City in shock Bulls ground-share call (From Bradford Telegraph and Argus)

Why is it a "shock call" ?

It's been banded around for ages.

Everyone knows it's not going to happen.

What is more likely to happen is that the Bulls move to the Shay in Halifax.

yes and it should happen sooner rather than later. However for the plan to succeed city would have to play at Odsal for a season in order to give time for VP to be adapted.

Something has to be done to stop the council losing 75 million.

To be honest it makes sense to share, but if the Bulls want to be stubborn and tell lies along with the council to cover the councils failures, then so be it !! City can live without the Bulls and the councils help. I am not sure the the Bulls will survive without the council. Good call by Mark Lawn, although it seems he only has one suit!!!

I feel that this idea of City & Bulls sharing Valley Parade put forward by Mr Lawn is an excellent idea,and would help both teams finacially...first of all, making the pitch bigger, would suit both teams,as at the present time, the playing area is too small to play good football for both codes...I think if the council thought seriously about this, they could have a first class stadium for both teams to play in, and also save a lot of ratepayers money which i am sure they would welcome.

We all know it should happen, common sense tells us that.
But we all know it won't happen because pride and predjudice overides common sense.

There are pro's and cons on both sides of the argument, both parties are acting in their own interests.

Bradfordmark, Where have you been lately? City are struggling like hell along with the Bulls and numerous other teams of both codes to survive,so you must know more than anybody else when you say City will survive without the Bulls.You obviously must work in high places at the Council when you say they are lying.

Here we go again, "minority sport" cheeky B,stard, i would rather move out of Bradford than move to VP for all the reasons previously written here...share a ground with city..yes..but not VP.

strange how most bantams were against any form of sharing, now they can't wait. is it something to do with money???. if city were given 15 million9 which the bulls aren't) by the council for a new ground/improvements to old, would they still want bulls at vp. i think not.

mr hood explains as to where the money is going, as do the council. bradfordmark, is looking at this through claret and amber eyes, so cannot make a valid judgement.

as to bulls and vp, there is limited parking, difficult to get to for away rl supporters, but most of all we can't stand and shout, on the terraces, so in my opinion its a no go, on a permanent basis, short term who knows.

This is a skewed power play from Lawn - although it does seem to make rational sense for the Bulls to use VP. It's very unlikely that the emotions and the will of the public will play a part in the decisions for this fiasco - even if it is public money. Would we have agreed for there to be a business case produced for the council at a cost of £1M at this time of economic frugality? We'll all have to put up with the council's poorly informed decisions regardless of what we want. Hood's assertion that the intentions of OSV ar not-for-profit maybe true, but the Bulls are not not-for-profit and were likely to do very well out of it. It's Hoods job to move Bulls forward and Lawns job to move City forward (and to protect his investment). There will always be a conflict of interest and the best investment strategy from either side will win the day. Let's not pretend that we have a say in this.

theviking52 wrote:
strange how most bantams were against any form of sharing, now they can't wait. is it something to do with money???. if city were given 15 million9 which the bulls aren't) by the council for a new ground/improvements to old, would they still want bulls at vp. i think not. mr hood explains as to where the money is going, as do the council. bradfordmark, is looking at this through claret and amber eyes, so cannot make a valid judgement. as to bulls and vp, there is limited parking, difficult to get to for away rl supporters, but most of all we can't stand and shout, on the terraces, so in my opinion its a no go, on a permanent basis, short term who knows.

Of course you can stand and shout. It's just that you'll be asked to sit down by a grumpy steward. What fan wouldn't pay good money for that. We will have no say in this decision.

theviking52 says its difficult for away rugby fans to get to valley parade. What more difficult than it is for away football fans?
Rugby fans must have special sat navs that only go to odsal!

Handbags are out

As a Bulls supporter for 35 years I believe we have very little option to share grounds with someone. It is all down to money – and common sense.
Both clubs are private companies. I am also a tax payer with spiralling bills to pay. Why don’t the council simply tell both companies that there is no more money from the council and they run their businesses themselves? Let’s see how long each club lasts then without other people who never set foot in either ground paying for a few thousand to go and watch a game they are not interested in. People may not like this but it is a fact that other people in the area are subsidising a few thousand football and rugby supporters. I am a season ticket holder at Northern / Bulls and believe this insane use of two stadiums for a few hours a fortnight is crazy. Can someone name a company who opened a large store in Bradford and said it is only to be used once a fortnight – and for a couple of hours at that.
If the council stopped all funding / sponsorship to both clubs we would soon see chairmen and supporters scratching their heads and wondering how their club will survive. It needs everyone to think about how we can have one superb facility that is used fully. Yes it will need some people to swallow their pride but it is the only way. I pay my season ticket to keep the Bulls going. Why should I and my neighbours also pay for the Bulls and City through our rates? Stop the money now to the clubs and see them start to talk to each other!

why can Huddersfield, Hull and Wigan to name but three can have both codes yet we have such polarised ( and narrow) views about the future.
There are too many conservative (small c) views which will stop all progress.

the enlargement of the playing created by the loss of some seats is an excellent idea and is certainly a lot cheaper option that proposed by the council now.

there is ample parking around VP for the 8/9000 fans attending Bulls games; so called lack of parking did not cause undue problems when VP was used for premiership games.

