Join us in persuading the Home Secretary to stop a planned demonstration (From Bradford Telegraph and Argus)

Well done T&A - most of the people the EDL target are better citizens and contribute more to the economy of this country than they do. Most are thugs just looking for an excuse to cause trouble - the same yobs that used to attach themselves to football.

Billcliff wrote:
Well done T&A - most of the people the EDL target are better citizens and contribute more to the economy of this country than they do. Most are thugs just looking for an excuse to cause trouble - the same yobs that used to attach themselves to football.

Obviously, the T&A seem to have forgotten about the UAF hatemongers who cause more trouble, and have more people arrested, at these gatherings than the EDL. I would propose a ban on both organisations coming to Bradford, but I doubt the T&A would support it. I would also say that if a certain section of this community can't behave themselves and have to retaliate by attacking Bradford, as they did in the past, then perhaps the T&A should target them as well.

Crikey, the T&A editors speak!

Whilst commendable, why are you cherry picking a big event to keep hate out of this City whilst regularly failing to report on the constant crime that occurs week in, week out?

The only reason these groups appear and grow is because of the fear that their community and beliefs are being ignored or disregarded. If you want harmony you have to treat every single person equally and not turn blind eyes to things that shouldn't be ignored. Allowing certain groups to have a loose reign only infuriates the rest of society. If you want a good and pleasant place to live treat everyone with the same respect and don't bend because of colour or religion.

The T&A is nothing more than a properganda paper. Report the truth from the slums of the city and people like the EDL would not get support.

It would be good for traders if this demonstration didn't happen that is true, is it good for democracy to prevent demonstrations, no not really. It was the anti-nazi league, the equivalent of the UAF that was fully and wholly responsible for the last riot, something which isn't addressed in this article either.
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As for facts, well the EDF were in Bradford weeks ago without major issue and the T & A, nor the local TV media seemed to mention that:
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http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?v=uwlr8jj8e
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My lass was sent material from her Union yesterday, I'll have to read and post some of it here but it seems they were trying to drum up counter protest and actually add to the potential for tension on the day should the demonstration go ahead, indeed I expect both the UAF and EDL will come in force and will give the police a difficult job.

Marco and Moon - totally agree.
I would support any T&A campaign should they extend the call to ban to the UAF and ANL parties. Just because they are morally right doesn't mean they can behave however they want - they have had more arrests that the EDL at demonstrations.
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And yes, it is entirely the responsibility of the people not to get involved in any trouble or disorder, not cause mayhem then moan about provocation or "being caught in the moment" afterwards like in 2001. Do what I'm doing and go for a day out somewhere else if you can.

If the EDL demonstration is banned so will any others. The Home Secretary bans all demonstrations over a given time period so no one can come out to play.

I think the EDL are bringing to the fore the real issues of this city and this country, the problem is, anyone even mentions anything to do with immigration or even being British and they are quickly labelled as racists or trouble causers, we need to take the same stand the Germans/Belgians/Fre
nch are taking and reclaim our country from the lunatics who think all British people should bend over and be shafted by any minority who wishes. We need to act for ALL British people, not pander down to any minority who think they have the right to change our society. Come and live in our wonderful country, but accept our culture/rules/laws, if not don't come as it is obviously not for you. We need to start addressing these issues or civil war will erupt in this country when the minorities who are over represented start putting in changes the majority don't want.

We live in a democracy... neither demonstration should be banned.. it is everyones right to demonstrate. This country is scared to upset the ethnic community. it is high time that british people were not treated like 2nd class citizens. Bradford is over run with people from Eastern Europe.
Its time our doors were closed. Stop spending taxpayers money on funding to make there areas nice, and facilities for minorities... If you dont like what it is go home. This does not only just apply to anyone who is one colour. It applies to anyone not born here. If you dont like what is going on... please feel free to leave the country. And stop sponging off the hard working British public

"when in Rome, do as the Romans do" . . . . . . if more people in this ONCE great city of ours lived by this, then we might all get along ??
Let the EDL have their march - if the peolpe who object to it just turn away & ignore it, then it will go off without incident, but i can't see that happening - - lets see who starts the trouble ???

Rather than simply banning the demonstration, would it not make sense to look into the reasons why organisations like this are growing in numbers. Banning something like this will also cause more resentment than it is worth. Love the bit about Bradfords 'prosperity and harmony.'

where do we sign

To be honest i'm fed up of bradford i spent a few days away recentlty in whitby and the freedom of been able to walk around anywhere at night with out the fear of having to protect my self an my wife was a massive eye opener,bradford has so many no go areas if your not a muslim its disgusting. I welcome the EDL as its people like them that are not afraid of saying what has to be said Bradford needs to be reclaimed by decent peolple who want to intagrate into the comunity and make it a better place

In a nutshell, the second riot was very much provoked by the anti-nazi league by spreading rumour and misinformation. Whilst the Asian youth had come into Bradford in large numbers specifically looking for confrontation that day the far left group provided the catalyst. Had their been no "cause" promoted to legitimise discontent the riot would likely have not happened.
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Bad and memorable though the 2 riots have been, it's still hardly a regular event in Bradford.

osamabobladen wrote:
I dont think there is peace and harmony in this city. Its as divided as it ever was. Its about time the T & A pulled its head out of the sand, raised the issue and stopped being scared of offending ONE communnity and ONE culture.

Could not agree more. You only have to read this site/newspaper on a daily basis to find at least one story every day that invokes a debate in the comments section about certain areas of the community being completely lawless and seemingly protected from critisism. In fact, often the "Comments" facility is removed entirely from stories the T&A clearly knows will receive a negative reaction towards this ethnic group. As the above quote states, the T&A needs to pull its head out of the sand or it is as guilty as anyone else for indirectly fanning the flames of racial tension and playing into the hands of these extreme-view groups.

