, etc, etc. . You dear Tax-payers are the 'Gold and Silver' that is helping to prop-up a very one-sided economic system whereby we pay for all the mismanagement and corruption costs -not to mention wars- through paying Tax. The big money INVENTING and lending boys of course charge interest on this magically created money. What's to stop OUR 'Government' deciding to print/invent IT'S OWN MONEY without, thus, having to pay interest on EVERY SINGLE PENNY that it created? . Do you think we would still have to be Taxed to death? Do you think our Governments would be less or more democratic? And,would it be less influenced by the 'organisations' that it has effectively borrowed this invented money from? . And before anyone asks, yes, I am and have worked for 99% of my working life, paid and are still paying my Taxes, I have no debt, and yes, I support the protesters that are camping in Centenary Square. . 'In a way, the world-view of the Party imposed itself most successfully on people incapable of understanding it. They could be made to accept the most flagrant violations of reality, because they never fully grasped the enormity of what was demanded of them, and were not sufficiently interested in public events to notice what was happening. By lack of understanding they remained sane. They simply swallowed everything, and what they swallowed did them no harm, because it left no residue behind, just as a grain of corn will pass undigested through the body of a bird'. (George Orwell's 1984) lonniejockstrap
  • Score: 0

6:14pm Mon 31 Oct 11

cockadoodledo says...

Time they were moved off now, these are not looking for work! Happy to take the benefits and do nothing in return. Just heard artic weather is heading our way from America.What a shame!!!!!Ha Ha Ha.
Time they were moved off now, these are not looking for work! Happy to take the benefits and do nothing in return. Just heard artic weather is heading our way from America.What a shame!!!!!Ha Ha Ha. cockadoodledo
  • Score: 0

6:47pm Mon 31 Oct 11

RollandSmoke says...

cockadoodledo wrote:
Time they were moved off now, these are not looking for work! Happy to take the benefits and do nothing in return. Just heard artic weather is heading our way from America.What a shame!!!!!Ha Ha Ha.
You really are a knob arn't you? although there seem to be one of many knobs on here with simular attitudes. The whole country is being screwed yourself included and all you can do is attack the people who are making an effort to save YOU taxes, to save YOUR pension. Your attitude seems to be if you don't have a job you shouldn't have an opinion. Well I'll tell you what, if you do have a job you should have an opinion after all you've got more to lose. but you haven't an opinion have you other than "I don't like paying my taxes" well tell you what, don't f'in pay them, after all why should you? If you were a millionaire and paid nothing no-one would bat an eyelid, in fact the cap doffers would jump to your defence. It must say something about the job market when a knob like you has one and educated people with an understanding of how the world works don't.
[quote][p][bold]cockadoodledo[/bold] wrote: Time they were moved off now, these are not looking for work! Happy to take the benefits and do nothing in return. Just heard artic weather is heading our way from America.What a shame!!!!!Ha Ha Ha.[/p][/quote]You really are a knob arn't you? although there seem to be one of many knobs on here with simular attitudes. The whole country is being screwed yourself included and all you can do is attack the people who are making an effort to save YOU taxes, to save YOUR pension. Your attitude seems to be if you don't have a job you shouldn't have an opinion. Well I'll tell you what, if you do have a job you should have an opinion after all you've got more to lose. but you haven't an opinion have you other than "I don't like paying my taxes" well tell you what, don't f'in pay them, after all why should you? If you were a millionaire and paid nothing no-one would bat an eyelid, in fact the cap doffers would jump to your defence. It must say something about the job market when a knob like you has one and educated people with an understanding of how the world works don't. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

7:21pm Mon 31 Oct 11

ra-ra says...

Mr Smoke these people are not making an effort to save me tax and my pension.
Because nothing will become of this protest., all that will happen is the tax payer will have to foot the bill to clean up the mess left behind when you have gone back to your council flat payed by the tax payer.
Mr Smoke these people are not making an effort to save me tax and my pension. Because nothing will become of this protest., all that will happen is the tax payer will have to foot the bill to clean up the mess left behind when you have gone back to your council flat payed by the tax payer. ra-ra
  • Score: 0

7:43pm Mon 31 Oct 11

cormon says...

Good stuff Lonnie - exactly the questions that are being posed across the country. The other sad issue arising out of many of the lemming/troll posts on this blog is the lurking Fascistic gaze that awaits its re-birth. You'd think that anyone who knows anything about our own history would be ashamed to associate themselves with such an obnoxious, obscene and vile set of values.
Sad that the conditions for such a re-manifestation of mass hypnosis are there once again - economic instability and crisis, all but the super rich squeezed, threatened with long term debt, the least well off having all on to survive, politicians who act like played out celebrities without two ideas to rub together. Yes, it's all happened before. Not too long before the yobs and the thugs don the black shirts and express their hatred in naked violence. Brecht warned us that 'the **** that birthed Fascism is in heat again' 30 years ago and Hegel showed us that the one thing we learn from history is that we don't learn from history. How true. For all those who seek to blame anyone who is an easy target for this mess, just look at where your values led the world in the 20's and 30's. They're never too far from the surface and it's sad that too many have not learned from them. Understanding and asking questions are better strategies than ignorance, fear and prejudice in any human value system.
Good stuff Lonnie - exactly the questions that are being posed across the country. The other sad issue arising out of many of the lemming/troll posts on this blog is the lurking Fascistic gaze that awaits its re-birth. You'd think that anyone who knows anything about our own history would be ashamed to associate themselves with such an obnoxious, obscene and vile set of values. Sad that the conditions for such a re-manifestation of mass hypnosis are there once again - economic instability and crisis, all but the super rich squeezed, threatened with long term debt, the least well off having all on to survive, politicians who act like played out celebrities without two ideas to rub together. Yes, it's all happened before. Not too long before the yobs and the thugs don the black shirts and express their hatred in naked violence. Brecht warned us that 'the **** that birthed Fascism is in heat again' 30 years ago and Hegel showed us that the one thing we learn from history is that we don't learn from history. How true. For all those who seek to blame anyone who is an easy target for this mess, just look at where your values led the world in the 20's and 30's. They're never too far from the surface and it's sad that too many have not learned from them. Understanding and asking questions are better strategies than ignorance, fear and prejudice in any human value system. cormon
  • Score: 0

8:02pm Mon 31 Oct 11

RollandSmoke says...

ra-ra wrote:
Mr Smoke these people are not making an effort to save me tax and my pension. Because nothing will become of this protest., all that will happen is the tax payer will have to foot the bill to clean up the mess left behind when you have gone back to your council flat payed by the tax payer.
Oh your right it's pointless trying to change anything because everyones so very happy with the status quo. We should all just lube up so it doesn't chaffe so much. From what I've seen of these protests over the last six weeks they are conducted in a way that doesn't need much of a clean up until the police come in all heavy handed and smash everything up. To be honest the more I witness the head up the backside attitude of the "tax payers" the less guilty I feel about taking their money. It's obvious they have no problem with getting ripped off although it seems some really dislike the unemployed getting any money that the government could be using to kill brown people in far away lands.
[quote][p][bold]ra-ra[/bold] wrote: Mr Smoke these people are not making an effort to save me tax and my pension. Because nothing will become of this protest., all that will happen is the tax payer will have to foot the bill to clean up the mess left behind when you have gone back to your council flat payed by the tax payer.[/p][/quote]Oh your right it's pointless trying to change anything because everyones so very happy with the status quo. We should all just lube up so it doesn't chaffe so much. From what I've seen of these protests over the last six weeks they are conducted in a way that doesn't need much of a clean up until the police come in all heavy handed and smash everything up. To be honest the more I witness the head up the backside attitude of the "tax payers" the less guilty I feel about taking their money. It's obvious they have no problem with getting ripped off although it seems some really dislike the unemployed getting any money that the government could be using to kill brown people in far away lands. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

8:24pm Mon 31 Oct 11

lonniejockstrap says...

For anyone who wishes to 'broaden' their awareness of what systems we are working under (whether benefiting from or loosing out under) and how powerless, cowardly or ignorant our politicians are, to be able help prevent the cyclical economic recessions:
.
http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?v=AgKFLk9xf
fA&feature=related

http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?feature=fvw
p&v=AynGBMUgdmg&NR=1
For anyone who wishes to 'broaden' their awareness of what systems we are working under (whether benefiting from or loosing out under) and how powerless, cowardly or ignorant our politicians are, to be able help prevent the cyclical economic recessions: . http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=AgKFLk9xf fA&feature=related http://www.youtube.c om/watch?feature=fvw p&v=AynGBMUgdmg&NR=1 lonniejockstrap
  • Score: 0

8:26pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Right..I've read through this thread and there's a couple of question nobody's asked yet, or at least had a reasonable reply to.

What is the ultimate aim of the protesters and if they achieve it, what do they propose to do then?

It doesn't need a cut n paste job or another condescending response, just answer the question.
Right..I've read through this thread and there's a couple of question nobody's asked yet, or at least had a reasonable reply to. What is the ultimate aim of the protesters and if they achieve it, what do they propose to do then? It doesn't need a cut n paste job or another condescending response, just answer the question. Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

9:05pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Well the silence is deafening. Where's Lonnie and Rolly and Aunty and cormon when all that is required is a simple answer and not a long political diatribe to show how very clever you all are at getting one over on those who have concerns about your ideas. Are you all Napoleons and Snowballs underneath?
Well the silence is deafening. Where's Lonnie and Rolly and Aunty and cormon when all that is required is a simple answer and not a long political diatribe to show how very clever you all are at getting one over on those who have concerns about your ideas. Are you all Napoleons and Snowballs underneath? Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

9:07pm Mon 31 Oct 11

RollandSmoke says...

Oldwestbowling wrote:
Right..I've read through this thread and there's a couple of question nobody's asked yet, or at least had a reasonable reply to. What is the ultimate aim of the protesters and if they achieve it, what do they propose to do then? It doesn't need a cut n paste job or another condescending response, just answer the question.
I can only give my opinion of what I would like to see happen as I am not conected with the protests as yet. It shouldn't be simply a call to tax the rich as it's relitive and most of them do pay their taxes anyway. Plus you run the risk of making the small business man or entrepreneur unable to do business and generate jobs what needs to change is the numerous tax loopholes that the mega rich use to avoid paying much if any tax. The tax havens that are used to launder their money need serious scrutiny. If the large companys that are monopolising our highstreets and service industries were paying the same taxes as anyone else in business then the small businesses would stand a chance of competing with them, which is supposedly what capitalists want to keep prices down, then the wealth and jobs would be more evenly spread throughout society rather than just being horded by a very few. If the major companys can afford to pay out a fortune for lobbyists, corperate hospitality, advertising ect then they can afford to pay the tax they should. The business startups need a fighting chance of competing with the big companys.
[quote][p][bold]Oldwestbowling[/bold] wrote: Right..I've read through this thread and there's a couple of question nobody's asked yet, or at least had a reasonable reply to. What is the ultimate aim of the protesters and if they achieve it, what do they propose to do then? It doesn't need a cut n paste job or another condescending response, just answer the question.[/p][/quote]I can only give my opinion of what I would like to see happen as I am not conected with the protests as yet. It shouldn't be simply a call to tax the rich as it's relitive and most of them do pay their taxes anyway. Plus you run the risk of making the small business man or entrepreneur unable to do business and generate jobs what needs to change is the numerous tax loopholes that the mega rich use to avoid paying much if any tax. The tax havens that are used to launder their money need serious scrutiny. If the large companys that are monopolising our highstreets and service industries were paying the same taxes as anyone else in business then the small businesses would stand a chance of competing with them, which is supposedly what capitalists want to keep prices down, then the wealth and jobs would be more evenly spread throughout society rather than just being horded by a very few. If the major companys can afford to pay out a fortune for lobbyists, corperate hospitality, advertising ect then they can afford to pay the tax they should. The business startups need a fighting chance of competing with the big companys. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

9:45pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Thanks Rolly and I do agree with the points you've made about the major companies who are evading tax. However, I'm still at a loss to understand what the protesters eventually want their ultimate outcome to be. Do they want to overthrow the government (hinted at by Aunty) and if so, what then? Someone has to govern whether we like it or not. I'll be honest with you, if the comments of the pro- protestors on here, and I realise they're a mere handful, are indicative of the main, then I'll pass, ta very much. They can't answer a straight question and are dismissive of most posters concerns and have been condescending and rude at times. Remind you of anybody? Politicians, perhaps?
Thanks Rolly and I do agree with the points you've made about the major companies who are evading tax. However, I'm still at a loss to understand what the protesters eventually want their ultimate outcome to be. Do they want to overthrow the government (hinted at by Aunty) and if so, what then? Someone has to govern whether we like it or not. I'll be honest with you, if the comments of the pro- protestors on here, and I realise they're a mere handful, are indicative of the main, then I'll pass, ta very much. They can't answer a straight question and are dismissive of most posters concerns and have been condescending and rude at times. Remind you of anybody? Politicians, perhaps? Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

9:46pm Mon 31 Oct 11

lonniejockstrap says...

Oldwestbowling wrote:
Right..I've read through this thread and there's a couple of question nobody's asked yet, or at least had a reasonable reply to.

What is the ultimate aim of the protesters and if they achieve it, what do they propose to do then?