OK VP may not be ideal but it is the best option and, incidentaly, a cheaper option for both clubs and for both sports which are, in effect minority sports anyway. Only a very small percentage of the population actually attend either ground.

The whole deal put forward by Lawn will benefit the Bull who are, I believe , between a rock and and a hard place. Are not the Super league shortly to loook again at all clubs in the league:that review takes a close look at the stadium in which clubs play. What happens if the Super League decide Odsal is not fit for purpose and a licence is declined?

There are many issues to resolve for the betterment of professional sport in Bradford:that betterment should not be derailed by narrowmindedness!

The best option for the Bulls is to move to Valley Parade permanetly.With it's City centre location this move would help the whole City of Bradford producing more footfall in and around the centre ..The 25,000 seat capacity is plenty at the minute to cater for both clubs needs,but there is room to expand if needs be in the future..

lets debate, if we waste 15mill on the OSV most Bradfordians will never visit, as Odsal is nearer Halifax than Bradford. The parking/pitch issues at VP will be sorted by investment by both clubs. It will be the City of Bradford Stadium, fit for purpose for both teams. Over the years i can not estimate how much money the council have wasted on Odasal. Lets make one thing clear, Odsals development has not happened in the 35 years i have been alive, but it has always been spoken about. Lets not wait for the council, both clubs should put pride aside and join forces at V.P.

Couldnt of said it better myself, but we all know the council are hell bent of waisting our money because they havent got a clue in running a city as a whole, just look at the mess in the city center. and do the bulls deserve a magnificent stadium like Valley parrade after most of the trash that has come from bulls mouths, they dont deserve it. let em rot up at odsal....

bradfordmark wrote:
lets debate, if we waste 15mill on the OSV most Bradfordians will never visit, as Odsal is nearer Halifax than Bradford. The parking/pitch issues at VP will be sorted by investment by both clubs. It will be the City of Bradford Stadium, fit for purpose for both teams. Over the years i can not estimate how much money the council have wasted on Odasal. Lets make one thing clear, Odsals development has not happened in the 35 years i have been alive, but it has always been spoken about. Lets not wait for the council, both clubs should put pride aside and join forces at V.P.

Time to get your map out fella.

Odsal is 2.5 miles out of Bradford city centre and 6.5 miles from Halifax.

Ideally City and Bulls should all come to together at Valley Parade. The Bulls should forgot about OSV. The money just isn't there for it. VP is a top notch stadium suitable for both clubs. But both clubs tend to hate each other for some reason, so it's difficult to move forward together. But well done Huddersfield. They've managed to do it with the work of a fantastic council. Bradford Council on the other hand.....useless.

It's not rocket science, but to the Council it is. Lawn has suggested a sensible idea, and the Council shoot it down straight away. The Bias towards the Bulls is so obvious! The opportunity is there for the cash to be saved and an improved stadium for both clubs.....but the morons at the top are being morons as usual just like they are with the Odeon building. Bradford Council....you're a disgrace to our City.

Bcfc Boyz On Tour wrote:
Couldnt of said it better myself, but we all know the council are hell bent of waisting our money because they havent got a clue in running a city as a whole, just look at the mess in the city center. and do the bulls deserve a magnificent stadium like Valley parrade after most of the trash that has come from bulls mouths, they dont deserve it. let em rot up at odsal....

1. How many millions of pounds were wasted on the regeneration of Holmewood all those years ago ???
2. Wasting our money ? would that be your unemployment benefits being wasted ?
3. Valley Parade is NOT a magnificent stadium full stop, Take the changing rooms for instance.

Get a life and get more involved in matters that deserve your comments more, like crime, antisocial behaviour and interbreeding all things close to a holmewooders heart.

You can always spot a football fan's post, derrrrr! ug, umm, not the brightest bulb in the box!! As for a ground share it's got to happen in some era. deffinately not vp. My objection is where it's situated, i know thats been said many times but it's a major factor to a lot of fans.

kennyr13 wrote:
You can always spot a football fan's post, derrrrr! ug, umm, not the brightest bulb in the box!! As for a ground share it's got to happen in some era. deffinately not vp. My objection is where it's situated, i know thats been said many times but it's a major factor to a lot of fans.

Oi, stereo typicalising!

It's not exactly fair if the Bulls are getting money from the Council or a New Multi-Million pound Stadium and all City get is a few pounds for the odd Community Project here and there.

Ok Tezza i take your point but it was aimed at a certain brainless poster!

kennyr13 wrote:
You can always spot a football fan's post, derrrrr! ug, umm, not the brightest bulb in the box!! As for a ground share it's got to happen in some era. deffinately not vp. My objection is where it's situated, i know thats been said many times but it's a major factor to a lot of fans.

Why all the bitterness City v Bulls for God's sake were all sports fans from Bradford and we want the best for our clubs and the City of Bradford (with the revenue sport brings to the City) but unfortunatly Valley Parade is where Valley Parade is and we Bradford City fans have to live with it, but I honestly can't understand someone saying they would rather go out of the City to support their team rather than go to Valley Parade.