Maybe the T&A will now do other campains like getting Westfield center sorted out and the Odeon and rest of our city center.

Good article T&A, its just going to provoke more trouble and more people are going to come. The EDL are not racist as there leader is indian, the majority of people who go to EDL marches are there to show how patriotic they are about this country. In my opinion not letting this march go ahead is racism.
The T&A showing favouritism again towards the ethnic community. Would they have a front page spread about cancelling a march from the asian community? NO

What a load of rubbish, I've had to move out of Bradford because I no longer felt safe(so has most of my family for similar reasons).
Bradfords a dump thats more divided than 10 years ago.
I bet the person who wrote this tripe does not live on Manchester Road or similar area with a mixed low paid community!

Joedavid wrote:
Maybe the T&A will now do other campains like getting Westfield center sorted out and the Odeon and rest of our city center.

That would mean criticism of the Council and the to date, failed and misguided approach to regeneration. So no, the T & A likely will not do such a campaign.

EDL - not necessarily racist but anti-islamic. The EDL are trying to mount a campaign of persecution against Muslims because that is what it is when one picks on a religious minority. (dictionary definition is "a program or campaign to exterminate, drive away, or subjugate a people because of their religion, race, or beliefs"):
If they were a normal political party with genuine beliefs and aims then it would not be a problem but in reality they are the original football hooligans who are no longer able to fight on the terraces due to football banning orders so have found a new medium through which to vent their unacceptable behavior and one that they can easily suck the working classes in to.
As for the Anti-fascist league etc they will be playing in to the hands of these people if they turn up.
........and the losers ? Bradford and its citizens.

Doesn't look like much support on here for the editors campaign. Wonder if it will be quickly forgotten until after the march and if there is trouble it will be pulled back out to say "told you so".

I am a Hindu and have lived in Bradford all my life. Myself and my family have been victims of racist attacks. bradford is not a happy place, divided very much. These days all our abuse is from muslim community, we can not go in certain parts.
I have read about the edl, us Asians dont see them as racist although I am far to old at 60 to join them on march.
This paper should be ashamed of itself telling lies and forgetting about us Hindu's when we are victims to this new radical islam which dominates in Bradford.
Instead of saying no to edl, the people of bradford need to stand in support.

Well done to the editor, it's funny how the comments are about immigration... the EDL claims not to be about race but against Islamic extremists, so they say, only an idiot will fall for this.

Only an idiot would fall for there conspiracy theories based on the fear of the unknown.

All this crap about no-go area's, when they're only no go due to the fear and paranoia of those that do not wish to go to these area's.

Only an idot would buy there obsecure population figures based on lies.

The EDL are like Nazi's, alienating and creating a stigma, fuelling hate against Muslims just like the Nazi's did to the Jews.

Ban the EDL, they incite racial hate, just like the organisations such as Islam4UK and MAC. Ban the lot of them.

If the EDL turn up, no-one should expect the community being used as a scape goat just to sit back, I wish they would but when they're being attacked by the EDL if they just sit-back the EDL will claim victory for getting their empty-barrel message succeed.

Bradford does not need this, it may not be a perfect city but the EDL turning up will not improve and will only make it worse.

It is clear to see that the people responding to this article so far think it is not only incorrect but on some levels offensive as it treats the readers of this newspapers as fools. Regardless of whether you believe it is right that the EDL (or any other group) are right to march within the City, the justification used by this newspaper is based on untruthes and opinions rather than facts.

I do not think anyone, regardless of their background, religion or beliefs would say that Bradford is a City of communities who work together and I would also be surprised to hear that people in Bradford think the City has moved on from the riots that took place in the early 2000s. Regardless of the march, the issues that caused the riots are still prevelant in Bradford today and are still to be tackled. More than anything it is disappointing to see the City's own newspaper being prepared to sweep these issues under the carpet rather than dealing with them, an approach which not only does nothing to fix the problem but also contributes to the worsening situation.

I would hope that in a few days when a broad section of the readers have commented on this article the T&A will respond with a story that analyses what the residents of this City feel and will do this in an unbiased manner. The T&A is a local newspaper and its role is to report events in a factual manner, not in a way that polarises areas of the City. I would ask that the readers of this article who wish to comment step back from their views on the march itself and the people who will 'potentially' be marching and instead provide their view on the reasons the T&A want this march banned, specifically around the comment "Bradford has come a long way since the dark days of the riots and that is a credit to all of its people."

As we stand today in 2010, I personally believe that Bradford is in a far worse shape than it was a decade ago prior to the riots. It is up to the Government, the Council and the Police force to address the City's problems to allow its residents to begin to take responsibility and to integrate and work together as communities which would ensure that the riots have not permanently damaged the City. It is up to the T&A to continually report the facts so that its readers can see progress, not to cover paper over the cracks with wishful rhetoric that not only paints an untue picture of Bradford but also does more damage to the City than good.

McAbsent wrote:
Well done to the editor, it's funny how the comments are about immigration... the EDL claims not to be about race but against Islamic extremists, so they say, only an idiot will fall for this.

Only an idiot would fall for there conspiracy theories based on the fear of the unknown.

All this crap about no-go area's, when they're only no go due to the fear and paranoia of those that do not wish to go to these area's.

Only an idot would buy there obsecure population figures based on lies.

The EDL are like Nazi's, alienating and creating a stigma, fuelling hate against Muslims just like the Nazi's did to the Jews.

Ban the EDL, they incite racial hate, just like the organisations such as Islam4UK and MAC. Ban the lot of them.

If the EDL turn up, no-one should expect the community being used as a scape goat just to sit back, I wish they would but when they're being attacked by the EDL if they just sit-back the EDL will claim victory for getting their empty-barrel message succeed.