It doesn't need a cut n paste job or another condescending response, just answer the question.
Patience OWB. I do have a life away from here.
.
I don't know what the 'ultimate aim' is! What is the ultimate aim of any protest other than to raise awareness and hopefully gain support for change or action? I am not anti rich. I am not anti capitalist per se. But IF a system exists on the basis that badly run and inefficient businesses should be left to collapse then why are the 'Tax payers' footing the bill for propping up failed financial institutions?
.
It is my understanding that THE Capitalist Nation of all Nations, the USA, put money into failed Banking institutions (QE) to the value equivalent to $30, 000 for each American citizen! Now, is it a Capitalist system or is it not?
.
The people who gain the least from this system those on low wages and paying the highest Taxes % wise are having to 'bail-out' a system that will quite happily throw those people on the scrapheap and shut down their employers business if their employer can't pay back their loans -plus interest of course- to those same institutions they have just rescued. Why do the Capitalist rules only apply to certain participants of the system?
[quote][p][bold]Oldwestbowling[/bold] wrote: Right..I've read through this thread and there's a couple of question nobody's asked yet, or at least had a reasonable reply to. What is the ultimate aim of the protesters and if they achieve it, what do they propose to do then? It doesn't need a cut n paste job or another condescending response, just answer the question.[/p][/quote]Patience OWB. I do have a life away from here. . I don't know what the 'ultimate aim' is! What is the ultimate aim of any protest other than to raise awareness and hopefully gain support for change or action? I am not anti rich. I am not anti capitalist per se. But IF a system exists on the basis that badly run and inefficient businesses should be left to collapse then why are the 'Tax payers' footing the bill for propping up failed financial institutions? . It is my understanding that THE Capitalist Nation of all Nations, the USA, put money into failed Banking institutions (QE) to the value equivalent to $30, 000 for each American citizen! Now, is it a Capitalist system or is it not? . The people who gain the least from this system those on low wages and paying the highest Taxes % wise are having to 'bail-out' a system that will quite happily throw those people on the scrapheap and shut down their employers business if their employer can't pay back their loans -plus interest of course- to those same institutions they have just rescued. Why do the Capitalist rules only apply to certain participants of the system? lonniejockstrap
  • Score: 0

10:17pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Cheers lonnie, I am a bit impatient! I cannot disagree with any of your comments because they do make sense. How could anyone, if they call themselves a socialist, not be for the protest after reading your remarks and yet I fear that there is another side to the protestors that we haven't seen yet. I also wonder how many of the London protesters have had a privileged upbringing and are now railing against the very system that gave them this advantage.
Cheers lonnie, I am a bit impatient! I cannot disagree with any of your comments because they do make sense. How could anyone, if they call themselves a socialist, not be for the protest after reading your remarks and yet I fear that there is another side to the protestors that we haven't seen yet. I also wonder how many of the London protesters have had a privileged upbringing and are now railing against the very system that gave them this advantage. Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

10:29pm Mon 31 Oct 11

RollandSmoke says...

Oldwestbowling wrote:
Thanks Rolly and I do agree with the points you've made about the major companies who are evading tax. However, I'm still at a loss to understand what the protesters eventually want their ultimate outcome to be. Do they want to overthrow the government (hinted at by Aunty) and if so, what then? Someone has to govern whether we like it or not. I'll be honest with you, if the comments of the pro- protestors on here, and I realise they're a mere handful, are indicative of the main, then I'll pass, ta very much. They can't answer a straight question and are dismissive of most posters concerns and have been condescending and rude at times. Remind you of anybody? Politicians, perhaps?
With all due respect if you look at the sustained attacks that the pro-protesters are getting from the anti-protesters who lable them potsmoking, dole dossing, unwashed layabouts with no right to an opinion even though they themselves have nothing constructive to offer to the debate. And the suggestion that it would be great if they were to freeze to death or just get out of the country then you start to understand the dismissive attitude. When it becomes obvious that people would rather go on the attack when you explain something they may not be fully aware of rather than question and gain understanding it becomes very tempting to be condescending and rude in reply. I don't believe we need to get rid of government, we do however need to remind them that they work for us, not the banks, not the lobbyists, not the big corporations or big pharma, but us, the people who put them in office. I nearly said it's us that voted them into power but power is, or should be the wrong word. They are public servants and the only interests they should be serving is that of the public.
[quote][p][bold]Oldwestbowling[/bold] wrote: Thanks Rolly and I do agree with the points you've made about the major companies who are evading tax. However, I'm still at a loss to understand what the protesters eventually want their ultimate outcome to be. Do they want to overthrow the government (hinted at by Aunty) and if so, what then? Someone has to govern whether we like it or not. I'll be honest with you, if the comments of the pro- protestors on here, and I realise they're a mere handful, are indicative of the main, then I'll pass, ta very much. They can't answer a straight question and are dismissive of most posters concerns and have been condescending and rude at times. Remind you of anybody? Politicians, perhaps?[/p][/quote]With all due respect if you look at the sustained attacks that the pro-protesters are getting from the anti-protesters who lable them potsmoking, dole dossing, unwashed layabouts with no right to an opinion even though they themselves have nothing constructive to offer to the debate. And the suggestion that it would be great if they were to freeze to death or just get out of the country then you start to understand the dismissive attitude. When it becomes obvious that people would rather go on the attack when you explain something they may not be fully aware of rather than question and gain understanding it becomes very tempting to be condescending and rude in reply. I don't believe we need to get rid of government, we do however need to remind them that they work for us, not the banks, not the lobbyists, not the big corporations or big pharma, but us, the people who put them in office. I nearly said it's us that voted them into power but power is, or should be the wrong word. They are public servants and the only interests they should be serving is that of the public. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

11:18pm Mon 31 Oct 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Fair enough Rolly. I've read yours and Lonnie's post thoroughly and have to say that you're changing my mind on the protest, which I did think was a complete and utter waste of time. If change could be brought about that can only be a good thing, but it's a big ask. I suppose I'm one who wants the change but not the upheaval that would bring it about and my pessimistic attitude doesn't help either. The thing is those of us who are on the fence, so to speak, need to be able to feel we're not being hoodwinked by those who are trying to bring about change and who would then want the power for themselves.

Perhaps the time has come for the protesters to try a different tack, start their own co-operative so to speak, in the form of new building societies, perhaps. But only as long as they don't sell out to the banks!
Fair enough Rolly. I've read yours and Lonnie's post thoroughly and have to say that you're changing my mind on the protest, which I did think was a complete and utter waste of time. If change could be brought about that can only be a good thing, but it's a big ask. I suppose I'm one who wants the change but not the upheaval that would bring it about and my pessimistic attitude doesn't help either. The thing is those of us who are on the fence, so to speak, need to be able to feel we're not being hoodwinked by those who are trying to bring about change and who would then want the power for themselves. Perhaps the time has come for the protesters to try a different tack, start their own co-operative so to speak, in the form of new building societies, perhaps. But only as long as they don't sell out to the banks! Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

12:09am Tue 1 Nov 11

Patrick Bateman says...

Personally I support the protests. I’m not sure what they’ll achieve but at the very least they are raising people’s awareness about the worst excesses of capitalism and corporate greed. Although I’m largely in favour of the capitalist system it is becoming increasingly clear there are major – probably fundamental – problems with it. This has always been the case but without question has still been preferable to a more command-style economic alternative. That said the division of wealth and the widening inequality between the two ends of the social spectrum (and for that matter the middle classes and the economic elites) is that wide that the old argument – ‘the trickle-down effect’ – seems increasingly moribund. If these protests can in any way **** the consciences of the ultra-wealthy (or failing that give them pause for thought about the social unrest that may ensue if we carry on with the current trajectory) then they will have been worthwhile.
Personally I support the protests. I’m not sure what they’ll achieve but at the very least they are raising people’s awareness about the worst excesses of capitalism and corporate greed. Although I’m largely in favour of the capitalist system it is becoming increasingly clear there are major – probably fundamental – problems with it. This has always been the case but without question has still been preferable to a more command-style economic alternative. That said the division of wealth and the widening inequality between the two ends of the social spectrum (and for that matter the middle classes and the economic elites) is that wide that the old argument – ‘the trickle-down effect’ – seems increasingly moribund. If these protests can in any way **** the consciences of the ultra-wealthy (or failing that give them pause for thought about the social unrest that may ensue if we carry on with the current trajectory) then they will have been worthwhile. Patrick Bateman
  • Score: 0

12:12am Tue 1 Nov 11

Patrick Bateman says...

Lol! the starred-out word was 'pr1ck' (should have realised that would never have sneaked past the filter..!)
Lol! the starred-out word was 'pr1ck' (should have realised that would never have sneaked past the filter..!) Patrick Bateman
  • Score: 0

4:38am Tue 1 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

Andy2010 wrote:
Casual Hero wrote: "I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job ! To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts. I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own. Nuff Said.
Well for the record i did actually lose a well paid job a couple of years ago and after taking any job including security and cleaning to make ends meet after a couple of years of trying and about 50 interviews I finally got back to the level I was at so yes I do understand its tough but to blame anyone other than yourself and wallow in self pity is counter productive and achieves nothing. As for the protestors get behind them all you want...they will achieve nothing..absolutely zilch and would be better of spending their time bettering themselves instead of this timewasting. As for the youth not being able to achieve anything...what the hell are you on about ? With hard work, study and managing their own finances they can afford everything everyone else can.....but as the riots earlier this year have shown they would much rather have it handed to them all on a plate and think the world owes them a living....well as one taxpayer that has never claimed anything in my life I'm sick of supporting this element of society
Nice to hear some common sense being spoken in the above. Things change and the economy is cyclical. If you can't get a job or have a job that you don't like then retrain or relocate. It's better to use a bit of common sense then spout book economics or cause problems for people trying to earn an honest living as has been seen in London with two people having to resign. Those protestors ought to be ashamed.

What's happened with the economy has happened it's time that everyone stops being so negative and tries to move forward. The economy is not straight forward and I think the key is that mistakes of the past are learnt from regardless of what people's views are on capitalism. This won't happen overnight and will take time.

Personally I think there are always more than one way to look at a system as an example there are many people out there more than happy to pop out a kid out of wedlock in order to get a house and not have to work. For me personally that is just as bad as directors raking in millions (and let's be honest how many of us could manage/direct a FTSE100 company) but then again it's those taxes from people earning, regardless of the level of earnings that pays for those in need. On another side of the argument are those people who are working and saving very hard to do things "right" by saving for a house deposit and/or marriage before considering kids which restricts them for a number of years. It's not a fair system in anyone's eyes and never will be. That's life so it's time to get on with it and forget about the intricacies of a system out of everybody's hands and try to be positive as to what we do have. I actually believe the biggest change that could happen in Bradford is if the majority started acting positively, now I know that some will say "What is there to be positive about" etc but open your eyes and see the long term potential.

I'd be very interested to hear how emigration causes problems as mentioned by E.Goldstein. Net migration in the UK from 1991-2008 was positive meaning more tax payers entering the country than leaving. Not a sensible comment! However if you want to discuss how other countries such as Australia only allow 'positive' immigration as opposted to the UK then that would be a sensible discussion.

I have to say if anyone's going to be the new Guy Fawkes it has to be AuntyCapitalist I think they've seen V for Vendetta a few too many times! (No offence AuntyCapitalist I'm only joking! - I WAS about to say that until you commented that there was going to be civil war. I actually now think you may have been watching too many films).

On a more serious note it's all well and good to protest whether it's by camping out or rioting but alongside that if your views are strong enough, and sensible it is possible for anybody to form a political party (Common Sense party anyone?) and make a change using a channel that might actually work. Destruction, negativity and criticism are great for venting justified anger but don't actually improve things do they?
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: "I'm alright Jack" works OK until it's your turn to lose your job ! To not back this protest is an Ostrich approach to things, the Banks have invented wealth through lending and interest charges which is not underwritten by anything! Only by relending this ficticious wealth does it continue to exist, and this is YOUR pension funds. When you all realise that they have run off with your Pension, you may decide to join with these very wise people who are just a bit ahead of you with their facts. I am 100% behind these protestors - they are fighting for the future disenfranchised generation who at present cannot even dream of a full lifes employment, or owning a home or affording a family of their own. Nuff Said.[/p][/quote]Well for the record i did actually lose a well paid job a couple of years ago and after taking any job including security and cleaning to make ends meet after a couple of years of trying and about 50 interviews I finally got back to the level I was at so yes I do understand its tough but to blame anyone other than yourself and wallow in self pity is counter productive and achieves nothing. As for the protestors get behind them all you want...they will achieve nothing..absolutely zilch and would be better of spending their time bettering themselves instead of this timewasting. As for the youth not being able to achieve anything...what the hell are you on about ? With hard work, study and managing their own finances they can afford everything everyone else can.....but as the riots earlier this year have shown they would much rather have it handed to them all on a plate and think the world owes them a living....well as one taxpayer that has never claimed anything in my life I'm sick of supporting this element of society[/p][/quote]Nice to hear some common sense being spoken in the above. Things change and the economy is cyclical. If you can't get a job or have a job that you don't like then retrain or relocate. It's better to use a bit of common sense then spout book economics or cause problems for people trying to earn an honest living as has been seen in London with two people having to resign. Those protestors ought to be ashamed. What's happened with the economy has happened it's time that everyone stops being so negative and tries to move forward. The economy is not straight forward and I think the key is that mistakes of the past are learnt from regardless of what people's views are on capitalism. This won't happen overnight and will take time. Personally I think there are always more than one way to look at a system as an example there are many people out there more than happy to pop out a kid out of wedlock in order to get a house and not have to work. For me personally that is just as bad as directors raking in millions (and let's be honest how many of us could manage/direct a FTSE100 company) but then again it's those taxes from people earning, regardless of the level of earnings that pays for those in need. On another side of the argument are those people who are working and saving very hard to do things "right" by saving for a house deposit and/or marriage before considering kids which restricts them for a number of years. It's not a fair system in anyone's eyes and never will be. That's life so it's time to get on with it and forget about the intricacies of a system out of everybody's hands and try to be positive as to what we do have. I actually believe the biggest change that could happen in Bradford is if the majority started acting positively, now I know that some will say "What is there to be positive about" etc but open your eyes and see the long term potential. I'd be very interested to hear how emigration causes problems as mentioned by E.Goldstein. Net migration in the UK from 1991-2008 was positive meaning more tax payers entering the country than leaving. Not a sensible comment! However if you want to discuss how other countries such as Australia only allow 'positive' immigration as opposted to the UK then that would be a sensible discussion. I have to say if anyone's going to be the new Guy Fawkes it has to be AuntyCapitalist I think they've seen V for Vendetta a few too many times! (No offence AuntyCapitalist I'm only joking! - I WAS about to say that until you commented that there was going to be civil war. I actually now think you may have been watching too many films). On a more serious note it's all well and good to protest whether it's by camping out or rioting but alongside that if your views are strong enough, and sensible it is possible for anybody to form a political party (Common Sense party anyone?) and make a change using a channel that might actually work. Destruction, negativity and criticism are great for venting justified anger but don't actually improve things do they? YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

8:14am Tue 1 Nov 11

greedyb4nkers says...

too many people getting too much money for doing too little. peolpe can not always afford the time or money to re train or re locate. the system is designed to keep the less well off people down , look at the current univercity cost ! protesting like this will do no good at all, the only way is to find a protest which will hit these people where it hurts most - in their pock£ets !
too many people getting too much money for doing too little. peolpe can not always afford the time or money to re train or re locate. the system is designed to keep the less well off people down , look at the current univercity cost ! protesting like this will do no good at all, the only way is to find a protest which will hit these people where it hurts most - in their pock£ets ! greedyb4nkers
  • Score: 0