Financial sense says ground share. However neither ground is suited to the other sport. I can say this for fact having watched the Bantams (and a current season ticket holder) at Odsal in the mid 80's and watched the Bulls at VP at the turn of the century. So would a new ground at neither of the current locations suit both sets of supporters? Maybe so but that then brings back the spectre of huge financial investment by the council, both clubs and the private sector which I fear is a non starter in the current climate. This would appear to be a matter without a solution that suits everybody. Someone would have to compromise to make it work. The question is, who and are they willing?

If all Bulls fans say they will never watch Bulls at V.P than they are Fickle!! After the fire we travelled around Yorkshire to watch our team, No questions asked!! True supporters never resist. This debate has been happening too long, now is the chance to put it to bed. It makes sense for the Bulls at V.P . If not, you are going to lose your S.L license. Stop waitng for the council to bail you out. IT WILL NOT HAPPEN!!!

All Bulls fans, my love is the City of Bradford, I have been to watch rugby and footy in the city and its time we came together. Too much money has been wasted. If we leave it to the council we will be left with a hole in the ground. I urge you to get together with city fans and sort out a plan for the good of both teams. Put your hard heads aside and compromise. Bulls and City unite xxx

Let's not lose sight of the fact that these two 'clubs' are both actually businesses that are run for profit, clubs are run for the mutual benefit of members. Council tax payers should not prop up what appear to be failing private businesses ?

Think its a good idea and while were on the subject lets include a speedway track.

If people are concerned about parking I can't see the hole in the city being built on in the next 10 years so convert part into a carpark and put on a free statium bus on match days

Simples!

PS I'm not a fan of rubgy or football but if other city's can do it so can Bradford. This Odsal village thing has been dragging on far too long, my dad remembers items from 25-30 years ago about turning Odsal into a super stadium.

Valley Parade - No Way!! It's one of the ugliest stadiums I have ever seen and the location is as bad. Parking is shocking! There is nothing good about Valley Parade in my opinion. How about City groundshare with the Bulls at the Odsal Sporting Village when it's built, now there's an idea!

heres a controversial idea ..... why not go ahead and build the OSV and have City move in at Odsal !!!!!!

intruder3906 wrote:
Here we go again, "minority sport" cheeky B,stard, i would rather move out of Bradford than move to VP for all the reasons previously written here...share a ground with city..yes..but not VP.

Plenty of City fans don't want you moaning Bulls fans at VP either, if you want a stadium fit for purpose pay for it.

Here's a radical thought, why don't we buy Valley Parade and kick City out? They're only renting and we've got more than half of our money from sponsors for a new stadium. I'm sure £35mil would be more than enough to buy VP and convert it to suit Rugby League!
BETTER STILL, why not sell the land VP to fund the new stadium at Odsal? A brand spanking new one! Parking is better, road links are better and there's more land for expansion!
On the plus side Bulls fans, I heard on the grapevine that Park Avenue have secured private funding for a 20,000 all seater stadium at Thornbury (behind the new Odeon). We could invest with them and have the stadium both clubs deserve and let City enjoy Valley Parade in peace.
Failing those, I'd rather move to Cleckheaton or Halifax. Bradford lacks vision, ambition and a town centre above sea level!

theanorak wrote:

intruder3906 wrote: Here we go again, "minority sport" cheeky B,stard, i would rather move out of Bradford than move to VP for all the reasons previously written here...share a ground with city..yes..but not VP.

Plenty of City fans don't want you moaning Bulls fans at VP either, if you want a stadium fit for purpose pay for it.

plenty of City fans might not want the Bulls at VP but your beloved Mr Lawn feels differently, so maybe you should also be telling him pay for it himself as well !!!!

Calm down!! have a think!! Dickheads!!

bradfordmark wrote:
Calm down!! have a think!! Dickheads!!

oooooo touchy! OK, lets think....ermmmm thanks but no thanks. I'd rather ground share with Huddersfield!

Looking from afar, how sad it is that the chairmen of both clubs sound like children squabbling in the school yard.

Parking is better?????? the residents of Odsal are due to introduce a permit scheme. You all must open your eyes.

bradfordmark wrote:
Parking is better?????? the residents of Odsal are due to introduce a permit scheme. You all must open your eyes.

Yeah the big sports centre opposite...how did i ever miss that?!?! besides, I park at work and walk upto the stadium.

Gotta love Bradfordians. Always find something to moan about.

Brings a warm feeling to my pants.

i go to city every week but i hate walking through the area.
i know plenty of fans to do too.
like baby bangladesh.
move to a decent area.

Its very simple in my eyes if the bulls want a new stadium they should first buy the land from the council and then get private investment to build it. Not a single penny of taxpayers money should be wasted on it. The bulls as city are private companies and as such should support themselves. Even the planning applications and building regs should be paid for by the bulls just as any taxpayer would have to if he wanted to build a house extension

Bulls_chick wrote:
Valley Parade - No Way!! It's one of the ugliest stadiums I have ever seen and the location is as bad. Parking is shocking! There is nothing good about Valley Parade in my opinion. How about City groundshare with the Bulls at the Odsal Sporting Village when it's built, now there's an idea!