Bradford does not need this, it may not be a perfect city but the EDL turning up will not improve and will only make it worse.

Well Said

My own conclusions are that the EDL while having some justification for its existence are more than anything a provocative group whose eventual aims are division (I await to be convinced that that aim is not inevitable).
I must say that interviews with their spokepersons and footage of their other demonstrations does not fill me with admiration.
On the other hand looking in a similar manner at those that they oppose fills me with even less admiration.
I really think that the T&A would have been wiser to have given this a much lower profile, one has to ask "are they merely adding fuel to the fire", if the event takes place I hope that the following day brings sighs of relief all round (I have my doubts!).

@PTN, you are 100% correct with your comment "........and the losers ?Bradford and its citizens."
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However, your argument about the EDL is over simplistic, the EDL which formed in May 2009 when the ‘United People of Luton’ counter demonstrated against ‘Islamic radicals’ at the homecoming parade of the Royal Anglian Regiment. The presence and existence of the EDL is itself a counter protest to repeated and often very offensive protests by extreme elements of the Muslim community.
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Although it was dealt with by police there was a small Muslim protest against St. George's day outside city hall, plus there have been a number of adhoc anti-Israel protests again on Centenary Square. With that in mind I do see that there is hyprocracy in Bradford if some demonstrations are allow yet others are not.
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If we're saying Bradford is so ethnically diverse and has moved forward, then what are we worried about? Other cities have had such demos without riots why should Bradford be different unless we're admitting that Bradford really does have deep rooted problems and we'd rather keep quiet.

I wonder if the editor or any of his minions read these comments?

If they do, I think they will realise that their biased dogma is diametrically oposed to that of most of the long suffering citizens of Bradford.

If they, once in a while, carried out some balanced, even handed investigation and reporting, they might not make such embarrassing gaffes as trumpeting about their latest "campaign", which, to me, seems to be receiving no support whatsover.

Please, Pleas, Please STOP this vile hate that is being spouted out on here.
Bradford has got issues and problems just like any other city but to blame someone else or community for our own difficulties is just plain wrong.
I can't believe how bitter some of you are when we all have access to the same opportunities here.
God help you this is no way to carry on.
The EDL are a group that thrive on peoples misfortunes and unhappiness for their own purposes. If you look on Youtube you'll see exactly what this group is all about and the skinheaded, fatbellied bigots that represent it says it all.
Ask yourself do these people really represent you and the way you feel.

Security word skin-fuel says it all

Maxpowers83 wrote:
It is clear to see that the people responding to this article so far think it is not only incorrect but on some levels offensive as it treats the readers of this newspapers as fools. Regardless of whether you believe it is right that the EDL (or any other group) are right to march within the City, the justification used by this newspaper is based on untruthes and opinions rather than facts. I do not think anyone, regardless of their background, religion or beliefs would say that Bradford is a City of communities who work together and I would also be surprised to hear that people in Bradford think the City has moved on from the riots that took place in the early 2000s. Regardless of the march, the issues that caused the riots are still prevelant in Bradford today and are still to be tackled. More than anything it is disappointing to see the City's own newspaper being prepared to sweep these issues under the carpet rather than dealing with them, an approach which not only does nothing to fix the problem but also contributes to the worsening situation. I would hope that in a few days when a broad section of the readers have commented on this article the T&A will respond with a story that analyses what the residents of this City feel and will do this in an unbiased manner. The T&A is a local newspaper and its role is to report events in a factual manner, not in a way that polarises areas of the City. I would ask that the readers of this article who wish to comment step back from their views on the march itself and the people who will 'potentially' be marching and instead provide their view on the reasons the T&A want this march banned, specifically around the comment "Bradford has come a long way since the dark days of the riots and that is a credit to all of its people." As we stand today in 2010, I personally believe that Bradford is in a far worse shape than it was a decade ago prior to the riots. It is up to the Government, the Council and the Police force to address the City's problems to allow its residents to begin to take responsibility and to integrate and work together as communities which would ensure that the riots have not permanently damaged the City. It is up to the T&A to continually report the facts so that its readers can see progress, not to cover paper over the cracks with wishful rhetoric that not only paints an untue picture of Bradford but also does more damage to the City than good.

Absolutely right - well said sir (or madam) as one who works in Bradford quite a bit, I am deeply worried by the problems that the place has and the lack of willingness to address these head on which gives rise to racism and hatred, and not only by the white underclass.
The T&A is a disgrace and I feel that this is because they have an editor who is far too cosy, lacks ambition (clearly as he has been there for years and his reporters have no respect for him) and is not going to do anything in any way controversial.
Ask him why he think the EDL march will be a disaster for Bradford. I will tell him it is because his paper and others have done little to address the real issues in Bradford, for fear of being unpopular. Manningham, Leeds Rd, Bradford Moor and other places are third world slums but were once fine residential areas. The pavements outside shops are littered with junk displays of product. If a shopkeeper in Bingley, Eldwick or Ilkley did that then everyone knows they would be prosecuted - this is why you get ill feeling in Bradford, lack of fairness. Start banging your drum about real issues Mr Austin Clark

osamabobladen wrote:
I dont think there is peace and harmony in this city. Its as divided as it ever was. Its about time the T & A pulled its head out of the sand, raised the issue and stopped being scared of offending ONE communnity and ONE culture.

Can't disagree with anything you say

Didn't notice the T&A running any petitions when Islam4uk planned to march in Wooton Basset !!! if nobody turned up to oppose this march their wouldn't be any trouble ....simple !