9:28am Tue 1 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

greedyb4nkers wrote:
too many people getting too much money for doing too little. peolpe can not always afford the time or money to re train or re locate. the system is designed to keep the less well off people down , look at the current univercity cost ! protesting like this will do no good at all, the only way is to find a protest which will hit these people where it hurts most - in their pock£ets !
Granted for a minority that may be the case but for most who are willing to put the effort in time can be found at weekends and evenings and options are available to cover costs. Admittedly the increase in university costs are steep, I'm not saying that it would be easy. Clearly the system isn't designed in a way to keep less well off people down, perhaps the people who don't go through the system are those who are less well off? Interesting comment on how to hit 'these people' who I'm assuming you mean those responsible for the state of things in the pocket. Would like to know how that could happen!
[quote][p][bold]greedyb4nkers[/bold] wrote: too many people getting too much money for doing too little. peolpe can not always afford the time or money to re train or re locate. the system is designed to keep the less well off people down , look at the current univercity cost ! protesting like this will do no good at all, the only way is to find a protest which will hit these people where it hurts most - in their pock£ets ![/p][/quote]Granted for a minority that may be the case but for most who are willing to put the effort in time can be found at weekends and evenings and options are available to cover costs. Admittedly the increase in university costs are steep, I'm not saying that it would be easy. Clearly the system isn't designed in a way to keep less well off people down, perhaps the people who don't go through the system are those who are less well off? Interesting comment on how to hit 'these people' who I'm assuming you mean those responsible for the state of things in the pocket. Would like to know how that could happen! YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

10:09am Tue 1 Nov 11

greedyb4nkers says...

unfortunately re training does cost money and time, and by time I do not mean weekends and nights Just how does a say a 50yr old re train ? Because in the real world it would be a 50yr old + (52?) then with no experience. 2yrs ago and there was no money then for proper re training just silly 6 week courses ETC. People who do not go through the system are less well off we should look at the reasons why , comes back to too many people for taking too much for too little, we should ALL contact our MP's and point out our views, they are there to represent the people, if they do not, vote them out. No what party you think you are affiliated to, take a close look at your local MP. Only pressure on them can change things and only we can do that
unfortunately re training does cost money and time, and by time I do not mean weekends and nights Just how does a say a 50yr old re train ? Because in the real world it would be a 50yr old + (52?) then with no experience. 2yrs ago and there was no money then for proper re training just silly 6 week courses ETC. People who do not go through the system are less well off we should look at the reasons why , comes back to too many people for taking too much for too little, we should ALL contact our MP's and point out our views, they are there to represent the people, if they do not, vote them out. No what party you think you are affiliated to, take a close look at your local MP. Only pressure on them can change things and only we can do that greedyb4nkers
  • Score: 0

10:11am Tue 1 Nov 11

gaffzilla says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
SellingEnglandByTheP

ound
wrote:
sam-tyler wrote:
They'll be lucky if they last a week, without having their tents & possessions nicked. Will they stay around when the fountains are being tested I wonder? ;-)
No, what will happen is there will be a police presence, probably of some considerable size, protecting them, their possessions and the site they're on, which the bill for WONT be paid by this lot, but people like me! You see, that's what we all need, MORE EXPENDITURE!!!
"people like me" blah blah, boo hoo. You really are a selfish tw@t aren't you?
Well said Aunty Capitalist! Personally I won't waste time entering a dialogue with a **** like that who has no clue why people feel as they do and just stereotypes the protesters as scroungers and the "great unwashed". What a vile apology of a human being.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SellingEnglandByTheP ound[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sam-tyler[/bold] wrote: They'll be lucky if they last a week, without having their tents & possessions nicked. Will they stay around when the fountains are being tested I wonder? ;-)[/p][/quote]No, what will happen is there will be a police presence, probably of some considerable size, protecting them, their possessions and the site they're on, which the bill for WONT be paid by this lot, but people like me! You see, that's what we all need, MORE EXPENDITURE!!![/p][/quote]"people like me" blah blah, boo hoo. You really are a selfish tw@t aren't you?[/p][/quote]Well said Aunty Capitalist! Personally I won't waste time entering a dialogue with a **** like that who has no clue why people feel as they do and just stereotypes the protesters as scroungers and the "great unwashed". What a vile apology of a human being. gaffzilla
  • Score: 0

10:28am Tue 1 Nov 11

Casual Hero says...

This is the most considered debate I have ever read on this website - Congrats Bradfordians.

What do the Protestors want ?

Quite simply, an end to Capitalism as a global economic model.
(in a nutshell)
Capitalism was an invention of General Electric and other large corporations in 1950's America, they sold it to the american public through exhibitions and by sponsoring their own presidential candidate. The american electorate were sold on the idea and the US government became an administration instead of the traditional style of government.

The world traded very succesfully for tens of thousands of years before the invention of the Capitalist System (before America was heard of) and will trade for tens of thousands of years after it has gone. The protestors (the 99% ) are aware of this inevitability and are seizing the zeitgeist.
The more of us that get behind it, the less painful it may be - or we could instead face huge global conflicts if all our politicians just stick their fingers in their ears, their snouts deeper in the trough and pretend it isn't broken.
This is the most considered debate I have ever read on this website - Congrats Bradfordians. What do the Protestors want ? Quite simply, an end to Capitalism as a global economic model. (in a nutshell) Capitalism was an invention of General Electric and other large corporations in 1950's America, they sold it to the american public through exhibitions and by sponsoring their own presidential candidate. The american electorate were sold on the idea and the US government became an administration instead of the traditional style of government. The world traded very succesfully for tens of thousands of years before the invention of the Capitalist System (before America was heard of) and will trade for tens of thousands of years after it has gone. The protestors (the 99% ) are aware of this inevitability and are seizing the zeitgeist. The more of us that get behind it, the less painful it may be - or we could instead face huge global conflicts if all our politicians just stick their fingers in their ears, their snouts deeper in the trough and pretend it isn't broken. Casual Hero
  • Score: 0

10:34am Tue 1 Nov 11

Casual Hero says...

and as a footnote - I think everybody here has heard the quote 'Capitalism will eat itself' - that is what is happening right now, and very quickly.
Plan B anyone ???
and as a footnote - I think everybody here has heard the quote 'Capitalism will eat itself' - that is what is happening right now, and very quickly. Plan B anyone ??? Casual Hero
  • Score: 0

10:57am Tue 1 Nov 11

cormon says...

Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk.
It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes.
This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed.
That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm. cormon
  • Score: 0

11:21am Tue 1 Nov 11

aje2010 says...

I wish I had the strength and courage to be part of this great protest against social and economic inequality, corporate greet, corruption and influence over government.
The slogan for this protest is "we are the 99%" (against the 1% wealthy).

Seems like a lot of those 1% are T&A readers
I wish I had the strength and courage to be part of this great protest against social and economic inequality, corporate greet, corruption and influence over government. The slogan for this protest is "we are the 99%" (against the 1% wealthy). Seems like a lot of those 1% are T&A readers aje2010
  • Score: 0

11:25am Tue 1 Nov 11

Casual Hero says...

cormon wrote:
Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk.
It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes.
This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed.
That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put.
A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this.
If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff.
You couldn't make it up.
[quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up. Casual Hero
  • Score: 0

11:26am Tue 1 Nov 11

Casual Hero says...

cormon wrote:
Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk.
It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes.
This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed.
That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put.
A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this.
If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff.
You couldn't make it up.
[quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up. Casual Hero
  • Score: 0

12:04pm Tue 1 Nov 11

Pukkap12 says...

For those confused about what the worldwide Occupy movement is about;

The current system is unsustainable. It is undemocratic and unjust. We need alternatives; this is where we work towards them.

We are of all ethnicities, backgrounds, genders, generations, sexualities dis/abilities and faiths. We stand together with occupations all over the world.

We refuse to pay for the banks' crisis.

We do not accept the cuts as either necessary or inevitable.

We demand an end to global tax injustice and our democracy representing corporations instead of the people.

We want regulators to be genuinely independent of the industries they regulate.

We support the strike on the 30th November and the student action on the 9th November, and actions to defend our health services, welfare, education and employment, and to stop wars and arms dealing.

We want structural change towards authentic global equality. The world's resources must go towards caring for people and the planet, not the military, corporate profits or the rich.

We stand in solidarity with the global oppressed and we call for an end to the actions of our government and others in causing this oppression.

This is what democracy looks like. Come and join us!
For those confused about what the worldwide Occupy movement is about; The current system is unsustainable. It is undemocratic and unjust. We need alternatives; this is where we work towards them. We are of all ethnicities, backgrounds, genders, generations, sexualities dis/abilities and faiths. We stand together with occupations all over the world. We refuse to pay for the banks' crisis. We do not accept the cuts as either necessary or inevitable. We demand an end to global tax injustice and our democracy representing corporations instead of the people. We want regulators to be genuinely independent of the industries they regulate. We support the strike on the 30th November and the student action on the 9th November, and actions to defend our health services, welfare, education and employment, and to stop wars and arms dealing. We want structural change towards authentic global equality. The world's resources must go towards caring for people and the planet, not the military, corporate profits or the rich. We stand in solidarity with the global oppressed and we call for an end to the actions of our government and others in causing this oppression. This is what democracy looks like. Come and join us! Pukkap12
  • Score: 0

12:15pm Tue 1 Nov 11

picknick says...

Occupy http://n1ck1ee.wordp
ress.com/2011/11/01/
occupy-bradford-28-1
0-11/ Bradord
Occupy http://n1ck1ee.wordp ress.com/2011/11/01/ occupy-bradford-28-1 0-11/ Bradord picknick
  • Score: 0

12:15pm Tue 1 Nov 11

picknick says...

Occupy http://n1ck1ee.wordp
ress.com/2011/11/01/
occupy-bradford-28-1
0-11/ Bradord
Occupy http://n1ck1ee.wordp ress.com/2011/11/01/ occupy-bradford-28-1 0-11/ Bradord picknick
  • Score: 0

12:44pm Tue 1 Nov 11

bradfordian says...

We won't have to worry about the next council elections. We have so many on here who know how to 'right' Bradford. Who is anyone, to call peope the 'great unwashed'. Must have a superiority complex. Does anyone have nothing good to say about the Bradford I love? And yes I have met the protesters and they are the same as me and you. Standing up for us whose money is draining like water through a colander.
We won't have to worry about the next council elections. We have so many on here who know how to 'right' Bradford. Who is anyone, to call peope the 'great unwashed'. Must have a superiority complex. Does anyone have nothing good to say about the Bradford I love? And yes I have met the protesters and they are the same as me and you. Standing up for us whose money is draining like water through a colander. bradfordian
  • Score: 0

12:44pm Tue 1 Nov 11

bradfordian says...

We won't have to worry about the next council elections. We have so many on here who know how to 'right' Bradford. Who is anyone, to call peope the 'great unwashed'. Must have a superiority complex. Does anyone have nothing good to say about the Bradford I love? And yes I have met the protesters and they are the same as me and you. Standing up for us whose money is draining like water through a colander.
We won't have to worry about the next council elections. We have so many on here who know how to 'right' Bradford. Who is anyone, to call peope the 'great unwashed'. Must have a superiority complex. Does anyone have nothing good to say about the Bradford I love? And yes I have met the protesters and they are the same as me and you. Standing up for us whose money is draining like water through a colander. bradfordian
  • Score: 0

1:28pm Tue 1 Nov 11

Oldwestbowling says...

I have learned a lot from this debate and will be having a look at the article in The Guardian that Cormon has mentioned. If these comments have done nothing else, they've certainly given me plenty of food for thought. Thanks.
I have learned a lot from this debate and will be having a look at the article in The Guardian that Cormon has mentioned. If these comments have done nothing else, they've certainly given me plenty of food for thought. Thanks. Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

3:41pm Tue 1 Nov 11

Steam Pigs says...

Some people never learn - End of WW1, Germany, Drexler developed the ideology for Socialism with a strategy focused on anti big business, anti bourgeois and anti capitalism rhetoric, sound familiar to what is happening today? Drexler’s ideology became the National Socialist party of Germany, hence known as the NAZI party lead by Hitler...... Or maybe look at the Marxist model for Socialism, the one adopted by Lenin et all in the 1910’s – what good that did for Eastern Europe and Russia for all those decades....

Some people never learn....... If you want to effect change, get a position on the council or become an MP and beat the system from within
Some people never learn - End of WW1, Germany, Drexler developed the ideology for Socialism with a strategy focused on anti big business, anti bourgeois and anti capitalism rhetoric, sound familiar to what is happening today? Drexler’s ideology became the National Socialist party of Germany, hence known as the NAZI party lead by Hitler...... Or maybe look at the Marxist model for Socialism, the one adopted by Lenin et all in the 1910’s – what good that did for Eastern Europe and Russia for all those decades.... Some people never learn....... If you want to effect change, get a position on the council or become an MP and beat the system from within Steam Pigs
  • Score: 0

10:14pm Tue 1 Nov 11

RollandSmoke says...

I popped down to Bradford today to see how things were going down there as they were having their general meeting. I asked if I could sit in and listen and was welcomed with open arms. After a quick run through of meeting etiquette they proceeded to discuss issues surrounding the camp and the protest. It is clear that they attach great importance to the conduct of the protest being polite, respectfull, peacefull and within legal boundarys. The Braford Jesus Man came along to see what was happening and left stating "They're right in what they're saying, money is the root of all evil" and a reporter and photographer from this half @rsed, censoring excuse for a newspaper turned up too. I would like to thank the protesters for being there and would suggest anyone with reservations about their motives and aims pops down for a quick chat with them.
I popped down to Bradford today to see how things were going down there as they were having their general meeting. I asked if I could sit in and listen and was welcomed with open arms. After a quick run through of meeting etiquette they proceeded to discuss issues surrounding the camp and the protest. It is clear that they attach great importance to the conduct of the protest being polite, respectfull, peacefull and within legal boundarys. The Braford Jesus Man came along to see what was happening and left stating "They're right in what they're saying, money is the root of all evil" and a reporter and photographer from this half @rsed, censoring excuse for a newspaper turned up too. I would like to thank the protesters for being there and would suggest anyone with reservations about their motives and aims pops down for a quick chat with them. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

10:28pm Tue 1 Nov 11

lonniejockstrap says...