Theres no case of "when". Its NOT going to be built you dope, thats the problem.
.
Bulls are going to need City more than City need the Bulls. If they are facing expulsion they might have to take whatever they can get. And I doubt their fans are going to put up with trips to home games outside of Bradford, no matter how much anti-VP attitude they have.

Bulls_chick wrote:
Valley Parade - No Way!! It's one of the ugliest stadiums I have ever seen and the location is as bad. Parking is shocking! There is nothing good about Valley Parade in my opinion. How about City groundshare with the Bulls at the Odsal Sporting Village when it's built, now there's an idea!

Theres no case of "when". Its NOT going to be built you dope, thats the problem.
.
Bulls are going to need City more than City need the Bulls. If they are facing expulsion they might have to take whatever they can get. And I doubt their fans are going to put up with trips to home games outside of Bradford, no matter how much anti-VP attitude they have.

What you Bulls fans are forgetting is you will need a Super League licence in 2 years is it ? at the present time you wont get one with Odsal in the state it's in,that was stated by Mr Hood himself as you need "X" amount of covered seating face it OSV is NOT GETTING BUILT so unless Mr Hood comes up with some cash you wont get a licence THEN you may need Valley Parade, unless of course you prefer playing in Halikax,Huddersfield
,Leeds, or maybe The Don Valley Stadium, you are BRADFORD BULLS for gods sake not a fransize outfit.

I went to Odsal when city played there and it is the worst football arena I have ever been to.
Cold even in summer got soaked to the skin watching a west riding match with L**ds and then when the rain stopped was told we could go into the drafty empty stand
eebygum

Valley Parade today hosted a crowd of 11,000. There was no parking chaos, no one was murdered in the streets and the sun even shone. I can understand Bulls fans being attached to Odsal, but please engage brains when frightening yourselves to death about VPs location.
A ground share would be logical and would benefit both clubs. Odsal in its current state is completely unsuitable to sport in the 21st century. The OSV will not be built. As soon as the election is done it will be cancelled. Valley Parade is the only sensible option, but if the Bulls fans won't go fine. Stay at Odsal but don't expect one more penny from the Council. By all means spend our money on a replacement for Richard Dunns, but the ground should be funded entirely by the Bulls. If you can't do it alone then it could be bye-bye Super League and whose fault would that be? Ah yes the Council's, after all they only gave the Bulls near on £5m a few years ago, every penny of which was spent on the team which became world champions. Virtually nothing was spent on the ground and for that you may face ejection from the Super League. Please don't blame City or the Council for that, ti will be entirely your own fault for not sorting Odsal when you had the money to do so.

eebygum wrote:
I went to Odsal when city played there and it is the worst football arena I have ever been to. Cold even in summer got soaked to the skin watching a west riding match with L**ds and then when the rain stopped was told we could go into the drafty empty stand eebygum

Bulls supporters feel exactly the same about VP.
As Adey mentioned earlier we should buy VP kick city out and then sell the ground.
Im sure the locals would love to buy it and then they would just about own everything in that part of the city.

Bulls_chick wrote:
Valley Parade - No Way!! It's one of the ugliest stadiums I have ever seen and the location is as bad. Parking is shocking! There is nothing good about Valley Parade in my opinion. How about City groundshare with the Bulls at the Odsal Sporting Village when it's built, now there's an idea!

Firstly a compromise is needed for the benefit of both clubs and thus ultimately both sets of supporters. everyone with an history of Bradford sport will now accept that it would have been better for avanue and city to have ground shared at avenue but this was not done due to stubborness.

Has for an ugly stadium i followed Northern for years as a kid both home and away. the stadium has changed little since then in reality and is still basically a big hole in the ground very like the one allowed to develop in the town centre for the past ten years. Caisley was given approx 4 million painted a few posts, built an hospitality lounge for the priveliged few, which in itself is odd looking and hardly useful.

parking is just has bad but the town centre obviosly has better and easier options of public transport. however Dunn's is nicely cut-up every week and people's ash and rubiish dumped.

We used to play footie there every week for ten years but the pitches eneded up a disgrace due to Bulls parking.

You must also like standing in the rain, miles from the pitch, with little in the way of decent corporate facilities etc etc etc etc Surely a stadium thats had millions spent on it and was good enough for the Premier League TH RICHEST LEAGUE IN THE WORLD i may add, or a ground that has had a paint job by every other chairman.

We both need to ground share as it is in the interests of both parties.

This council is self-serving and corrupt (just ask who has the contract to build the pool for the answer to that one.....e.g. someone's relative allegedley. Or the alleged situation that a one time typing pool worker is now heading a major council department after marrying someone high up. I digress but the message is that they are not to be trusted and will act for whatever benefits themselves and that may not include the bulls. perhaps you yourself are a counciller?

We were after-all were promised and now supposed to be shopping in a new designer mega-store instaed of pound and charity shops.

In short you are biting off your nose and also mis-led if you believe that Odsal is the better option for the Bulls. This will only be the case if both teams move there and a great deal of money is spent, which just isn't going to happen i'm afraid.

If we are to deal in facts and not dreams then Valley Parade is far and away the better foreseeable option because it is the better stadium. Fact

Two issues jump out of this report for me.

Firstly, Hood claimed, "On that occasion, we negotiated a deal which enabled the Council to buy themselves out of their obligations under our previous lease.”