Perhaps some of you might like to put your thoughts into action and read and sign a petition I have started to ask the government to come down hard on uninsured drivers.


http://www.gopetitio
n.co.uk/petition/380
10.html

I for one welcome the EDL to Bradford. Everyone is supposed to be entitled to their opinions but if it risks upsetting the Muslim community then that right seems to be sadly overlooked. Let the EDL come and have a Peaceful demonstration. If the violent thugs from the UAF disrupt the day as they have at other EDL gatherings, then it shows them for what they are. If Bradford cannot be treated as any other city in the UK, simply because of one particular MINORITY then its a very sad day indeed.

where do i sign to ban the uaf counter march? If one can march then they both can march! stop sticking your head in the sand T & A and represent the majority of bradford!

No need to ban it - just ignore it.
Bradford is a very divided City. The Council is unfit for purpose in that it has made the indigenous Bradford people second class citizens.
Marching and the probability of riot will not help the situation and Bradfordians should not get involved.
The EDL are permiitted to make a peaceful protest.

reading theses comments, i think the T&A has done more for splitting the city more than the EDL could do with their march. it seems Bradford is simmering and ready to boil over at any time.the indiginous population are ignored and fear ( or threat) of a repeat of the riots of yesteryear are being used by certain members of the community has a means to rule by fear. i think a serious problem is afoot in Bradford and the authoritys need to realise this and stop burying their heads in the sand it's gone on long enough.

I agree with many of the comments here about the poor state of relations in Bradford.
I can't believe that the T and A site attracts only the embittered racist, therefore assume there is little genuine support for this petition.
If there was an organisation that could be seen to be genuinly campaigning for a better Britain, total integration and shared values, then I would back it.

http://www.mancheste
ruaf.org/future-even
ts/228-mobilise-now-
to-oppose-the-edl-in
-bradford.html

Great, just what this city needs! At least the council have destroyed enough of the City Centre to ensure damage is kept to a minimum....

"Bradford is a city rich in many cultures – something of which we can be justifiably proud."

Just picking up on one small part of the article which shows how little the T&A knows about the reality of Bradford. Is anyone proud of Bradford? I don't think so. Most people I know HATE the city now, including people that have lived there since before WW2.

I am from the south and the issues in Bradford are not at all a problem in a lot of places in the south, which is why nothing ever gets done and why they deem people up here as racists. They only know what the media reports, and as you can see from this article, it is a very biased viewpoint. In reality, Bradford is a horrible place to live. As a gay female, living in Bradford has been a horrible experience and I have moved out as quickly as possible. It is a scary place to live and has so much racial tension. As everyone here is saying, it is one rule for one and one for another. I don't understand how all the things that Britain has brought into the modern age, like equality of men and women and tolerance of homosexuals is allowed to be disregarded by certain people. Like most have said, if you are not going to accept our culture or rules then you should not be in our country. If where you came from and your culture is so great then why the hell are you here anyway??! Our country is a joke and there will be some kind of civil war before long if nothing is done quickly.

I despise being called a racist for my views as I have asian friends and colleagues. People are not racist if what they are saying is true.

bredandbuttered wrote:
I agree with many of the comments here about the poor state of relations in Bradford.
I can't believe that the T and A site attracts only the embittered racist, therefore assume there is little genuine support for this petition.
If there was an organisation that could be seen to be genuinly campaigning for a better Britain, total integration and shared values, then I would back it.

Why i someone a racist because they are fed up of being treated like morons by papers like the, second class citizens by the council, or are sick of having Islam affect our day to day lives.

Racism works two ways, I think you need to remember that, The most openly racist people in this city are people who practise the Islamic faith

T&ahypocrites wrote:

bredandbuttered wrote: I agree with many of the comments here about the poor state of relations in Bradford. I can't believe that the T and A site attracts only the embittered racist, therefore assume there is little genuine support for this petition. If there was an organisation that could be seen to be genuinly campaigning for a better Britain, total integration and shared values, then I would back it.

Why i someone a racist because they are fed up of being treated like morons by papers like the, second class citizens by the council, or are sick of having Islam affect our day to day lives. Racism works two ways, I think you need to remember that, The most openly racist people in this city are people who practise the Islamic faith

Sorry I didn't make myself clear.
I don't think that people on here are generally rascist is what I meant.

my apologies

hang your head in shame t&a. we live in democracy of which you benefit from freedom of speech. edl is peacefull the problems come when UAF are involved. yet don't ban there demo its there freedom to do so. would you call for a ban on a muslim demo in case some didn't like it, i don't think so and i wouldn't want you to. grow up and if you feel some of the citizens of bradford don't like you just buckle. spinless.

me thinks Bradford is a City divided already reading theses comments.

I think what is missing here, and from many of the articles we read, is a response.
From the TandA I mean.
If there is an opinion in print, then that opinion should be seen to stand up in arguement.
By these means the reader may make his point without feeling the frustration of not being heard.
Someone must be reading this, and thinking whatever, so lets hear it TandA, or do you just print these comments and retire to the water-cooler for a chinwag?
Simples.

We're too **** nice in this country. Not letting the EDL into Bradford might "infringe on their human rights" - B0LL0X! These people are morons who should be kept out of the City at all costs. I have lived in many parts of Bradford including BD9, BD8, BD3 and now BD15. And I'll give you all one guess the type of people who caused the trouble in those areas, and it's most certainly not the Muslim community. My neighbours now are a wonderful friendly muslim family who bend over backwards to help their neighbours and my street would not be the same without them living there. I do hope that people support this campaign and the authorities take note and act on it with a strongmessage that this type of demonstration is dated, unwanted and **** right insulting to all White british people living in Bradford.

bredandbuttered wrote:
I think what is missing here, and from many of the articles we read, is a response.
From the TandA I mean.
If there is an opinion in print, then that opinion should be seen to stand up in arguement.
By these means the reader may make his point without feeling the frustration of not being heard.
Someone must be reading this, and thinking whatever, so lets hear it TandA, or do you just print these comments and retire to the water-cooler for a chinwag?
Simples.