Casual Hero wrote:
cormon wrote:
Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk.
It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes.
This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed.
That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put.
A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this.
If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff.
You couldn't make it up.
It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer!
[quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.[/p][/quote]It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer! lonniejockstrap
  • Score: 0

10:54pm Tue 1 Nov 11

lonniejockstrap says...

Steam Pigs wrote:
Some people never learn - End of WW1, Germany, Drexler developed the ideology for Socialism with a strategy focused on anti big business, anti bourgeois and anti capitalism rhetoric, sound familiar to what is happening today? Drexler’s ideology became the National Socialist party of Germany, hence known as the NAZI party lead by Hitler...... Or maybe look at the Marxist model for Socialism, the one adopted by Lenin et all in the 1910’s – what good that did for Eastern Europe and Russia for all those decades....

Some people never learn....... If you want to effect change, get a position on the council or become an MP and beat the system from within
I have provided a few quotes below as my way of questioning the belief in any 'actual' power MP's and Governments have to be able to effect REAL change:
.
'Permit me to issue and control the money of the nation and I care not who makes its laws'. — Mayer Amschel Rothschild, a prominent European banker in the eighteenth century.
.
'If the American people ever allow the banks to control issuance of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers occupied'. — Thomas Jefferson
.
'I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies'. — Thomas Jefferson
.
'We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated governments in the civilized world. We are no longer a government by free opinion, no longer a government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominate men. I have unwittingly betrayed my country'. — President Woodrow Wilson, 1916
.
'The powers of financial capitalism had another far reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements, arrived at in frequent private meetings and conferences. The apex of the system was the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland; a private bank owned and controlled by the worlds’ central banks, which were themselves, private corporations. The growth of financial capitalism made possible a centralization of world economic control and use of this power for the direct benefit of financiers and the indirect injury of all other economic groups'. — Tragedy and Hope: A History of The World in Our Time 1966, Professor Carroll Quigley, Georgetown University.
[quote][p][bold]Steam Pigs[/bold] wrote: Some people never learn - End of WW1, Germany, Drexler developed the ideology for Socialism with a strategy focused on anti big business, anti bourgeois and anti capitalism rhetoric, sound familiar to what is happening today? Drexler’s ideology became the National Socialist party of Germany, hence known as the NAZI party lead by Hitler...... Or maybe look at the Marxist model for Socialism, the one adopted by Lenin et all in the 1910’s – what good that did for Eastern Europe and Russia for all those decades.... Some people never learn....... If you want to effect change, get a position on the council or become an MP and beat the system from within[/p][/quote]I have provided a few quotes below as my way of questioning the belief in any 'actual' power MP's and Governments have to be able to effect REAL change: . 'Permit me to issue and control the money of the nation and I care not who makes its laws'. — Mayer Amschel Rothschild, a prominent European banker in the eighteenth century. . 'If the American people ever allow the banks to control issuance of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers occupied'. — Thomas Jefferson . 'I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies'. — Thomas Jefferson . 'We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated governments in the civilized world. We are no longer a government by free opinion, no longer a government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominate men. I have unwittingly betrayed my country'. — President Woodrow Wilson, 1916 . 'The powers of financial capitalism had another far reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements, arrived at in frequent private meetings and conferences. The apex of the system was the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland; a private bank owned and controlled by the worlds’ central banks, which were themselves, private corporations. The growth of financial capitalism made possible a centralization of world economic control and use of this power for the direct benefit of financiers and the indirect injury of all other economic groups'. — Tragedy and Hope: A History of The World in Our Time 1966, Professor Carroll Quigley, Georgetown University. lonniejockstrap
  • Score: 0

11:11pm Tue 1 Nov 11

theoutsider says...

Good luck to the Protestors squatting outside City Hall - lets hope they make it into Bradfords 'Dale Farm - as one of thousands of tax payers who did not want the lousy City Park - feel free to direct all you waste and sewage in the Mirror pool on me !
Good luck to the Protestors squatting outside City Hall - lets hope they make it into Bradfords 'Dale Farm - as one of thousands of tax payers who did not want the lousy City Park - feel free to direct all you waste and sewage in the Mirror pool on me ! theoutsider
  • Score: 0

11:11pm Tue 1 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

greedyb4nkers wrote:
unfortunately re training does cost money and time, and by time I do not mean weekends and nights Just how does a say a 50yr old re train ? Because in the real world it would be a 50yr old + (52?) then with no experience. 2yrs ago and there was no money then for proper re training just silly 6 week courses ETC. People who do not go through the system are less well off we should look at the reasons why , comes back to too many people for taking too much for too little, we should ALL contact our MP's and point out our views, they are there to represent the people, if they do not, vote them out. No what party you think you are affiliated to, take a close look at your local MP. Only pressure on them can change things and only we can do that
Thanks for clairfying greedyb4nkers I understand your comment regarding the time factor now, perhaps I wasn't looking at it from that perspective.

Can you also clarify what you mean by people who do not go through the system being less well off. Are you suggesting that somebody who goes to college for 2 years, university for 3 or 4 years and does a professional qualification for a further 2 or 3 years (let's be honest, that's a 7-9 year sacrifice) should not be more well off than somebody who left school at 16? I'm personally satisified with a system that would reward the effort and commitment, although maybe your point is that there is too much disparity between my two examples?
[quote][p][bold]greedyb4nkers[/bold] wrote: unfortunately re training does cost money and time, and by time I do not mean weekends and nights Just how does a say a 50yr old re train ? Because in the real world it would be a 50yr old + (52?) then with no experience. 2yrs ago and there was no money then for proper re training just silly 6 week courses ETC. People who do not go through the system are less well off we should look at the reasons why , comes back to too many people for taking too much for too little, we should ALL contact our MP's and point out our views, they are there to represent the people, if they do not, vote them out. No what party you think you are affiliated to, take a close look at your local MP. Only pressure on them can change things and only we can do that[/p][/quote]Thanks for clairfying greedyb4nkers I understand your comment regarding the time factor now, perhaps I wasn't looking at it from that perspective. Can you also clarify what you mean by people who do not go through the system being less well off. Are you suggesting that somebody who goes to college for 2 years, university for 3 or 4 years and does a professional qualification for a further 2 or 3 years (let's be honest, that's a 7-9 year sacrifice) should not be more well off than somebody who left school at 16? I'm personally satisified with a system that would reward the effort and commitment, although maybe your point is that there is too much disparity between my two examples? YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

1:05am Wed 2 Nov 11

mrs walker says...

They have my support. And thanks to Lonnie et al for the economics lessons :-)
They have my support. And thanks to Lonnie et al for the economics lessons :-) mrs walker
  • Score: 0

1:06am Wed 2 Nov 11

mrs walker says...

They have my support. And thanks to Lonnie et al for the economics lessons :-)
They have my support. And thanks to Lonnie et al for the economics lessons :-) mrs walker
  • Score: 0

1:06am Wed 2 Nov 11

mrs walker says...

They have my support. And thanks to Lonnie et al for the economics lessons :-)
They have my support. And thanks to Lonnie et al for the economics lessons :-) mrs walker
  • Score: 0

1:08am Wed 2 Nov 11

mrs walker says...

You'd have thought that Newsquest could have sorted out the annoying triple-posting problem by now...
You'd have thought that Newsquest could have sorted out the annoying triple-posting problem by now... mrs walker
  • Score: 0

3:22am Wed 2 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

lonniejockstrap wrote:
Casual Hero wrote:
cormon wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.
It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer!
The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another.

Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.
[quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.[/p][/quote]It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer![/p][/quote]The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this. YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

4:51am Wed 2 Nov 11

Patrick Bateman says...

mrs walker wrote:
You'd have thought that Newsquest could have sorted out the annoying triple-posting problem by now...
Where have YOU been hiding? Had a little sabbatical after royally throwing your toys out the pram last time you posted? Or maybe you've been preoccupied by moving into your new middle class suburb? Whatever; it's nice to have you back!
[quote][p][bold]mrs walker[/bold] wrote: You'd have thought that Newsquest could have sorted out the annoying triple-posting problem by now...[/p][/quote]Where have YOU been hiding? Had a little sabbatical after royally throwing your toys out the pram last time you posted? Or maybe you've been preoccupied by moving into your new middle class suburb? Whatever; it's nice to have you back! Patrick Bateman
  • Score: 0

9:20am Wed 2 Nov 11

lonniejockstrap says...

YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
Casual Hero wrote:
cormon wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.
It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer!
The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another.

Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.
One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry?
.
An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?
[quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.[/p][/quote]It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer![/p][/quote]The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.[/p][/quote]One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they? lonniejockstrap
  • Score: 0

10:20am Wed 2 Nov 11

RollandSmoke says...

It doesn't help that all the tax money raised goes straight to the banks in the "City" which is, and has been for hundreds of years, operating as an off shore tax haven. Then when the government wants to spend on schools, hospitals, welfare ect. the banks then lend the government the money back with a big chunk of interest added. It's said that The City of London is the biggest offshore tax haven in the world. To all the right wingers who ask why Labour didn't regulate the banks whilst in office, it's the same reason as the Conservatives won't be doing anything either, yes they can regulate the highstreet banks but those in the "City" are not under UK Government control as it is an independent soverign state.
It doesn't help that all the tax money raised goes straight to the banks in the "City" which is, and has been for hundreds of years, operating as an off shore tax haven. Then when the government wants to spend on schools, hospitals, welfare ect. the banks then lend the government the money back with a big chunk of interest added. It's said that The City of London is the biggest offshore tax haven in the world. To all the right wingers who ask why Labour didn't regulate the banks whilst in office, it's the same reason as the Conservatives won't be doing anything either, yes they can regulate the highstreet banks but those in the "City" are not under UK Government control as it is an independent soverign state. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

12:03pm Wed 2 Nov 11

Oldwestbowling says...

Just out of interest.......have any Bradford MPs visited the site? Was this mentioned at the meeting Rolly?
Just out of interest.......have any Bradford MPs visited the site? Was this mentioned at the meeting Rolly? Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

12:17pm Wed 2 Nov 11

Andy2010 says...

Pukkap12 wrote:
For those confused about what the worldwide Occupy movement is about; The current system is unsustainable. It is undemocratic and unjust. We need alternatives; this is where we work towards them. We are of all ethnicities, backgrounds, genders, generations, sexualities dis/abilities and faiths. We stand together with occupations all over the world. We refuse to pay for the banks' crisis. We do not accept the cuts as either necessary or inevitable. We demand an end to global tax injustice and our democracy representing corporations instead of the people. We want regulators to be genuinely independent of the industries they regulate. We support the strike on the 30th November and the student action on the 9th November, and actions to defend our health services, welfare, education and employment, and to stop wars and arms dealing. We want structural change towards authentic global equality. The world's resources must go towards caring for people and the planet, not the military, corporate profits or the rich. We stand in solidarity with the global oppressed and we call for an end to the actions of our government and others in causing this oppression. This is what democracy looks like. Come and join us!
So you dont want much then !!!

Yeah.. well good luck with that but let me reassure you your protest is pointless and a complete waste of time but if you have nothing better to do and arent doing anyone no harm then feel free to have a little camping trip. I presume whilst you are on this camping trip you wont be claiming any benefits as technically if you are on JSA you should be looking for work ?

One last thing

NOT IN MY NAME
[quote][p][bold]Pukkap12[/bold] wrote: For those confused about what the worldwide Occupy movement is about; The current system is unsustainable. It is undemocratic and unjust. We need alternatives; this is where we work towards them. We are of all ethnicities, backgrounds, genders, generations, sexualities dis/abilities and faiths. We stand together with occupations all over the world. We refuse to pay for the banks' crisis. We do not accept the cuts as either necessary or inevitable. We demand an end to global tax injustice and our democracy representing corporations instead of the people. We want regulators to be genuinely independent of the industries they regulate. We support the strike on the 30th November and the student action on the 9th November, and actions to defend our health services, welfare, education and employment, and to stop wars and arms dealing. We want structural change towards authentic global equality. The world's resources must go towards caring for people and the planet, not the military, corporate profits or the rich. We stand in solidarity with the global oppressed and we call for an end to the actions of our government and others in causing this oppression. This is what democracy looks like. Come and join us![/p][/quote]So you dont want much then !!! Yeah.. well good luck with that but let me reassure you your protest is pointless and a complete waste of time but if you have nothing better to do and arent doing anyone no harm then feel free to have a little camping trip. I presume whilst you are on this camping trip you wont be claiming any benefits as technically if you are on JSA you should be looking for work ? One last thing NOT IN MY NAME Andy2010
  • Score: 0

12:40pm Wed 2 Nov 11

RollandSmoke says...

Oldwestbowling wrote:
Just out of interest.......have any Bradford MPs visited the site? Was this mentioned at the meeting Rolly?
Yes they have had visits from MPs although I can't remember the names. Unfortunatly it sounds like all they were interested in talking about was the eviction of the protesters. It seems that the MPs have no interest in working with the protesters to ensure a satisfactory outcome and would prefer to bring West Yorkshire Police PLC into disrepute as they carry out the councils dirty work for them. Dispite my attendence of the meeting last night I don't believe I'm qualified to be a spokesman for the group.
[quote][p][bold]Oldwestbowling[/bold] wrote: Just out of interest.......have any Bradford MPs visited the site? Was this mentioned at the meeting Rolly?[/p][/quote]Yes they have had visits from MPs although I can't remember the names. Unfortunatly it sounds like all they were interested in talking about was the eviction of the protesters. It seems that the MPs have no interest in working with the protesters to ensure a satisfactory outcome and would prefer to bring West Yorkshire Police PLC into disrepute as they carry out the councils dirty work for them. Dispite my attendence of the meeting last night I don't believe I'm qualified to be a spokesman for the group. RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

4:28pm Wed 2 Nov 11

Casual Hero says...