My understanding was that the site (Odsal) was owned by the Council and leased to the Bulls. However, in 2001/02, the Bulls BOUGHT the site off the council as "their (council) redevelopment plans failed to get off the ground". How come it cost tax-payers £5m to allow the Bulls to buy their ground?

Hood goes on to say, "In my judgement that was a very good deal for the taxpayer". What, agreeing to a spurious deal and then further agreeing to sell the ground to the Bulls and the tax-payers pick up another tab?????

The other issue is regarding the costings of OSV. If the council are to plough £15m into the development to "deliver sport, recreation and leisure facilities for all the people of the district by replacing an ageing Richard Dunn centre with a state-of-the-art facility and pool”, I would like to see these costings. Would the Council and/or Hood be open and honest and let the people of Bradford see them? I didn't think so!!!!!

Don't get me wrong, the idea of the OSV is obviously very good and can only benefit the city of Bradford. Who wouldn't want to use new recreational or swimming facilities on the current site of Richard Dunnes? I don't get what, 'providing education for our young people via Bradford College' has to do with the proposal though. Doesn't Bradford already have enough colleges, so I don't see the benefit in another being built in Odsal.

If the Bulls and their partners (BUT NOT THE COUNCIL), were to fund the development of the stadia and make it into a suitable venue for football and rugby, I would be happy to see City try to negotiate a deal to play there. However, with the amount of money it would cost Bulls/partners, I'm sure the rent would be just as expensive as Gibbs charges us now.

The fact is, if the Bulls DO NOT find enough money to adequately update Odsal, they risk being kicked out of the Super League. Have they ever heard the phrase, 'cutting off your nose to spite your face'?? Hood needs to realise his dream is just that..... a dream. He needs to realise this fast before there is no Bradford Bulls!

Well, lets see!! The offer is there from City. If the council give the Bulls another penny, then we should all march on City hall. The Bulls need to survive without the taxpayer like any other private business. That club has wasted enough of our money. It needs to be financially viable to continue. Its time the Bulls got a new chairmen with cash and brains. VP is the best option.

The City of Bradford Stadium, sponsored by Morrisons at VP. A multi purpose 20,000 all seater stadium fit for both rugby and football. The railway is connected in Bradford with a station at VP for away fans, Leave your cars at home. The station is in a tunnel because on top we have built some parking, bike sheds and shops and apartments. The stadium is connected by escalators and footbridges to Tescos ( which will become Morrisons), Foster Sq and the newly opened Westfield shopping centre and the city centre. Around the stadium there are new apartments with nice tennants. Every matchday Manningham lane is closed to offer food stands, bars and (fighting). An urban utopia. Dream zzzzz

I believe the Bulls have more urgency in resolving the problem.

A loss of licence will see the club be no more than a Keighley or a Batley.

Widnes have a superb stadium, they just missed out on a licence and have everything required to satisfy licence requirements.

A wake up call for Bulls fans: move to VP which can be reasonably cheaply altered for both codes or face possible extinction. Now tell me whose need is greater.

bradfordmark wrote:
The City of Bradford Stadium, sponsored by Morrisons at VP. A multi purpose 20,000 all seater stadium fit for both rugby and football. The railway is connected in Bradford with a station at VP for away fans, Leave your cars at home. The station is in a tunnel because on top we have built some parking, bike sheds and shops and apartments. The stadium is connected by escalators and footbridges to Tescos ( which will become Morrisons), Foster Sq and the newly opened Westfield shopping centre and the city centre. Around the stadium there are new apartments with nice tennants. Every matchday Manningham lane is closed to offer food stands, bars and (fighting). An urban utopia. Dream zzzzz

Apart from the zzzz's at the end I thought that this was one of the best responses to this continueing saga. I suppose the zzzz's signify your doubt that it could ever happen despite the total sense of the idea.
Sad really.
I bet it would happen in Manchester if they were faced with the same issues.

DCarbz wrote:

bradfordmark wrote: The City of Bradford Stadium, sponsored by Morrisons at VP. A multi purpose 20,000 all seater stadium fit for both rugby and football. The railway is connected in Bradford with a station at VP for away fans, Leave your cars at home. The station is in a tunnel because on top we have built some parking, bike sheds and shops and apartments. The stadium is connected by escalators and footbridges to Tescos ( which will become Morrisons), Foster Sq and the newly opened Westfield shopping centre and the city centre. Around the stadium there are new apartments with nice tennants. Every matchday Manningham lane is closed to offer food stands, bars and (fighting). An urban utopia. Dream zzzzz

Apart from the zzzz's at the end I thought that this was one of the best responses to this continueing saga. I suppose the zzzz's signify your doubt that it could ever happen despite the total sense of the idea. Sad really. I bet it would happen in Manchester if they were faced with the same issues.

And Leeds but then again we get what we deserve apathy within the council breeds apathy in the community, and this council has it in abundance.

I seem to remember Bradford Council were prepared to let BCFC die in 2004,what shower of complete w**kers we have running our City,the Bulls need to ground share at VP,forget Bradford Council,they are rotton to the core.

bradfordmark wrote:
Well, lets see!! The offer is there from City. If the council give the Bulls another penny, then we should all march on City hall. The Bulls need to survive without the taxpayer like any other private business. That club has wasted enough of our money. It needs to be financially viable to continue. Its time the Bulls got a new chairmen with cash and brains. VP is the best option.