Agreed, I would like the Editor to answer my question........is there anybody out there?

newbold9 wrote:
hang your head in shame t&a. we live in democracy of which you benefit from freedom of speech. edl is peacefull the problems come when UAF are involved. yet don't ban there demo its there freedom to do so. would you call for a ban on a muslim demo in case some didn't like it, i don't think so and i wouldn't want you to. grow up and if you feel some of the citizens of bradford don't like you just buckle. spinless.

Watch the hidden footage on The Guardian Website, there's nothing peaceful about the demonstrations by the EDL, they're a dying breed of racist idiots who are living decades after their time has been and gone. The world has moved on, it's time you did as well.

if u want to know wot the edl is about check out the edl forum.then make up your mind.anybody can view wot thier members think of all muslims.if uchanged the word muslims to jews they would be banned under anti semstic laws.please check out the site.

I'm stunned how many people are hiding what appear to be their views and the views of the EDL behind the banner "Freedom of Speech". Yes we live in a Democracy and yes we have the benefit of freedom of speech but that doesn't mean, in my opinion, that it's acceptable to walk the streets and say whatever the hell you like? If I confronted someone on the street and called them something derogatory would they stand aside and say "well done sir for excerising your right to Freedom of Speech"? No, I'd get chinned! The same principle applies with this. Just because it's "allowed" doesn't mean it should happen and it's time these uneducated, old fashioned beliefs and views were driven out - starting on August 21st!!

I'm amazed that given that so many of our families fought to keep the Nazi's out of the UK that some people actually think that being anti - nazi is something we should want to ban.
Some organisations - the BNP, NF and the EDL are racist organisations that are opposed to all things British. They are no better or worse than those extremist Muslims who want to demonstrate and rejoice in the death of British troups. All these groups have forgotten what Great Britain stood for and should not be allowed to travel around the country stirring up hatred. You have a chance to vote - at the last election despite a larger turnout the BNP and other similar parties votes went down. Most Bradfordians want to get get on and don't want extremist coming along to stir up trouble then leave us to sort it out.
I repeat please think - anti nazi is what most of us are - although there seem to be one or two who would have been on the other side in WW2.

blacksheep wrote:

newbold9 wrote: hang your head in shame t&a. we live in democracy of which you benefit from freedom of speech. edl is peacefull the problems come when UAF are involved. yet don't ban there demo its there freedom to do so. would you call for a ban on a muslim demo in case some didn't like it, i don't think so and i wouldn't want you to. grow up and if you feel some of the citizens of bradford don't like you just buckle. spinless.

Watch the hidden footage on The Guardian Website, there's nothing peaceful about the demonstrations by the EDL, they're a dying breed of racist idiots who are living decades after their time has been and gone. The world has moved on, it's time you did as well.

Are the black, Jewish and Asian members of the EDL also racists? Are Muslims a race?

Of course the only people really living in the past are peple like the T&A, the UAF, ANL etc and their obsession with 'Nazis' that do not exist but offer a oportunity to live out some left-wing fantasy.

The joke of white middle class UAF students chanting 'nazis off our street' to black and asian EDL demonstrators seems lost on them.

I've just looked at the Guardian uncovered tapes, and I can see nothing but hatred coming from the EDL.
The issues they raise may be in some cases worthy of comment, but the leadership is manevolantly striking paranoia into the hearts of the lost youth of this once proud nation. (Thank you Tony, thank you Maggie, etc etc.)
I think the more important petition here should be directed at the muslim youth in Bradford, some of whom will be licking their lips at the though of a confrontation with the EDL, who they will see as a legitimate reason to riot.
If the Muslim leaders could petition or ban their youth from reacting, even turning up at the demonstration, if it does go ahead, then all will not be lost.
They need to explain that to not show up doesn't mean to lose face.
I for one will not be there to support or protest about anything, so does that make me apathetic?
No, I just think shouting is an overrated form of arguement.

Billcliff wrote:
I'm amazed that given that so many of our families fought to keep the Nazi's out of the UK that some people actually think that being anti - nazi is something we should want to ban. Some organisations - the BNP, NF and the EDL are racist organisations that are opposed to all things British. They are no better or worse than those extremist Muslims who want to demonstrate and rejoice in the death of British troups. All these groups have forgotten what Great Britain stood for and should not be allowed to travel around the country stirring up hatred. You have a chance to vote - at the last election despite a larger turnout the BNP and other similar parties votes went down. Most Bradfordians want to get get on and don't want extremist coming along to stir up trouble then leave us to sort it out. I repeat please think - anti nazi is what most of us are - although there seem to be one or two who would have been on the other side in WW2.

There are hundreds of blacks and asians and Jews in the EDL, there are many videos of them and interviews with them, why do all the people who oppose the EDL simply ignore this fact and continue to repeat the 'Nazi' rubbish? As for WW2, my grandfather fought in it for 4 years and would be sick to his stomach to see the state of Bradford today.

Hi everyone,

I dont understand why the EDL have not been banned already. What they say and what they do can be two different things, dont believe me? Just check out footage of thier 'peaceful' protests. They are full of violence and hatered, full of racism and fascism.
Its not like they havent been given a chance, so why are we going to let them in our city to do the same?
What stops other gangs forming going around city to city spreading hatered and violence? This has gone on far too long, Ban the EDL.

The EDL (or militant wing of the BNP) are a hideous organisation consisting of drunken football hooligans and ex-convicts spoiling for a scrap. They cost the taxpayer a fortune as it is (most of them are unemployed layabouts) without adding the cost of vandalism and policing these thugs.

Extremist nutters like Islam4uk were banned (and rightly so) - now its time for Mr Cameron to do the same with the EDL thugs.