This debate gets better - I was struggling to find a good way to explain 'Fractional Reserve Banking' Thanks Yorkshire Steel for that.
Now - How to simply explain 'Derivatives' Thats where money really gets into the realms of Dark Magick ! along with short selling. Lol

I predict that the governments will all but take over the retail banking sector (simply to protect against the inevitable run on banks) and then we can start to see the real effects of this banking crisis.
Without depositors money to support it, the rest of the financial sector and the City of London will all but evaporate - along with all this fantastic wealth.
The plus side to the state ownership of retail banking is that the government (country) can borrow from it's own people rather the IMF or World Bank and at much better rates.
(mustn't mention Marx though)
This debate gets better - I was struggling to find a good way to explain 'Fractional Reserve Banking' Thanks Yorkshire Steel for that. Now - How to simply explain 'Derivatives' Thats where money really gets into the realms of Dark Magick ! along with short selling. Lol I predict that the governments will all but take over the retail banking sector (simply to protect against the inevitable run on banks) and then we can start to see the real effects of this banking crisis. Without depositors money to support it, the rest of the financial sector and the City of London will all but evaporate - along with all this fantastic wealth. The plus side to the state ownership of retail banking is that the government (country) can borrow from it's own people rather the IMF or World Bank and at much better rates. (mustn't mention Marx though) Casual Hero
  • Score: 0

11:47pm Wed 2 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

lonniejockstrap wrote:
YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
Casual Hero wrote:
cormon wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.
It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer!
The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.
One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?
You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing.

The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending.


I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend.

It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means.

In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now?
[quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.[/p][/quote]It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer![/p][/quote]The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.[/p][/quote]One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?[/p][/quote]You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing. The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending. I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend. It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means. In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now? YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

11:55pm Wed 2 Nov 11

mrs walker says...

Patrick Bateman wrote:
mrs walker wrote:
You'd have thought that Newsquest could have sorted out the annoying triple-posting problem by now...
Where have YOU been hiding? Had a little sabbatical after royally throwing your toys out the pram last time you posted? Or maybe you've been preoccupied by moving into your new middle class suburb? Whatever; it's nice to have you back!
Why thank you, Mr Bateman. I'm sure your tongue was firmly in your cheek while writing that last sentence!

Dear Mr Walker has been very poorly with his innards - hospitalised, you know! - so I have been rather preoccupied. All I can say is thank goodness for the National Health Service and BRI! Were it not for our welfare state I may have been forced to carry out his operation myself with nothing but my favourite kitchen knife and a bottle of whisky as an anaesthetic...

All the more reason to fight the good fight against all-pervading capitalism and lightly tread the middle ground...
[quote][p][bold]Patrick Bateman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]mrs walker[/bold] wrote: You'd have thought that Newsquest could have sorted out the annoying triple-posting problem by now...[/p][/quote]Where have YOU been hiding? Had a little sabbatical after royally throwing your toys out the pram last time you posted? Or maybe you've been preoccupied by moving into your new middle class suburb? Whatever; it's nice to have you back![/p][/quote]Why thank you, Mr Bateman. I'm sure your tongue was firmly in your cheek while writing that last sentence! Dear Mr Walker has been very poorly with his innards - hospitalised, you know! - so I have been rather preoccupied. All I can say is thank goodness for the National Health Service and BRI! Were it not for our welfare state I may have been forced to carry out his operation myself with nothing but my favourite kitchen knife and a bottle of whisky as an anaesthetic... All the more reason to fight the good fight against all-pervading capitalism and lightly tread the middle ground... mrs walker
  • Score: 0

11:59pm Wed 2 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

RollandSmoke wrote:
It doesn't help that all the tax money raised goes straight to the banks in the "City" which is, and has been for hundreds of years, operating as an off shore tax haven. Then when the government wants to spend on schools, hospitals, welfare ect. the banks then lend the government the money back with a big chunk of interest added. It's said that The City of London is the biggest offshore tax haven in the world. To all the right wingers who ask why Labour didn't regulate the banks whilst in office, it's the same reason as the Conservatives won't be doing anything either, yes they can regulate the highstreet banks but those in the "City" are not under UK Government control as it is an independent soverign state.
All the tax money goes to the banks in the "City", wow RollandSmoke that is truly enlightening especially as it is also an independent soverign state. Please tell us more maybe we also give our tax revenues directly to America, Australia or Canada (put any country you like in here).

I also did not realise that the City of London was offshore, please tell me what boat I have to catch to get to it!

Good point about regulation though, I don't suppose we care which Government does it providing it gets done!
[quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: It doesn't help that all the tax money raised goes straight to the banks in the "City" which is, and has been for hundreds of years, operating as an off shore tax haven. Then when the government wants to spend on schools, hospitals, welfare ect. the banks then lend the government the money back with a big chunk of interest added. It's said that The City of London is the biggest offshore tax haven in the world. To all the right wingers who ask why Labour didn't regulate the banks whilst in office, it's the same reason as the Conservatives won't be doing anything either, yes they can regulate the highstreet banks but those in the "City" are not under UK Government control as it is an independent soverign state.[/p][/quote]All the tax money goes to the banks in the "City", wow RollandSmoke that is truly enlightening especially as it is also an independent soverign state. Please tell us more maybe we also give our tax revenues directly to America, Australia or Canada (put any country you like in here). I also did not realise that the City of London was offshore, please tell me what boat I have to catch to get to it! Good point about regulation though, I don't suppose we care which Government does it providing it gets done! YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

12:03am Thu 3 Nov 11

mrs walker says...

YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
Casual Hero wrote:
cormon wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.
It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer!
The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.
One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?
You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing.

The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending.



I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend.

It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means.

In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now?
Yet the problem with quantitative easing - or 'creating' more money - is that, historically it has led to runaway inflation - Germany in the 1930s for example...
[quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.[/p][/quote]It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer![/p][/quote]The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.[/p][/quote]One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?[/p][/quote]You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing. The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending. I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend. It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means. In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now?[/p][/quote]Yet the problem with quantitative easing - or 'creating' more money - is that, historically it has led to runaway inflation - Germany in the 1930s for example... mrs walker
  • Score: 0

12:15am Thu 3 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

Casual Hero wrote:
This debate gets better - I was struggling to find a good way to explain 'Fractional Reserve Banking' Thanks Yorkshire Steel for that. Now - How to simply explain 'Derivatives' Thats where money really gets into the realms of Dark Magick ! along with short selling. Lol I predict that the governments will all but take over the retail banking sector (simply to protect against the inevitable run on banks) and then we can start to see the real effects of this banking crisis. Without depositors money to support it, the rest of the financial sector and the City of London will all but evaporate - along with all this fantastic wealth. The plus side to the state ownership of retail banking is that the government (country) can borrow from it's own people rather the IMF or World Bank and at much better rates. (mustn't mention Marx though)
Derivatives! Can anybody explain them!? Lol. I don't know... I like to think that perhaps those in the know used them as an insurance to hedge but personally I see it as glorified betting.

Speculation and greed is the reason why we are in the position we are in now. Lending to people who can't pay (subprime) and the short termism used in the stock market are just two examples. Perhaps if the ownership of banks passed to the state we would have more stability and less emphasis on profit and who wouldn't be up for that? Great suggestion CasualHero however I hope the whole financial sector doesn't go down I'd say people still need insurance for one and those working in that industry certainly don't deserve to lose their jobs also.

I also have said it before and I'd like to hear your view on it - do you think the Media has played a part in the whole financial crisis with all the scaremongering they cause at times and the effect that this has on investor confidence? I'd also like to see more regulation there too...
[quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: This debate gets better - I was struggling to find a good way to explain 'Fractional Reserve Banking' Thanks Yorkshire Steel for that. Now - How to simply explain 'Derivatives' Thats where money really gets into the realms of Dark Magick ! along with short selling. Lol I predict that the governments will all but take over the retail banking sector (simply to protect against the inevitable run on banks) and then we can start to see the real effects of this banking crisis. Without depositors money to support it, the rest of the financial sector and the City of London will all but evaporate - along with all this fantastic wealth. The plus side to the state ownership of retail banking is that the government (country) can borrow from it's own people rather the IMF or World Bank and at much better rates. (mustn't mention Marx though)[/p][/quote]Derivatives! Can anybody explain them!? Lol. I don't know... I like to think that perhaps those in the know used them as an insurance to hedge but personally I see it as glorified betting. Speculation and greed is the reason why we are in the position we are in now. Lending to people who can't pay (subprime) and the short termism used in the stock market are just two examples. Perhaps if the ownership of banks passed to the state we would have more stability and less emphasis on profit and who wouldn't be up for that? Great suggestion CasualHero however I hope the whole financial sector doesn't go down I'd say people still need insurance for one and those working in that industry certainly don't deserve to lose their jobs also. I also have said it before and I'd like to hear your view on it - do you think the Media has played a part in the whole financial crisis with all the scaremongering they cause at times and the effect that this has on investor confidence? I'd also like to see more regulation there too... YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

12:40am Thu 3 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

mrs walker wrote:
YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
Casual Hero wrote:
cormon wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.
It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer!
The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.
One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?
You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing. The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending. I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend. It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means. In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now?
Yet the problem with quantitative easing - or 'creating' more money - is that, historically it has led to runaway inflation - Germany in the 1930s for example...
Fair comment Mrs Walker. I wasn't advocating the use of quantitative easing but personally I agree that providing the "new money" is allowed to get into the wider economy i.e. banks actually do what they are supposed to and lend that this would lead to inflation due to the simple fact that more of something means a single unit is worth less.

However the problem is nobody really knows the exact effect that it will have on inflation until the money eventually does trickle through. Also I think there is a possibility that printing physical Deutsche Marks in the 1930's in a post and pre war Germany heavily reliant on manufacturing may have a different effect to digitally creating funds in the 2010's in a UK heavily reliant on services as part of a EU that has a multi national currency.

A lot has changed in 80 years and I don't think that examples from so far back should restrict different methods to improve the current situation being tried despite my own opinion that higher inflation would be a bad thing especially if wage inflation is unable to reciprocate.
[quote][p][bold]mrs walker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.[/p][/quote]It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer![/p][/quote]The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.[/p][/quote]One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?[/p][/quote]You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing. The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending. I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend. It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means. In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now?[/p][/quote]Yet the problem with quantitative easing - or 'creating' more money - is that, historically it has led to runaway inflation - Germany in the 1930s for example...[/p][/quote]Fair comment Mrs Walker. I wasn't advocating the use of quantitative easing but personally I agree that providing the "new money" is allowed to get into the wider economy i.e. banks actually do what they are supposed to and lend that this would lead to inflation due to the simple fact that more of something means a single unit is worth less. However the problem is nobody really knows the exact effect that it will have on inflation until the money eventually does trickle through. Also I think there is a possibility that printing physical Deutsche Marks in the 1930's in a post and pre war Germany heavily reliant on manufacturing may have a different effect to digitally creating funds in the 2010's in a UK heavily reliant on services as part of a EU that has a multi national currency. A lot has changed in 80 years and I don't think that examples from so far back should restrict different methods to improve the current situation being tried despite my own opinion that higher inflation would be a bad thing especially if wage inflation is unable to reciprocate. YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

12:44am Thu 3 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

Mrs Walker you made me remember a story I saw recently - Germany are/have been secretly printing Deutsche Marks. A break away from using the Euro? Now that would devastating considering how they are picking up the tab at the moment!
Mrs Walker you made me remember a story I saw recently - Germany are/have been secretly printing Deutsche Marks. A break away from using the Euro? Now that would devastating considering how they are picking up the tab at the moment! YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

12:55am Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Lord Ashcroft *Conservative Party Exposé Tax Fraud FBI Carroll Trust Case

"Sensational further revelations in the Carroll Foundation Charitable Trust billion dollar tax evasion fraud case has disclosed that the former Conservative Party Central Office Director Sir Anthony Garner has been named in the new explosive prosecution files in this great financial scandal sweeping the City of London and Westminster.

Sources have confirmed that Sir Anthony a Conservative Party grandee is also a close friend of Lord Ashcroft a former Conservative Party Chairman who has in the past been the subject of serious allegations of tax evasion money laundering offences linked to his large Caribbean business activities. Sir Anthony is thought to be also a close friend of both Lady Thatcher and Sir John Major whilst being a senior main board director of the Carroll Global Corporation Group of Companies.

Further sources have said that these new FBI Scotland files contain a startling litany forged and falsified HSBC International offshore numbered bank accounts "directly linked" to Coutts Bank Strand London Gerald Carroll banking arrangements which effectively impulsed this massive bank fraud heist operation which stretches the globe."
Sep 26, 2011
http://www.topix.com
/forum/blogs/TS57I4K
NUCJ3DJLRG
Lord Ashcroft *Conservative Party Exposé Tax Fraud FBI Carroll Trust Case "Sensational further revelations in the Carroll Foundation Charitable Trust billion dollar tax evasion fraud case has disclosed that the former Conservative Party Central Office Director Sir Anthony Garner has been named in the new explosive prosecution files in this great financial scandal sweeping the City of London and Westminster. Sources have confirmed that Sir Anthony a Conservative Party grandee is also a close friend of Lord Ashcroft a former Conservative Party Chairman who has in the past been the subject of serious allegations of tax evasion money laundering offences linked to his large Caribbean business activities. Sir Anthony is thought to be also a close friend of both Lady Thatcher and Sir John Major whilst being a senior main board director of the Carroll Global Corporation Group of Companies. Further sources have said that these new FBI Scotland files contain a startling litany forged and falsified HSBC International offshore numbered bank accounts "directly linked" to Coutts Bank Strand London Gerald Carroll banking arrangements which effectively impulsed this massive bank fraud heist operation which stretches the globe." Sep 26, 2011 http://www.topix.com /forum/blogs/TS57I4K NUCJ3DJLRG Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:55am Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Lord Ashcroft *Conservative Party Exposé Tax Fraud FBI Carroll Trust Case

"Sensational further revelations in the Carroll Foundation Charitable Trust billion dollar tax evasion fraud case has disclosed that the former Conservative Party Central Office Director Sir Anthony Garner has been named in the new explosive prosecution files in this great financial scandal sweeping the City of London and Westminster.

Sources have confirmed that Sir Anthony a Conservative Party grandee is also a close friend of Lord Ashcroft a former Conservative Party Chairman who has in the past been the subject of serious allegations of tax evasion money laundering offences linked to his large Caribbean business activities. Sir Anthony is thought to be also a close friend of both Lady Thatcher and Sir John Major whilst being a senior main board director of the Carroll Global Corporation Group of Companies.