So if the council put money into VP for both City and the Bulls would we still be marching on city hall ?

nowt fresh wrote:

DCarbz wrote:

bradfordmark wrote: The City of Bradford Stadium, sponsored by Morrisons at VP. A multi purpose 20,000 all seater stadium fit for both rugby and football. The railway is connected in Bradford with a station at VP for away fans, Leave your cars at home. The station is in a tunnel because on top we have built some parking, bike sheds and shops and apartments. The stadium is connected by escalators and footbridges to Tescos ( which will become Morrisons), Foster Sq and the newly opened Westfield shopping centre and the city centre. Around the stadium there are new apartments with nice tennants. Every matchday Manningham lane is closed to offer food stands, bars and (fighting). An urban utopia. Dream zzzzz

Apart from the zzzz's at the end I thought that this was one of the best responses to this continueing saga. I suppose the zzzz's signify your doubt that it could ever happen despite the total sense of the idea. Sad really. I bet it would happen in Manchester if they were faced with the same issues.

And Leeds but then again we get what we deserve apathy within the council breeds apathy in the community, and this council has it in abundance.

Whatever the present plans of the Council are won't matter in a few weeks anyway -if the Bradford electorate have any sense that is. The Council knows this and Hood and Lawn know this so nothing will be agreed until the NEW Council gets it's feet under the table. I, however, don't believe voters carry much weight in the way of being able to get ANY political party to provide what they want. The 'system' is designed to benefit big business and the Banks so if they don't want to join in because they aren't going to make much money out of it, forget it. We can't have shops in the City centre, we can't have a sporting Village and we can't 'do-up' the Odeon. So tell me how we get what we want OR NEED. We have been wasting time voting for con-tricks and illusions. How can the likes of Westfield be allowed to treat a City of around 500,000 with such contempt? How can the Local Councilors treat the people of Bradford with such contempt in relation to the Odeon? Because the system that is designed to serve the Banks and Corporate behemoths is concerned about making lots of money first and benefiting people, environment and society to achieve it's needs or wishes a very poor second. Unfortunately, democracy is becoming less and less democratic.

As a City fan for over 45 years and season ticket holder, I personally do not see why there is this seeming conflict between City and Northern and such passion about whose ground is best. I am old enough to remember Valley Parade with crumbling concrete on the Spion Kop and a shack on the Midland Road side of the ground, with the wooden stand opposite that burnt down in the fire. I can also remember going to Odsal Stadium in the 60s when they nearly went out of business and the ground was a disgrace. This didn't stop true fans supporting their teams (and I have absolutely no animosity towards Bulls fans). Today, we are lucky that both have far better stadia, and we should remember that Valley Parade only started to get better after the tragedy. The reality, too, is that City do not own the ground - it is owned by someone who has his own interests at heart and these are not necessarily City's (nor Northern's, should they even want to ground share in the future). From my point of view, I would rather play at another ground (if it were possible to get out of the lease) if it meant a far lower rent, than continue to pay an exorbitant and totally disproportionate amount of money to Mr Gibbs which, in reality, is the millstone that is stopping City being able to afford to move forward again. The best alternative for those who place staying at Valley Parade above a less financially draining future, would be for City to be taken over by someone who loves the club abd has real money to invest, who would be able to buy the ground back from Mr Gibbs. This seems highly unlikely at the moment so, for me, I would put aside any petty conflicts and 'ownership' issues and look at the best deal for both clubs' financial futures, including getting the best playing facilities at the same time. For me, I don't really care where in the City this turns out to be, if it secures our futures viably. And don't rely on the Council to come up with a sensible solution - after all, look at their track record in this area! Best wishes to both City and the Bulls for the future.

If the Bulls fans are so anti-ground sharing then why do they give currency to moving to The Shay? Please explain why it would be preferable to commute those extra miles to Halifax?

If the Bulls fans are so anti-ground sharing then why do they give currency to moving to The Shay? Please explain why it would be preferable to commute those extra miles to Halifax?

If the Bulls fans are so anti-ground sharing then why do they give currency to moving to The Shay? Please explain why it would be preferable to commute those extra miles to Halifax?

I still don't get why Bradford Council are still planning to invest millions into Odsal. In comparison, the amount invested into Valley Parade by Bradford Council probably doesn't get above the £10 mark.

And by the way, if Bradford Council did buy Valley Parade and spend money on it and then rented it to Bulls and City, they would get a full return within 10 years.

did i read that right somebody heard on the grape vine bradford park avenue had funding for a 20,000 seat stadium hahahahahahahahahhah

hehehehehehehe
this grapevine is hillarious keep em coming adey
your a funny guy
p.s stop going about the bulls moving to the shay what about the two teams already there.

DJ_TEZZA_93 wrote:
I still don't get why Bradford Council are still planning to invest millions into Odsal. In comparison, the amount invested into Valley Parade by Bradford Council probably doesn't get above the £10 mark. And by the way, if Bradford Council did buy Valley Parade and spend money on it and then rented it to Bulls and City, they would get a full return within 10 years.