I think the word to sum up this article is #fail. An obscure paper, writing an over the top article, and even being silly enough to allow comments, most of whom are against this protest.

Why don't you give reference to the group with over 3,000 members on Facebook? Or the Hope Not Hate petition? Or the event that happened in town on Saturday?

Awful, awful reporting, awful awful plea, the T&A needs to take a long hard look at itself.

Billcliff wrote:
I'm amazed that given that so many of our families fought to keep the Nazi's out of the UK that some people actually think that being anti - nazi is something we should want to ban.
Some organisations - the BNP, NF and the EDL are racist organisations that are opposed to all things British. They are no better or worse than those extremist Muslims who want to demonstrate and rejoice in the death of British troups. All these groups have forgotten what Great Britain stood for and should not be allowed to travel around the country stirring up hatred. You have a chance to vote - at the last election despite a larger turnout the BNP and other similar parties votes went down. Most Bradfordians want to get get on and don't want extremist coming along to stir up trouble then leave us to sort it out.
I repeat please think - anti nazi is what most of us are - although there seem to be one or two who would have been on the other side in WW2.

The Anti-Nazi League is simply a title designed to provoke opposition to the NF in the 1970s.
If there were a call to arms tomorrow to defend this country against a Nazi invader it is in my opinion that you would see a greater percentage of volunteers from those that the ANL oppose than from ANL supporters themselves.
The EDL is not a Nazi organisation and during my questioning of one of its leading members a few months ago I was told that it has no intention of becoming actively involved in politics.
If you read my one and only previous post on here you will see that I am certainly not a supporter of them.
If you want something that might well end up resembling Nazism in this country look in the direction of those that the EDL stand against.

blacksheep wrote:

newbold9 wrote:
hang your head in shame t&a. we live in democracy of which you benefit from freedom of speech. edl is peacefull the problems come when UAF are involved. yet don't ban there demo its there freedom to do so. would you call for a ban on a muslim demo in case some didn't like it, i don't think so and i wouldn't want you to. grow up and if you feel some of the citizens of bradford don't like you just buckle. spinless.

Watch the hidden footage on The Guardian Website, there's nothing peaceful about the demonstrations by the EDL, they're a dying breed of racist idiots who are living decades after their time has been and gone. The world has moved on, it's time you did as well.

The guardian, Your having a laugh arnt you.
Its the furthest left you can get.

T&ahypocrites wrote:

blacksheep wrote:

newbold9 wrote:
hang your head in shame t&a. we live in democracy of which you benefit from freedom of speech. edl is peacefull the problems come when UAF are involved. yet don't ban there demo its there freedom to do so. would you call for a ban on a muslim demo in case some didn't like it, i don't think so and i wouldn't want you to. grow up and if you feel some of the citizens of bradford don't like you just buckle. spinless.

Watch the hidden footage on The Guardian Website, there's nothing peaceful about the demonstrations by the EDL, they're a dying breed of racist idiots who are living decades after their time has been and gone. The world has moved on, it's time you did as well.

The guardian, Your having a laugh arnt you.
Its the furthest left you can get.

And your point is what exactly? The Video footage, whether it's filmed by The Guardian or the bloke down the street, tells the truth about the EDL

I actually thnk this campaign by the T&A isa dangerous. The march is going ahead hav e no doubt, the WY Police have moved Citys fixture for that Saturaday to the friday night, it was done weeks ago, additionally businesses have been told in the City centre so they can close up. All this campaign is going to do is wind up a certain section of Bradford with the mistaken belief they have the right to oppose the march physically. If that community riots, if people are killed, as lest we forget they very nearly were the last time, the T&A will have blood on its hands.

How come when certain sections of the community want to march or demonstrate it's 'free speech' , yet others are victimised??? Yet another step in the wrong direction. Am disgusted with the T&A.

The EDL are a bunch of thick yobs. I understand the reason behind the formation of the 'party' but blaming there own short comings on someone else is pretty pathetic.

Let me march I say, let the protesters in and ring the bell.

Quote from T&A.
"We believe that if this march were to go ahead it could only damage community relations and threaten the prosperity and harmony of the city and district".

What community relations,what prosperity and harmony.....??????
Dont make me laugh....!!!!!

The EDl, as far as I can see, want to march against Extremism in Islam, and the erosion of our British pride. What is wrong with that? If you are a Muslim, who truly believes that your religion should be one of peace, you should agree with that ethos. Also why should we not be proud to be British, indeed English, if we so wish. This town erupts with Pakistani flags, whenever they win at cricket, and roads are blocked in and out of the city. I don't see that as a problem. Just so long as we reserve the right to celebrate our national pride with equal vigour. I was in the city centre the day of the riot July 2001 and I know who the trouble makers were, I saw the glee with which they destroyed our city. If this gives 'the community' the excuse to do it again, will it really be the fault of the EDL? I think not.

Mekon wrote:
The EDL are a bunch of thick yobs. I understand the reason behind the formation of the 'party' but blaming there own short comings on someone else is pretty pathetic.

Let me march I say, let the protesters in and ring the bell.

yes becuase its their own shortcoming that soldiers were hurled with abuse on their homecoming parade.

Ajay Gujju wrote:
I am a Hindu and have lived in Bradford all my life. Myself and my family have been victims of racist attacks. bradford is not a happy place, divided very much. These days all our abuse is from muslim community, we can not go in certain parts.
I have read about the edl, us Asians dont see them as racist although I am far to old at 60 to join them on march.
This paper should be ashamed of itself telling lies and forgetting about us Hindu's when we are victims to this new radical islam which dominates in Bradford.
Instead of saying no to edl, the people of bradford need to stand in support.