Further sources have said that these new FBI Scotland files contain a startling litany forged and falsified HSBC International offshore numbered bank accounts "directly linked" to Coutts Bank Strand London Gerald Carroll banking arrangements which effectively impulsed this massive bank fraud heist operation which stretches the globe."
Sep 26, 2011
http://www.topix.com
/forum/blogs/TS57I4K
NUCJ3DJLRG
Lord Ashcroft *Conservative Party Exposé Tax Fraud FBI Carroll Trust Case "Sensational further revelations in the Carroll Foundation Charitable Trust billion dollar tax evasion fraud case has disclosed that the former Conservative Party Central Office Director Sir Anthony Garner has been named in the new explosive prosecution files in this great financial scandal sweeping the City of London and Westminster. Sources have confirmed that Sir Anthony a Conservative Party grandee is also a close friend of Lord Ashcroft a former Conservative Party Chairman who has in the past been the subject of serious allegations of tax evasion money laundering offences linked to his large Caribbean business activities. Sir Anthony is thought to be also a close friend of both Lady Thatcher and Sir John Major whilst being a senior main board director of the Carroll Global Corporation Group of Companies. Further sources have said that these new FBI Scotland files contain a startling litany forged and falsified HSBC International offshore numbered bank accounts "directly linked" to Coutts Bank Strand London Gerald Carroll banking arrangements which effectively impulsed this massive bank fraud heist operation which stretches the globe." Sep 26, 2011 http://www.topix.com /forum/blogs/TS57I4K NUCJ3DJLRG Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

12:58am Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

"David Cameron admits defeat over bankers' bonuses
Downing Street has accepted that it cannot halt large bonuses for bankers"
http://www.telegraph
.co.uk/finance/newsb
ysector/banksandfina
nce/8251527/David-Ca
meron-admits-defeat-
over-bankers-bonuses
.html
"David Cameron admits defeat over bankers' bonuses Downing Street has accepted that it cannot halt large bonuses for bankers" http://www.telegraph .co.uk/finance/newsb ysector/banksandfina nce/8251527/David-Ca meron-admits-defeat- over-bankers-bonuses .html Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

1:01am Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

"FAT-CAT bankers are becoming skinnier with bonuses expected to fall to "just" £4.2billion this year."

"...The Centre for Economics and Business Research (CEBR) report came as a separate survey showed chief exec take-home pay at the biggest 100 companies on the stock market was up 49 PER CENT."

http://www.thesun.co
.uk/sol/homepage/new
s/money/3900035/Bank
ers-bonuses-fall-to-
42billion.html
"FAT-CAT bankers are becoming skinnier with bonuses expected to fall to "just" £4.2billion this year." "...The Centre for Economics and Business Research (CEBR) report came as a separate survey showed chief exec take-home pay at the biggest 100 companies on the stock market was up 49 PER CENT." http://www.thesun.co .uk/sol/homepage/new s/money/3900035/Bank ers-bonuses-fall-to- 42billion.html Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

1:29am Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

"Arab oil Sheik makes car out of white gold"

http://www.mediatake
out.com/2009/36894-b
aaaaaa-llling_arab_o
il_sheik_makes_a_car
_out_of_white_gold_p
ics_of_the_5_million
_car_inside.html


"This silver Audi A8 was made for a sheik...It’s not just silver in colour - it’s MADE out of silver!"

http://www.joe-ks.co
m/archives_feb2008/H
ighGasPrices.htm#ixz
z1cbHAV0dY


"Tony Blair Is Getting Millions From A New Oil Rich Client

http://articles.busi
nessinsider.com/2011
-10-21/europe/303054
45_1_kazakhstan-fina
ncial-times-zurich#i
xzz1cbHhZ7bx


"the number of billionaires living in Britain has increased to 42 from 33, with their collective net worth rising 42% to $164.2 billion. "

http://www.forbes.co
m/2007/11/20/billion
aires-britain-cavend
ish-biz_cx_pm_1120uk
billies.html


List of Russians by net worth

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/List_of_Rus
sians_by_net_worth


British billionaires

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Category:Br
itish_billionaires


"World military spending soars in spite of recession"

http://www.bbc.co.uk
/news/10184610



The Forbes top 100 billionaire rich-list

http://www.thisismon
ey.co.uk/money/news/
article-1607938/The-
Forbes-100-billionai
re-rich-list.html


List of countries by military expenditures

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/List_of_cou
ntries_by_military_e
xpenditures


Make Poverty History

http://www.makepover
tyhistory.org/takeac
tion/


Child poverty in the UK

http://www.cpag.org.
uk/povertyfacts/


Child poverty in Africa

http://www.fightpove
rty.mmbrico.com/fact
s/africa.html


The Poverty Site

http://www.poverty.o
rg.uk/summary/key%20
facts.shtml


Food Not Bombs

http://www.foodnotbo
mbs.net/


Practical Action

http://practicalacti
on.org/
"Arab oil Sheik makes car out of white gold" http://www.mediatake out.com/2009/36894-b aaaaaa-llling_arab_o il_sheik_makes_a_car _out_of_white_gold_p ics_of_the_5_million _car_inside.html "This silver Audi A8 was made for a sheik...It’s not just silver in colour - it’s MADE out of silver!" http://www.joe-ks.co m/archives_feb2008/H ighGasPrices.htm#ixz z1cbHAV0dY "Tony Blair Is Getting Millions From A New Oil Rich Client http://articles.busi nessinsider.com/2011 -10-21/europe/303054 45_1_kazakhstan-fina ncial-times-zurich#i xzz1cbHhZ7bx "the number of billionaires living in Britain has increased to 42 from 33, with their collective net worth rising 42% to $164.2 billion. " http://www.forbes.co m/2007/11/20/billion aires-britain-cavend ish-biz_cx_pm_1120uk billies.html List of Russians by net worth http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/List_of_Rus sians_by_net_worth British billionaires http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/Category:Br itish_billionaires "World military spending soars in spite of recession" http://www.bbc.co.uk /news/10184610 The Forbes top 100 billionaire rich-list http://www.thisismon ey.co.uk/money/news/ article-1607938/The- Forbes-100-billionai re-rich-list.html List of countries by military expenditures http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/List_of_cou ntries_by_military_e xpenditures Make Poverty History http://www.makepover tyhistory.org/takeac tion/ Child poverty in the UK http://www.cpag.org. uk/povertyfacts/ Child poverty in Africa http://www.fightpove rty.mmbrico.com/fact s/africa.html The Poverty Site http://www.poverty.o rg.uk/summary/key%20 facts.shtml Food Not Bombs http://www.foodnotbo mbs.net/ Practical Action http://practicalacti on.org/ Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

1:29am Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

"Arab oil Sheik makes car out of white gold"

http://www.mediatake
out.com/2009/36894-b
aaaaaa-llling_arab_o
il_sheik_makes_a_car
_out_of_white_gold_p
ics_of_the_5_million
_car_inside.html


"This silver Audi A8 was made for a sheik...It’s not just silver in colour - it’s MADE out of silver!"

http://www.joe-ks.co
m/archives_feb2008/H
ighGasPrices.htm#ixz
z1cbHAV0dY


"Tony Blair Is Getting Millions From A New Oil Rich Client

http://articles.busi
nessinsider.com/2011
-10-21/europe/303054
45_1_kazakhstan-fina
ncial-times-zurich#i
xzz1cbHhZ7bx


"the number of billionaires living in Britain has increased to 42 from 33, with their collective net worth rising 42% to $164.2 billion. "

http://www.forbes.co
m/2007/11/20/billion
aires-britain-cavend
ish-biz_cx_pm_1120uk
billies.html


List of Russians by net worth

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/List_of_Rus
sians_by_net_worth


British billionaires

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Category:Br
itish_billionaires


"World military spending soars in spite of recession"

http://www.bbc.co.uk
/news/10184610



The Forbes top 100 billionaire rich-list

http://www.thisismon
ey.co.uk/money/news/
article-1607938/The-
Forbes-100-billionai
re-rich-list.html


List of countries by military expenditures

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/List_of_cou
ntries_by_military_e
xpenditures


Make Poverty History

http://www.makepover
tyhistory.org/takeac
tion/


Child poverty in the UK

http://www.cpag.org.
uk/povertyfacts/


Child poverty in Africa

http://www.fightpove
rty.mmbrico.com/fact
s/africa.html


The Poverty Site

http://www.poverty.o
rg.uk/summary/key%20
facts.shtml


Food Not Bombs

http://www.foodnotbo
mbs.net/


Practical Action

http://practicalacti
on.org/
"Arab oil Sheik makes car out of white gold" http://www.mediatake out.com/2009/36894-b aaaaaa-llling_arab_o il_sheik_makes_a_car _out_of_white_gold_p ics_of_the_5_million _car_inside.html "This silver Audi A8 was made for a sheik...It’s not just silver in colour - it’s MADE out of silver!" http://www.joe-ks.co m/archives_feb2008/H ighGasPrices.htm#ixz z1cbHAV0dY "Tony Blair Is Getting Millions From A New Oil Rich Client http://articles.busi nessinsider.com/2011 -10-21/europe/303054 45_1_kazakhstan-fina ncial-times-zurich#i xzz1cbHhZ7bx "the number of billionaires living in Britain has increased to 42 from 33, with their collective net worth rising 42% to $164.2 billion. " http://www.forbes.co m/2007/11/20/billion aires-britain-cavend ish-biz_cx_pm_1120uk billies.html List of Russians by net worth http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/List_of_Rus sians_by_net_worth British billionaires http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/Category:Br itish_billionaires "World military spending soars in spite of recession" http://www.bbc.co.uk /news/10184610 The Forbes top 100 billionaire rich-list http://www.thisismon ey.co.uk/money/news/ article-1607938/The- Forbes-100-billionai re-rich-list.html List of countries by military expenditures http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/List_of_cou ntries_by_military_e xpenditures Make Poverty History http://www.makepover tyhistory.org/takeac tion/ Child poverty in the UK http://www.cpag.org. uk/povertyfacts/ Child poverty in Africa http://www.fightpove rty.mmbrico.com/fact s/africa.html The Poverty Site http://www.poverty.o rg.uk/summary/key%20 facts.shtml Food Not Bombs http://www.foodnotbo mbs.net/ Practical Action http://practicalacti on.org/ Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

2:49am Thu 3 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

Thanks Aunty Capitalist for your riveting posts. Bit like receiving a spam newsletter that although I did like the story about the silver Audi!!! Fancy throwing in a comment or two of your own in your later posts though so that they are actually interesting?
Thanks Aunty Capitalist for your riveting posts. Bit like receiving a spam newsletter that although I did like the story about the silver Audi!!! Fancy throwing in a comment or two of your own in your later posts though so that they are actually interesting? YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

12:14pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Andy2010 says...

@ Aunty Capitalist

Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !!

Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend

http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB
vE
@ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE Andy2010
  • Score: 0

1:01pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Andy2010 wrote:
@ Aunty Capitalist

Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !!

Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend

http://www.youtube.c

om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB

vE
Someone you can relate to? So you actually believe that greed is a virtue? then you are either a troll, or a fool, or you really are a thoroughly nasty, evil, selfish person for whom there is no hope; scum of the earth whom epitomises all that is wrong with humanity.
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE[/p][/quote]Someone you can relate to? So you actually believe that greed is a virtue? then you are either a troll, or a fool, or you really are a thoroughly nasty, evil, selfish person for whom there is no hope; scum of the earth whom epitomises all that is wrong with humanity. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

1:02pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

YorkshireSteel wrote:
Thanks Aunty Capitalist for your riveting posts. Bit like receiving a spam newsletter that although I did like the story about the silver Audi!!! Fancy throwing in a comment or two of your own in your later posts though so that they are actually interesting?
Go **** yourself.
[quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: Thanks Aunty Capitalist for your riveting posts. Bit like receiving a spam newsletter that although I did like the story about the silver Audi!!! Fancy throwing in a comment or two of your own in your later posts though so that they are actually interesting?[/p][/quote]Go **** yourself. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

1:04pm Thu 3 Nov 11

wobbley-bob says...

@ Aunty Capitalist
.
Jealous much?
.
Get a job then, you never know, you might be able to afford something other than White Lightening & that cheap 'Rollandsmoke' baccy from Barkers.
@ Aunty Capitalist . Jealous much? . Get a job then, you never know, you might be able to afford something other than White Lightening & that cheap 'Rollandsmoke' baccy from Barkers. wobbley-bob
  • Score: 0

1:15pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

wobbley-bob wrote:
@ Aunty Capitalist
.
Jealous much?
.
Get a job then, you never know, you might be able to afford something other than White Lightening & that cheap 'Rollandsmoke' baccy from Barkers.
I don't drink, actually, and I have always for as long as I can remember bought duty-free tobacco...

I hope to see you in the dole queue soon.
[quote][p][bold]wobbley-bob[/bold] wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist . Jealous much? . Get a job then, you never know, you might be able to afford something other than White Lightening & that cheap 'Rollandsmoke' baccy from Barkers.[/p][/quote]I don't drink, actually, and I have always for as long as I can remember bought duty-free tobacco... I hope to see you in the dole queue soon. Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

3:43pm Thu 3 Nov 11

RollandSmoke says...

Anyone want to tell me what sort of job I apply for that allows me to spend all day on the web commenting on stories in the local rag? Your hardly WORKING are you? or is that just for the minimum wage people?
Anyone want to tell me what sort of job I apply for that allows me to spend all day on the web commenting on stories in the local rag? Your hardly WORKING are you? or is that just for the minimum wage people? RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

4:52pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Andy2010 says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Andy2010 wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE
Someone you can relate to? So you actually believe that greed is a virtue? then you are either a troll, or a fool, or you really are a thoroughly nasty, evil, selfish person for whom there is no hope; scum of the earth whom epitomises all that is wrong with humanity.
Greed is good.....believe it or not not everyone shares your views on everything...I'm out for as much as I can earn in life thus enabling my family to have everything they want and more so.

Of course you have a right to disagree thats your perogative but it doesnt mean to say you are right.

And no I'm not a "troll". I'm simply someone who works extremely hard with a view to making as much money and acquiring as many assets as I possibly can so I can retire quite happily in my mid 50's and enjoy the rest of my life relaxing and seeing my family happy.

On the other hand if your happy sponging and dont want to make anything better for yourself and your family and end up working until your 70 then rotting in a run down care home then I wish you luck.