The answer is quite obvious really...Odsal has potential VP doesnt.
simples.

intruder3906 wrote:

DJ_TEZZA_93 wrote:
I still don't get why Bradford Council are still planning to invest millions into Odsal. In comparison, the amount invested into Valley Parade by Bradford Council probably doesn't get above the £10 mark. And by the way, if Bradford Council did buy Valley Parade and spend money on it and then rented it to Bulls and City, they would get a full return within 10 years.

The answer is quite obvious really...Odsal has potential VP doesnt.
simples.

Ermmm I think VP does. It has the potential to be expanded in order to hold 35,000 at the minimum. The planned Manningham Station just a stone throw away will improve the already excellent transport links the stadium has thanks to its central location. There is so much potential at Valley Parade, and for a City like Bradford, it's an outstanding stadium

Mark Lawn is correct. The Council have received £15m from the sale of the airport which they plan to use at Odsal which will be used mainly by the Bulls.

silverbantam wrote:
Mark Lawn is correct. The Council have received £15m from the sale of the airport which they plan to use at Odsal which will be used mainly by the Bulls.

I think you will find that Bradford council recieved £45 million along with Leeds and the rest of the £115 million sale was surrounding councils Kirkless,Wakefield,E
TC.

In the (unlikely) event that OSV ever gets built, will BCFC be offered the stadium to use on the same terms as the Bulls are?

People who say they would rather travel to Halifax/Leeds rather than go to VP are talking nonsense, your numbers will plummit, guarenteed.

Bulls need a new licence in the next few years and because Odsal wont be developed in time (they'd struggle starting today) so i Bulls will need VP before BCFC need Odsal/the OSV.

To those who say buy VP, sell the land and fund the OSV. Who's going to buy it? The land is worthless! If City ever leave it will be a huge white elephant.

All you need are some outspoken Bulls fans, and when you come knocking at VP, you'll find the occupants unwilling to help. Then your screwed.

I find it interesting to read the City fan's comments on here. Most of them seem to be happy to ignore the actual plans for the OSV. The main part of it is that the OSV will be a lot more than just a new stadium for the Bulls. People have to get this into their heads. It will replace the old Richard Dunn's as well as new depts for the university and college.
The main reason this plan was picked was because the club realised that development of Odsal by themselves was impossible. But, by bringing in partners and looking at the bigger picture of the city as a whole they had a plan in place that was close to begining right up to the point the education council cancelled additional funding for the college.

I personally have no problems sharing with City. TBH to me it makes sense for the 2 major teams in the city to share one 21st century stadium. However, Mr Lawn seems to be going off half cocked with less actual fact to his arguement than the average internet message board user. Mr Hood has already addressed his comments in the article and despite some people on here calling them liars (hope you have a good lawyer for that one) it remains that what Mr Hood is saying about the funding from the council is the truth.

And if Mr Lawn is trying to get Bulls fans to agree with him then in future perhaps he shouldn't refer to rugby league as a minority sport. It does speak of how he sees the sport and the Bulls ie he wants us to help getting VP back under ownership of City.

I should also pop another little ballon of City fans. Regarding the Bulls Super League licence. We'll get one for the next round. Odsal was given a B first time we applied. So we're good until at least 2015. So please stop telling yourselves that unless we move into VP we'll be out of the league because that's just not the case.

kennyr13 wrote:
You can always spot a football fan's post, derrrrr! ug, umm, not the brightest bulb in the box!! As for a ground share it's got to happen in some era. deffinately not vp. My objection is where it's situated, i know thats been said many times but it's a major factor to a lot of fans.

One word..." IDIOT"

As a young lad living in Odsal in !962 I used to play out on the "rec" by Odsal Stadium, and remember looking through the railway sleeper fence around Odsal Stadium, and catching a glimpse of the biggest bowl I had ever seen, wondered what it was for.
My Dad, and his Dad, had been Northern suppoters up to when they stopped playing years before, and one day told me that rugby league was coming back to Odsal Stadium, and that I was going to see Bradford Northern play.
I was 10 at the time.
For the next 8 years, until I moved to London, we went to almost evry home and away game, supporting Northern with its rag-tag team of old and borrowed amateurs, on a roller-coaster ride I will never forget.
Tony Fisher, Terry Price, Dave Stockwell, Berwyn Jones, came and made their marks as over the years Northern climbed to the top.
Northerns programme had a picture once that reminded of a record gate from think the fifties, some cup tie, and in that bowl were over 112,000 supporters.
To think that such a mighty bowl might be filled in and Northern moved (in that order I imagine) seems like erasing a rich piece of history for me.
The code words below btw read 'area-flat'.

jambo wrote:
I find it interesting to read the City fan's comments on here. Most of them seem to be happy to ignore the actual plans for the OSV. The main part of it is that the OSV will be a lot more than just a new stadium for the Bulls. People have to get this into their heads. It will replace the old Richard Dunn's as well as new depts for the university and college.
The main reason this plan was picked was because the club realised that development of Odsal by themselves was impossible. But, by bringing in partners and looking at the bigger picture of the city as a whole they had a plan in place that was close to begining right up to the point the education council cancelled additional funding for the college.