Amazing! this quote shows it affects everyone, British people of all creed and colour need to unite! People who work hard, have values and respect and genuinely love this country!

cypruscentral wrote:

Ajay Gujju wrote: I am a Hindu and have lived in Bradford all my life. Myself and my family have been victims of racist attacks. bradford is not a happy place, divided very much. These days all our abuse is from muslim community, we can not go in certain parts. I have read about the edl, us Asians dont see them as racist although I am far to old at 60 to join them on march. This paper should be ashamed of itself telling lies and forgetting about us Hindu's when we are victims to this new radical islam which dominates in Bradford. Instead of saying no to edl, the people of bradford need to stand in support.

Amazing! this quote shows it affects everyone, British people of all creed and colour need to unite! People who work hard, have values and respect and genuinely love this country!

It does exactly that. Pity it will go un -noticed.

BigWookie wrote:
I actually thnk this campaign by the T&A isa dangerous. The march is going ahead hav e no doubt, the WY Police have moved Citys fixture for that Saturaday to the friday night, it was done weeks ago, additionally businesses have been told in the City centre so they can close up. All this campaign is going to do is wind up a certain section of Bradford with the mistaken belief they have the right to oppose the march physically. If that community riots, if people are killed, as lest we forget they very nearly were the last time, the T&A will have blood on its hands.

100% spot on, pubs have already been told to close by the police so it appears planning and preparation is already at an advanced stage.
.
The T & A has been misguided in using very strong emotive language. A more balanced article looking at events and actions by both the EDL and UAF (neither group is innocent) and seeking a view from the police beforehand wouldn't have hurt.
.
Those wishing to travel to Bradford and cause disorder will use any failure in this campaign as justification for their actions.
.
The T & A should be promoting calm, reason, tolerance and trying to play down the fear and panic that even the trade unions are communicating in what otherwise will simply be a point scoring excercise between the EDL and UAF at Bradford's expense.

eccythump wrote:
The EDl, as far as I can see, want to march against Extremism in Islam, and the erosion of our British pride. What is wrong with that? If you are a Muslim, who truly believes that your religion should be one of peace, you should agree with that ethos. Also why should we not be proud to be British, indeed English, if we so wish. This town erupts with Pakistani flags, whenever they win at cricket, and roads are blocked in and out of the city. I don't see that as a problem. Just so long as we reserve the right to celebrate our national pride with equal vigour. I was in the city centre the day of the riot July 2001 and I know who the trouble makers were, I saw the glee with which they destroyed our city. If this gives 'the community' the excuse to do it again, will it really be the fault of the EDL? I think not.

Agreed......!!!!!

If all those people writting here think Bradford is a **** hole, then why dont you pack your bags and F...k off somewhere else. Some people like Bradford. Its not the best, but then its not the worst. Go round the country and you will see a lot worse areas than Bradford. Well done to the T&A for standing up to the EDL or UAF or any other arseholes who come to cause trouble in this city.

sexysam wrote:
If all those people writting here think Bradford is a **** hole, then why dont you pack your bags and F...k off somewhere else. Some people like Bradford. Its not the best, but then its not the worst. Go round the country and you will see a lot worse areas than Bradford. Well done to the T&A for standing up to the EDL or UAF or any other arseholes who come to cause trouble in this city.

I have! & everyone I speak to says it's a lot worse than when I left 4 years ago. Doesn't mean I have to stop caring about the city I was raised in or my family who still live there.

sexysam wrote:
If all those people writting here think Bradford is a **** hole, then why dont you pack your bags and F...k off somewhere else. Some people like Bradford. Its not the best, but then its not the worst. Go round the country and you will see a lot worse areas than Bradford. Well done to the T&A for standing up to the EDL or UAF or any other arseholes who come to cause trouble in this city.

We cant afford to cos we tow the line and all our money goes to pay taxes for the immigrants....!!!!!
You'll understand one day....!!!

It just goes to show that we all have different views, different ways of expressing ourselves, and they should be tolerated.

Let he who is without sin etc.

Such a shame we have to have religion at all, it just seems to stir up hatred via the 'holier than thou' card.

If we are to censure beliefs we should start by censuring religions.

sexysam wrote:
If all those people writting here think Bradford is a **** hole, then why dont you pack your bags and F...k off somewhere else. Some people like Bradford. Its not the best, but then its not the worst. Go round the country and you will see a lot worse areas than Bradford. Well done to the T&A for standing up to the EDL or UAF or any other arseholes who come to cause trouble in this city.

Ive lived in Bradford for 27 years and still Follow the football team round the country. I have recently moved out of the city to live with my partner but am trying to get her to move back to bradford with me but she won't because of the reputation its got. I love bradford but when I visit and see what its becoming makes me sick, when I hear stories of my mum walking to work and getting called a white B***h and told to get out or their area, when I see a normal working mens club ive visited all my life vandalised and and robbed repeatedly by asian youths hoping that eventually they will sell up so it can be turned into another mosque then things have gone to far. Everytime I visit it gets a bit worse and if this march is what it takes to get the useless council or government to act and do something about 'My city' then unfortunately it must be done.

sexysam wrote:
If all those people writting here think Bradford is a **** hole, then why dont you pack your bags and F...k off somewhere else. Some people like Bradford. Its not the best, but then its not the worst. Go round the country and you will see a lot worse areas than Bradford. Well done to the T&A for standing up to the EDL or UAF or any other arseholes who come to cause trouble in this city.