So yes in my view greed is good and works for me
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE[/p][/quote]Someone you can relate to? So you actually believe that greed is a virtue? then you are either a troll, or a fool, or you really are a thoroughly nasty, evil, selfish person for whom there is no hope; scum of the earth whom epitomises all that is wrong with humanity.[/p][/quote]Greed is good.....believe it or not not everyone shares your views on everything...I'm out for as much as I can earn in life thus enabling my family to have everything they want and more so. Of course you have a right to disagree thats your perogative but it doesnt mean to say you are right. And no I'm not a "troll". I'm simply someone who works extremely hard with a view to making as much money and acquiring as many assets as I possibly can so I can retire quite happily in my mid 50's and enjoy the rest of my life relaxing and seeing my family happy. On the other hand if your happy sponging and dont want to make anything better for yourself and your family and end up working until your 70 then rotting in a run down care home then I wish you luck. So yes in my view greed is good and works for me Andy2010
  • Score: 0

5:10pm Thu 3 Nov 11

RollandSmoke says...

Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing?
Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing? RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

6:27pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Aunty Capitalist says...

Andy2010 wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Andy2010 wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE
Someone you can relate to? So you actually believe that greed is a virtue? then you are either a troll, or a fool, or you really are a thoroughly nasty, evil, selfish person for whom there is no hope; scum of the earth whom epitomises all that is wrong with humanity.
Greed is good.....believe it or not not everyone shares your views on everything...I'm out for as much as I can earn in life thus enabling my family to have everything they want and more so.

Of course you have a right to disagree thats your perogative but it doesnt mean to say you are right.

And no I'm not a "troll". I'm simply someone who works extremely hard with a view to making as much money and acquiring as many assets as I possibly can so I can retire quite happily in my mid 50's and enjoy the rest of my life relaxing and seeing my family happy.

On the other hand if your happy sponging and dont want to make anything better for yourself and your family and end up working until your 70 then rotting in a run down care home then I wish you luck.

So yes in my view greed is good and works for me
How very sad. You will be in for a huge shock - YOU CAN'T TAKE IT WITH YOU!

"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE[/p][/quote]Someone you can relate to? So you actually believe that greed is a virtue? then you are either a troll, or a fool, or you really are a thoroughly nasty, evil, selfish person for whom there is no hope; scum of the earth whom epitomises all that is wrong with humanity.[/p][/quote]Greed is good.....believe it or not not everyone shares your views on everything...I'm out for as much as I can earn in life thus enabling my family to have everything they want and more so. Of course you have a right to disagree thats your perogative but it doesnt mean to say you are right. And no I'm not a "troll". I'm simply someone who works extremely hard with a view to making as much money and acquiring as many assets as I possibly can so I can retire quite happily in my mid 50's and enjoy the rest of my life relaxing and seeing my family happy. On the other hand if your happy sponging and dont want to make anything better for yourself and your family and end up working until your 70 then rotting in a run down care home then I wish you luck. So yes in my view greed is good and works for me[/p][/quote]How very sad. You will be in for a huge shock - YOU CAN'T TAKE IT WITH YOU! "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God." Aunty Capitalist
  • Score: 0

6:29pm Thu 3 Nov 11

moralcompass says...

Andy2010 wrote:
@ Aunty Capitalist

Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !!

Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend

http://www.youtube.c

om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB

vE
you are stupid if you think like this....
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE[/p][/quote]you are stupid if you think like this.... moralcompass
  • Score: 0

6:36pm Thu 3 Nov 11

moralcompass says...

This sums up the reasons why people do the occupy protest:

http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?v=KJKbDz4EZ
io
This sums up the reasons why people do the occupy protest: http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=KJKbDz4EZ io moralcompass
  • Score: 0

8:14pm Thu 3 Nov 11

bridbantam says...

to Anty Capitalist: seems to me,reading this thread, that you are JEALOUS,because you haven't,and probably never will be comfortably well off. Get over it you tree hugger, get a life of your own and keep your thoughts to yourself in future.
to Anty Capitalist: seems to me,reading this thread, that you are JEALOUS,because you haven't,and probably never will be comfortably well off. Get over it you tree hugger, get a life of your own and keep your thoughts to yourself in future. bridbantam
  • Score: 0

8:19pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Andy2010 says...

RollandSmoke wrote:
Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing?
Yes I do. Just leaving work now at 8.15pm after being in at 8 this morning so yeah I do. For the record I work in Finance...Am I a parasite that lives off the hard graft of others or pay peanuts ? well suppose could be considered that yes. I have two assistants that you could say arent paid a "fortune" but as like myself have started at the bottom and are working their way up. With experience, education and training there is no reason why they too cant be earning a lot of money in a few years. And no I dont work in the public sector so cant speak for them
[quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing?[/p][/quote]Yes I do. Just leaving work now at 8.15pm after being in at 8 this morning so yeah I do. For the record I work in Finance...Am I a parasite that lives off the hard graft of others or pay peanuts ? well suppose could be considered that yes. I have two assistants that you could say arent paid a "fortune" but as like myself have started at the bottom and are working their way up. With experience, education and training there is no reason why they too cant be earning a lot of money in a few years. And no I dont work in the public sector so cant speak for them Andy2010
  • Score: 0

8:23pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Andy2010 says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
Aunty Capitalist wrote:
Andy2010 wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE
Someone you can relate to? So you actually believe that greed is a virtue? then you are either a troll, or a fool, or you really are a thoroughly nasty, evil, selfish person for whom there is no hope; scum of the earth whom epitomises all that is wrong with humanity.
Greed is good.....believe it or not not everyone shares your views on everything...I'm out for as much as I can earn in life thus enabling my family to have everything they want and more so.

Of course you have a right to disagree thats your perogative but it doesnt mean to say you are right.

And no I'm not a "troll". I'm simply someone who works extremely hard with a view to making as much money and acquiring as many assets as I possibly can so I can retire quite happily in my mid 50's and enjoy the rest of my life relaxing and seeing my family happy.

On the other hand if your happy sponging and dont want to make anything better for yourself and your family and end up working until your 70 then rotting in a run down care home then I wish you luck.

So yes in my view greed is good and works for me
How very sad. You will be in for a huge shock - YOU CAN'T TAKE IT WITH YOU!

"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
I cant take it with me cant I ? How very true...but if through hard work and sensible spending it means that I can enjoy my retirement helping my children, travelling the world, relaxing and doing some charity work then so be it. People like yourself and these protestors dont understand that people dont always have the same views as yourself. If you want to protest about whatever good luck to ya but dont bleet to people that actually dont care about your pointless protests that will acheive nothing.
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE[/p][/quote]Someone you can relate to? So you actually believe that greed is a virtue? then you are either a troll, or a fool, or you really are a thoroughly nasty, evil, selfish person for whom there is no hope; scum of the earth whom epitomises all that is wrong with humanity.[/p][/quote]Greed is good.....believe it or not not everyone shares your views on everything...I'm out for as much as I can earn in life thus enabling my family to have everything they want and more so. Of course you have a right to disagree thats your perogative but it doesnt mean to say you are right. And no I'm not a "troll". I'm simply someone who works extremely hard with a view to making as much money and acquiring as many assets as I possibly can so I can retire quite happily in my mid 50's and enjoy the rest of my life relaxing and seeing my family happy. On the other hand if your happy sponging and dont want to make anything better for yourself and your family and end up working until your 70 then rotting in a run down care home then I wish you luck. So yes in my view greed is good and works for me[/p][/quote]How very sad. You will be in for a huge shock - YOU CAN'T TAKE IT WITH YOU! "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."[/p][/quote]I cant take it with me cant I ? How very true...but if through hard work and sensible spending it means that I can enjoy my retirement helping my children, travelling the world, relaxing and doing some charity work then so be it. People like yourself and these protestors dont understand that people dont always have the same views as yourself. If you want to protest about whatever good luck to ya but dont bleet to people that actually dont care about your pointless protests that will acheive nothing. Andy2010
  • Score: 0

8:27pm Thu 3 Nov 11

bridbantam says...

well said Andy 2010.Anybody with real true values will want the best for themselves and their family.
well said Andy 2010.Anybody with real true values will want the best for themselves and their family. bridbantam
  • Score: 0

8:29pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Andy2010 says...

moralcompass wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
@ Aunty Capitalist

Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !!

Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend

http://www.youtube.c


om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB


vE
you are stupid if you think like this....
Am I? In my opinion greed is good. I was brought up with nothing and quickly learnt if you want anything in life you have to go out there and get it. Be it a job, house or anything it all is acheivable if you have the sheer will to get what you want. As I stated I work hard and with that comes rewards. These rewards pay for what I would consider a better life for my family and me. We travel the world so my children can experience different cultures. Its pays for a better education for my children and also better healthcare. Better homes and cars whilst you might consider material things and not important I actually take pride in not so to gloat but to have that sense of achievment that I have I earned and got what I wanted.

So yes in MY opinion greed is good and works for myself
[quote][p][bold]moralcompass[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE[/p][/quote]you are stupid if you think like this....[/p][/quote]Am I? In my opinion greed is good. I was brought up with nothing and quickly learnt if you want anything in life you have to go out there and get it. Be it a job, house or anything it all is acheivable if you have the sheer will to get what you want. As I stated I work hard and with that comes rewards. These rewards pay for what I would consider a better life for my family and me. We travel the world so my children can experience different cultures. Its pays for a better education for my children and also better healthcare. Better homes and cars whilst you might consider material things and not important I actually take pride in not so to gloat but to have that sense of achievment that I have I earned and got what I wanted. So yes in MY opinion greed is good and works for myself Andy2010
  • Score: 0

8:35pm Thu 3 Nov 11

RollandSmoke says...

Andy2010 wrote:
RollandSmoke wrote: Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing?
Yes I do. Just leaving work now at 8.15pm after being in at 8 this morning so yeah I do. For the record I work in Finance...Am I a parasite that lives off the hard graft of others or pay peanuts ? well suppose could be considered that yes. I have two assistants that you could say arent paid a "fortune" but as like myself have started at the bottom and are working their way up. With experience, education and training there is no reason why they too cant be earning a lot of money in a few years. And no I dont work in the public sector so cant speak for them
Are your assistants paid a living wage or are they still needing to claim some benefits? Or in other words is their employment making you money at the taxpayers expense?
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing?[/p][/quote]Yes I do. Just leaving work now at 8.15pm after being in at 8 this morning so yeah I do. For the record I work in Finance...Am I a parasite that lives off the hard graft of others or pay peanuts ? well suppose could be considered that yes. I have two assistants that you could say arent paid a "fortune" but as like myself have started at the bottom and are working their way up. With experience, education and training there is no reason why they too cant be earning a lot of money in a few years. And no I dont work in the public sector so cant speak for them[/p][/quote]Are your assistants paid a living wage or are they still needing to claim some benefits? Or in other words is their employment making you money at the taxpayers expense? RollandSmoke
  • Score: 0

8:55pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Andy2010 says...

RollandSmoke wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
RollandSmoke wrote: Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing?
Yes I do. Just leaving work now at 8.15pm after being in at 8 this morning so yeah I do. For the record I work in Finance...Am I a parasite that lives off the hard graft of others or pay peanuts ? well suppose could be considered that yes. I have two assistants that you could say arent paid a "fortune" but as like myself have started at the bottom and are working their way up. With experience, education and training there is no reason why they too cant be earning a lot of money in a few years. And no I dont work in the public sector so cant speak for them
Are your assistants paid a living wage or are they still needing to claim some benefits? Or in other words is their employment making you money at the taxpayers expense?
Well without going in too much detail they are paid low 20's annual. As for if they claim benefits such as tax credits that really isnt none of my business.

I fail to understand your questions as to is their employment making me money at the taxpayers expense. Their duties ultimately make money money for the company not me personally. If your point is whilst and if they are claiming for example tax credits these are adding to my wealth well no not personally they arent. But bear in mind every extra penny I earn is taxed and taxed at the highest rate so I'm unsure what your getting at
[quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing?[/p][/quote]Yes I do. Just leaving work now at 8.15pm after being in at 8 this morning so yeah I do. For the record I work in Finance...Am I a parasite that lives off the hard graft of others or pay peanuts ? well suppose could be considered that yes. I have two assistants that you could say arent paid a "fortune" but as like myself have started at the bottom and are working their way up. With experience, education and training there is no reason why they too cant be earning a lot of money in a few years. And no I dont work in the public sector so cant speak for them[/p][/quote]Are your assistants paid a living wage or are they still needing to claim some benefits? Or in other words is their employment making you money at the taxpayers expense?[/p][/quote]Well without going in too much detail they are paid low 20's annual. As for if they claim benefits such as tax credits that really isnt none of my business. I fail to understand your questions as to is their employment making me money at the taxpayers expense. Their duties ultimately make money money for the company not me personally. If your point is whilst and if they are claiming for example tax credits these are adding to my wealth well no not personally they arent. But bear in mind every extra penny I earn is taxed and taxed at the highest rate so I'm unsure what your getting at Andy2010
  • Score: 0

9:03pm Thu 3 Nov 11

lonniejockstrap says...

YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
Casual Hero wrote:
cormon wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.
It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer!
The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.
One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?
You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing.

The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending.



I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend.

It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means.

In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now?
The Government does NOT print money, it prints Bonds, Stocks Treasury Bills which it then sells to raise money that is often 'created' by the Bank Of England. The securities that are printed and sold by the Government are basically a guarantee to pay a sum of money back to the purchasers on a regular basis for a given lenght of time -obviously with a profitable return. So, we as Tax payers are the ones who will be paying back this 'loan' plus interest for a very long time. IF, the Government decided to 'print' it's own money in place of printed bits of papaer called 'Bonds' in order to borrow money from Banks -and others- we would save on Billions of pounds of interest debt and reduce the burden on the Tax payer.
.
'They', would not have to pull the strings of 60m people. 'They' would simply have to influence the people who represent and lead the 60m. 'They', would influence/control the vast majority of the news and print media. 'They', decide whether to lend money to Governments or not dependent on the policies that a particular government promotes. 'They', can influence/bankrupt a country because of the amount of debt owed them or the money being asked for. 'They', can buy up your natural resources, your manufacturing base, your traditional industries, your water and energy provision when you can't repay the massive debt you owe them (and your MP's votes in Parliament -indirectly of course), wink, wink.
[quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.[/p][/quote]It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer![/p][/quote]The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.[/p][/quote]One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?[/p][/quote]You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing. The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending. I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend. It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means. In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now?[/p][/quote]The Government does NOT print money, it prints Bonds, Stocks Treasury Bills which it then sells to raise money that is often 'created' by the Bank Of England. The securities that are printed and sold by the Government are basically a guarantee to pay a sum of money back to the purchasers on a regular basis for a given lenght of time -obviously with a profitable return. So, we as Tax payers are the ones who will be paying back this 'loan' plus interest for a very long time. IF, the Government decided to 'print' it's own money in place of printed bits of papaer called 'Bonds' in order to borrow money from Banks -and others- we would save on Billions of pounds of interest debt and reduce the burden on the Tax payer. . 'They', would not have to pull the strings of 60m people. 'They' would simply have to influence the people who represent and lead the 60m. 'They', would influence/control the vast majority of the news and print media. 'They', decide whether to lend money to Governments or not dependent on the policies that a particular government promotes. 'They', can influence/bankrupt a country because of the amount of debt owed them or the money being asked for. 'They', can buy up your natural resources, your manufacturing base, your traditional industries, your water and energy provision when you can't repay the massive debt you owe them (and your MP's votes in Parliament -indirectly of course), wink, wink. lonniejockstrap
  • Score: 0

9:41pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Oldwestbowling says...