But the T&A ARE NOT standing up to the UAF are they? They havent even mentioned them, or suggesting banning them coming to Bradford, despite the fact that the UAF cuase far more trouble than the EDL.
And you know why they havent mentioned them? Because as always our wonderful local paper doesnt want to risk upsetting "the community"
I have no time for the EDL, but i have far less time for the leftwing loonies in the UAF, and the section of our community that thinks it is above the law.

birkybull wrote:
We live in a democracy... neither demonstration should be banned.. it is everyones right to demonstrate. This country is scared to upset the ethnic community. it is high time that british people were not treated like 2nd class citizens. Bradford is over run with people from Eastern Europe.
Its time our doors were closed. Stop spending taxpayers money on funding to make there areas nice, and facilities for minorities... If you dont like what it is go home. This does not only just apply to anyone who is one colour. It applies to anyone not born here. If you dont like what is going on... please feel free to leave the country. And stop sponging off the hard working British public

Bradford is over run with people from Far East not from East Europe....

It's really sad that so many people in the city feel this way. There are problems on both sides but if those of you think that immigration is the problem then I am sorry to say that you are deluded. Do you really think that if there was no immigration into BFD it would be a thriving metropolis. Do you really think the city would not be in decline. Unfortunately, it has happend all over the north it's called globilisation. Goods are now manufactured in cheaper economies and imported into Europe.
As for the city itself what i see is two very devided communities. There never was a period of utopia whether it was the rampant racism of the 70s and 80s or the riots of the 90s and later by the Asain youth. There will always be a simmering undercurrent of mistrust and hatred until the two communities genuinely start dialogue.
Peace

As everyone here is saying that Bradford is divided and has so many problems, a tinderbox of ethnic tensions, why are people so keen on the Edl marching? Do you actually WANT another riot? The Edl won't solve Bradford's problems by marching around for a few hours. All that will happen will be that the Edl will bring attention to themselves when the inevitable riot breaks out. Nothing will get any better, in fact it'll almost certainly get worse.

@ BigWookie. It doesn't matter whether the T&A try and petition to get the march stopped, elements of the Muslim community will come out and oppose it regardless as has been the case elsewhere. Just as Edl members have said they will come even if the march is banned.

@ R.S.Peters. The Palestinian concentration camps, which were going to be built by the Grand Mufti if his Nazi friends had won the war? That would be the ineffectual Grand Mufti who did bugger all and wasn't liked by his fellow Muslim leaders. What about the operational concentration camps actually built in Germany, a Christian nation, or the rounding up of Jews all over Europe often with the collaboration of their Christian governments?

@ Marco Polio. More UAF are arrested every time? I don't think so. Other than a large number at Bolton (where the UAF were allowed to walk away when the Edl were getting beaten by the cops) and Westminster, it's been mostly the Edl being arrested.

Dudley - 21 Edl & 0 UAF
Newcastle - 0 Edl & 0 UAF
Aylesbury - 12 Edl & 0 UAF
Dudley - 12 Edl & 0 UAF
Bolton - 9 Edl & 55 UAF
London - 2 Edl & 48 UAF
Stoke - 25 Edl (17 on the day)& 0 UAF
Wrexham - 4 Wdl & 0 UAF
Nottingham - 11 Edl & 0 UAF
Leeds - 9 Edl & 0 UAF
Manchester - 36 Edl & 12 UAF
Harrow - 8 Edl & 0 UAF
Birmingham - 90 total
Birmingham - 35 total

So that comes to 149 confirmed Edl arrests and 115 confirmed Edl/anti-fascist/Mus
lim arrests. The only reason the UAF arrests are as high as they are is entirely down to London and Bolton, otherwise the Edl manage to get arrested at near enough every demo. The UAF cause more trouble? What were they doing when the Edl were rampaging through Stoke, Dudley (twice) and Aylesbury? Not a great deal by the sounds of things. At Stoke they were drinking tea and listening to Bob Marley whilst the Edl were attacking the police lines in a effort to get at them.

@ pavva. So the English Defence League is a non-racist, non-fascist , non-violent group? That would be a non-racist group whose members and one of its leaders call people 'P*kis'. A non-fascist group that tries to disrupt meetings by political opponents, intimidates them and calls for them to be hung and shot. A non-violent group that has staged yet another unprovoked riot and smashed up another town, which yet again it has blamed on people who weren't even anywhere near the Edl. At both Dudley riots, Stoke and Aylesbury the anti-Edl faction either were out of sight a considerable distance away, or not even in town. Result: the Edl rioted.

I've also noticed that for a supposedly non-racist organisation many people on here speak in terms of whites and Muslims, implying that this is a white vs Asian issue not a religious one. For those supposedly attacked by Muslims, did you ask them what their religion was, or does Asian = Muslim? It certainly looks as if that is the assumption being made.

Also interesting is that for a movement supposedly only for combating extreme Islam, the number of comments about immigration, race and Muslims in general that are on here. The Edl is just the BNP's street army. Stephen Yaxley-Lennon was BNP and now your new leader Kevin Carroll is a BNP supporter as well. Either that or he's incredibly stupid for proposing a candidate of a party that (so he says) he knew nothing about until they turned up at his door and asked him to propose the candidate. If he had nothing to do with the BNP, why did they turn up at his door? They only needed 10 signatures so why "hoodwink" a perfect stranger? Also if he'd never heard of them why did he start off by asking if they were racist, especially if (so he says) none of the info they presented him had anything to do with race? Fishy yes?

Carroll will argue that he can't be racist because he has a mixed-race daughter. Yes he can, he just doesn't hate black people! His reaction towards Asian Muslims was that of revulsion. Just like the Edl in general will argue they aren't racist as they have a small handful of Asians and blacks in their ranks. At the same time their members talk of 'P*kis' and 'n*ggers' and make monkey noises at black people. That's as well as all the white power, BNP, NF and C18 connections the Edl membership have. You're not fooling anyone.

The point is what good is letting a gang of far right neo-Nazi football hooligans into Bradford going to do? They'll perform their little 'magic' ritual of chanting, drinking and waving their arms and signs about, but it won't make anything better or highlight any problem other than themselves.