RollandSmoke wrote:
Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing?
A lot of employment revolves around shift work. 3 days, 3 nights, 3 off or even a long run of shifts and 2 weeks off. I work unusual shifts, it's not uncommon. I also work for the public sector and can assure you I do not "sit there doing nothing". Don't make the assumption that all public sector sit about all their shifts. You couldn't be more wrong. On the other side of the coin, my husband works for just above the minimum wage, and although he's in his 60's and not in the best of health, he intends to carry on until he's 65 because this is the way we've always lived. It's called the work ethic......don't knock it.
[quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: Andy2010 you say your someone who works extreamly hard. Do you? In the many years when I was working I never had a job that gave me enough downtime to be able to spend as much time on the internet as you seem to. What do you do thats so extreamly hard? Are you earning your money like a parasite off the hard graft of others that you pay peanuts or are you possibly working in the public sector taking tax payers money for you to sit there doing nothing?[/p][/quote]A lot of employment revolves around shift work. 3 days, 3 nights, 3 off or even a long run of shifts and 2 weeks off. I work unusual shifts, it's not uncommon. I also work for the public sector and can assure you I do not "sit there doing nothing". Don't make the assumption that all public sector sit about all their shifts. You couldn't be more wrong. On the other side of the coin, my husband works for just above the minimum wage, and although he's in his 60's and not in the best of health, he intends to carry on until he's 65 because this is the way we've always lived. It's called the work ethic......don't knock it. Oldwestbowling
  • Score: 0

9:55pm Thu 3 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

Aunty Capitalist wrote:
YorkshireSteel wrote: Thanks Aunty Capitalist for your riveting posts. Bit like receiving a spam newsletter that although I did like the story about the silver Audi!!! Fancy throwing in a comment or two of your own in your later posts though so that they are actually interesting?
Go **** yourself.
Good try, didn't make it interesting! I think you forgot to post the links too...
[quote][p][bold]Aunty Capitalist[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: Thanks Aunty Capitalist for your riveting posts. Bit like receiving a spam newsletter that although I did like the story about the silver Audi!!! Fancy throwing in a comment or two of your own in your later posts though so that they are actually interesting?[/p][/quote]Go **** yourself.[/p][/quote]Good try, didn't make it interesting! I think you forgot to post the links too... YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

9:58pm Thu 3 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

RollandSmoke wrote:
Anyone want to tell me what sort of job I apply for that allows me to spend all day on the web commenting on stories in the local rag? Your hardly WORKING are you? or is that just for the minimum wage people?
T&A Web Editor?
[quote][p][bold]RollandSmoke[/bold] wrote: Anyone want to tell me what sort of job I apply for that allows me to spend all day on the web commenting on stories in the local rag? Your hardly WORKING are you? or is that just for the minimum wage people?[/p][/quote]T&A Web Editor? YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

10:21pm Thu 3 Nov 11

YorkshireSteel says...

lonniejockstrap wrote:
YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
YorkshireSteel wrote:
lonniejockstrap wrote:
Casual Hero wrote:
cormon wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.
Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.
It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer!
The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.
One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?
You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing. The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending. I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend. It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means. In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now?
The Government does NOT print money, it prints Bonds, Stocks Treasury Bills which it then sells to raise money that is often 'created' by the Bank Of England. The securities that are printed and sold by the Government are basically a guarantee to pay a sum of money back to the purchasers on a regular basis for a given lenght of time -obviously with a profitable return. So, we as Tax payers are the ones who will be paying back this 'loan' plus interest for a very long time. IF, the Government decided to 'print' it's own money in place of printed bits of papaer called 'Bonds' in order to borrow money from Banks -and others- we would save on Billions of pounds of interest debt and reduce the burden on the Tax payer. . 'They', would not have to pull the strings of 60m people. 'They' would simply have to influence the people who represent and lead the 60m. 'They', would influence/control the vast majority of the news and print media. 'They', decide whether to lend money to Governments or not dependent on the policies that a particular government promotes. 'They', can influence/bankrupt a country because of the amount of debt owed them or the money being asked for. 'They', can buy up your natural resources, your manufacturing base, your traditional industries, your water and energy provision when you can't repay the massive debt you owe them (and your MP's votes in Parliament -indirectly of course), wink, wink.
More in depth explanation than mine Lonnie. Tried keeping it simple hence the "prints" but that is a more accurate description. I think the reason behind these instruments rather than directly printing money itself is so that inflation does not get out of hand. If the Government just created a pile of new notes from fresh air then each £ would be worth less.
[quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]YorkshireSteel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lonniejockstrap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Casual Hero[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cormon[/bold] wrote: Excellent heartening blog for the most part. For all - if you haven't read George Monbiot's article on line in the Guardian today, it covers all the queries and questions from those who are interested in the debate. It demonstrates clearly how the City of London has historically undermined the democratic process in the uk. It also includes references to a book by Shanxson that illuminates the practices of the corporate capitalists - for instance there are 16 trillion dollars stashed away in off shore accounts. There is no reason for austerity measures anywhere if governments had the bottle to tackle this issue by introducing fair taxes. This is the main thrust of the protesters - a complete overhaul of the economic and political system to end years and years of the economics and politics of greed. That's not to say that all occupancy protesters merely want to restore a democracy that operates in the interest of the majority; some are of the view that the system is past redemption and alternatives need to be created. But, the thrust of the first charter (explained earlier) is for democratisation of the City of London and a firm end put to its interference in the politics of the realm.[/p][/quote]Well put. A simple way to look at this problem with the present banking system is this. If a country is worth say $100 and prints 100 dollar bills and then gives it to the banks, the banks then lend this money, charge interest and turn $100 into $110 - BUT THERE IS ONLY $100 in REAL MONEY !!!! the other $10 has been invented into existence by the bank - who then give the bill for that invented $10 back to the country, so the economy inflates by 10% and your dollar in your pocket only now buys 90cents worth of stuff. You couldn't make it up.[/p][/quote]It's much more magical than inventing an extra 10% of money Casual. Due to a system called 'fractional reserve banking' a Bank can invent/create many times more than the ACTUAL money deposited in it's vaults. For example, if your $100 is deposited in Bank A, this Bank can now lend out around 90% of this $100 ie $90. So I come along and borrow that $90 and buy a product with that $90. The shopkeeper I bought that product from deposits that $90 in his Bank and his Bank can now lend out 90% of that $90 ie $81. Somebody borrows $81 buys a product and the seller deposits $81 in her Bank and YES!, you guessed it, the Bank can now lend out 90% of $81 ($72.9). And so on, and so on. This is real magical stuff is it not? In just the 3 examples above (and of course you can keep repeating this fractional reserve lending until infinity almost)we have gone from $100 being deposited in a Bank creating an extra $243! plus of course the interest being charged on top of those loans. Where did this money come from? It isn't even printed physical money it is just numbers typed into a computer![/p][/quote]The money comes from the bank making investments. To make the concept basic the bank takes your money and gives you interest which is the reward given to you as a result of the bank using your capital to make investments and/or lend for a profit. Plus real money is not the way in which most transactions are made these days it being a digital world and all. Every time you use a piece of plastic to pay for something IT'S NOT REAL MONEY. I know putting it in capitals doesn't really prove a point one way or another. Intersting point raised about fractional reserve banking. Good in theory but potentially dangerous, point in case Northern Rock and the panic withdrawals. Also anyone who's seen "It's a Wonderful Life" would see a great fictional example! A question to raise though is how do you make credit available to the majority for motgages etc without taking an approach such as this.[/p][/quote]One proposition is for Governments to 'print' their own money -just as Abe Lincoln did with the Greenback. The Government could do this without incurring interest that has to be paid on top back to the Banks. This would lessen the interest debt of the Country and, therefore, the Tax burden on small (and large) businesses as well of course on all employees. We already operate without using Euros as our currency so it wouldn't even amount to a 'dropping out of the Euro' argument being used against this 'solution'. We could build up a manufacturing and industrial economy again and trade those items with other Countries instead of relying on the Financial Market in the 'Corporation of London' being our wealth producing industry? . An 'independent' authority could advise on when to increase money supply etc. But, that would be the equivalent to a war on the money inventing, interest charging, Government controlling, minerals (of each Nation) owning elite. So, 'they' will obviously do their utmost to stop that happening. They are not going to simply hand over power to a 'democratically' run system. They have the power and they are going to keep it by what ever means is necessary. Who IS they?[/p][/quote]You mean quantitive easing? It's been tried as a way to allow the banks to stat lending again and get cash flowing. The Government "prints" money, which in this day and age does not mean physically creating but rather digitally creating new funds. This money is then used to buy assets from the banks so that they have cash to be able to lend out to business and the public to boost growth through additional investment/spending. I'm not sure exactly where you get the interest rate effect from - this is controlled separately and let's be honest interest rate decreases as well as "new" money is not being passed out to the wider economy but instead results in banks being able to shore up their balance sheets and improve their profitability because they still charge us the same interest rate but they have access to borrow money at lower interest rates and hence they have a larger interest (call this profit if you like!) margin on every £1 they lend. It is here that I agree with you that regulation is needed as banks have managed to keep a LOT of power despite being bailed out by the people. You are right if this money was lent out and stimulated growth then we could start to look into building up the economy, be it through manufacturing and export or other means. In reference to the democratically run system - do we all not have a chance to vote any party led by any person into power? Are the 'they' you refer to pulling the strings of 60m people or however many it is now?[/p][/quote]The Government does NOT print money, it prints Bonds, Stocks Treasury Bills which it then sells to raise money that is often 'created' by the Bank Of England. The securities that are printed and sold by the Government are basically a guarantee to pay a sum of money back to the purchasers on a regular basis for a given lenght of time -obviously with a profitable return. So, we as Tax payers are the ones who will be paying back this 'loan' plus interest for a very long time. IF, the Government decided to 'print' it's own money in place of printed bits of papaer called 'Bonds' in order to borrow money from Banks -and others- we would save on Billions of pounds of interest debt and reduce the burden on the Tax payer. . 'They', would not have to pull the strings of 60m people. 'They' would simply have to influence the people who represent and lead the 60m. 'They', would influence/control the vast majority of the news and print media. 'They', decide whether to lend money to Governments or not dependent on the policies that a particular government promotes. 'They', can influence/bankrupt a country because of the amount of debt owed them or the money being asked for. 'They', can buy up your natural resources, your manufacturing base, your traditional industries, your water and energy provision when you can't repay the massive debt you owe them (and your MP's votes in Parliament -indirectly of course), wink, wink.[/p][/quote]More in depth explanation than mine Lonnie. Tried keeping it simple hence the "prints" but that is a more accurate description. I think the reason behind these instruments rather than directly printing money itself is so that inflation does not get out of hand. If the Government just created a pile of new notes from fresh air then each £ would be worth less. YorkshireSteel
  • Score: 0

10:31pm Thu 3 Nov 11

moralcompass says...

Andy2010 wrote:
moralcompass wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
@ Aunty Capitalist

Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !!

Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend

http://www.youtube.c



om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB



vE
you are stupid if you think like this....
Am I? In my opinion greed is good. I was brought up with nothing and quickly learnt if you want anything in life you have to go out there and get it. Be it a job, house or anything it all is acheivable if you have the sheer will to get what you want. As I stated I work hard and with that comes rewards. These rewards pay for what I would consider a better life for my family and me. We travel the world so my children can experience different cultures. Its pays for a better education for my children and also better healthcare. Better homes and cars whilst you might consider material things and not important I actually take pride in not so to gloat but to have that sense of achievment that I have I earned and got what I wanted.

So yes in MY opinion greed is good and works for myself
What good is it for a man to gain the whole world yet lose his soul? You sound angry because you had it hard at first. Now you seem to be getting and gaining because it 'makes up' for the previous lack. i get that and sort of understand it. However, how do you feel to know that the drive to get and gain proportionately affects others negatively and produces lack for others? thats how a system works....
[quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]moralcompass[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Andy2010[/bold] wrote: @ Aunty Capitalist Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !! Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=ONXpaBQnB vE[/p][/quote]you are stupid if you think like this....[/p][/quote]Am I? In my opinion greed is good. I was brought up with nothing and quickly learnt if you want anything in life you have to go out there and get it. Be it a job, house or anything it all is acheivable if you have the sheer will to get what you want. As I stated I work hard and with that comes rewards. These rewards pay for what I would consider a better life for my family and me. We travel the world so my children can experience different cultures. Its pays for a better education for my children and also better healthcare. Better homes and cars whilst you might consider material things and not important I actually take pride in not so to gloat but to have that sense of achievment that I have I earned and got what I wanted. So yes in MY opinion greed is good and works for myself[/p][/quote]What good is it for a man to gain the whole world yet lose his soul? You sound angry because you had it hard at first. Now you seem to be getting and gaining because it 'makes up' for the previous lack. i get that and sort of understand it. However, how do you feel to know that the drive to get and gain proportionately affects others negatively and produces lack for others? thats how a system works.... moralcompass
  • Score: 0

10:54pm Thu 3 Nov 11

Andy2010 says...

moralcompass wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
moralcompass wrote:
Andy2010 wrote:
@ Aunty Capitalist

Thanks for the numerous pointless links about people having money !!

Anyway heres one of my favourites and someone I can actually relate to....legend