I personally have no problems sharing with City. TBH to me it makes sense for the 2 major teams in the city to share one 21st century stadium. However, Mr Lawn seems to be going off half cocked with less actual fact to his arguement than the average internet message board user. Mr Hood has already addressed his comments in the article and despite some people on here calling them liars (hope you have a good lawyer for that one) it remains that what Mr Hood is saying about the funding from the council is the truth.

And if Mr Lawn is trying to get Bulls fans to agree with him then in future perhaps he shouldn't refer to rugby league as a minority sport. It does speak of how he sees the sport and the Bulls ie he wants us to help getting VP back under ownership of City.

I should also pop another little ballon of City fans. Regarding the Bulls Super League licence. We'll get one for the next round. Odsal was given a B first time we applied. So we're good until at least 2015. So please stop telling yourselves that unless we move into VP we'll be out of the league because that's just not the case.

"It does speak of how he sees the sport and the Bulls ie he wants us to help getting VP back under ownership of City."

Now is the perfect time to get VP back into Bradfords (City or Club) ownership, with the closing down of Pleasure Island, maybe Mr Gibbs finances are looking a little grim?

bobby98007 wrote:

jambo wrote: I find it interesting to read the City fan's comments on here. Most of them seem to be happy to ignore the actual plans for the OSV. The main part of it is that the OSV will be a lot more than just a new stadium for the Bulls. People have to get this into their heads. It will replace the old Richard Dunn's as well as new depts for the university and college. The main reason this plan was picked was because the club realised that development of Odsal by themselves was impossible. But, by bringing in partners and looking at the bigger picture of the city as a whole they had a plan in place that was close to begining right up to the point the education council cancelled additional funding for the college. I personally have no problems sharing with City. TBH to me it makes sense for the 2 major teams in the city to share one 21st century stadium. However, Mr Lawn seems to be going off half cocked with less actual fact to his arguement than the average internet message board user. Mr Hood has already addressed his comments in the article and despite some people on here calling them liars (hope you have a good lawyer for that one) it remains that what Mr Hood is saying about the funding from the council is the truth. And if Mr Lawn is trying to get Bulls fans to agree with him then in future perhaps he shouldn't refer to rugby league as a minority sport. It does speak of how he sees the sport and the Bulls ie he wants us to help getting VP back under ownership of City. I should also pop another little ballon of City fans. Regarding the Bulls Super League licence. We'll get one for the next round. Odsal was given a B first time we applied. So we're good until at least 2015. So please stop telling yourselves that unless we move into VP we'll be out of the league because that's just not the case.

"It does speak of how he sees the sport and the Bulls ie he wants us to help getting VP back under ownership of City." Now is the perfect time to get VP back into Bradfords (City or Club) ownership, with the closing down of Pleasure Island, maybe Mr Gibbs finances are looking a little grim?

Valley Parade is OWNED by Flamingo Land's pension fund not Gordon Gibb, now how much influance Gordon Gibb has on the running of this fund I'm not sure??.

nowt fresh wrote:

bobby98007 wrote:

jambo wrote: I find it interesting to read the City fan's comments on here. Most of them seem to be happy to ignore the actual plans for the OSV. The main part of it is that the OSV will be a lot more than just a new stadium for the Bulls. People have to get this into their heads. It will replace the old Richard Dunn's as well as new depts for the university and college. The main reason this plan was picked was because the club realised that development of Odsal by themselves was impossible. But, by bringing in partners and looking at the bigger picture of the city as a whole they had a plan in place that was close to begining right up to the point the education council cancelled additional funding for the college. I personally have no problems sharing with City. TBH to me it makes sense for the 2 major teams in the city to share one 21st century stadium. However, Mr Lawn seems to be going off half cocked with less actual fact to his arguement than the average internet message board user. Mr Hood has already addressed his comments in the article and despite some people on here calling them liars (hope you have a good lawyer for that one) it remains that what Mr Hood is saying about the funding from the council is the truth. And if Mr Lawn is trying to get Bulls fans to agree with him then in future perhaps he shouldn't refer to rugby league as a minority sport. It does speak of how he sees the sport and the Bulls ie he wants us to help getting VP back under ownership of City. I should also pop another little ballon of City fans. Regarding the Bulls Super League licence. We'll get one for the next round. Odsal was given a B first time we applied. So we're good until at least 2015. So please stop telling yourselves that unless we move into VP we'll be out of the league because that's just not the case.

"It does speak of how he sees the sport and the Bulls ie he wants us to help getting VP back under ownership of City." Now is the perfect time to get VP back into Bradfords (City or Club) ownership, with the closing down of Pleasure Island, maybe Mr Gibbs finances are looking a little grim?

Valley Parade is OWNED by Flamingo Land's pension fund not Gordon Gibb, now how much influance Gordon Gibb has on the running of this fund I'm not sure??.

TBH me neither, i thought it was his own pension fund that owned it rather than Flamingo Lands.

Anyway im sure if their holding a couple of million pounds worth of assets thats easily converted into cash and his finances have hit the fan im sure they would be able to swing it for him.

Lets call a spade a spade, although it makes perfect financial sense, a ground share will never happen. City fans dont want to go to Odsal and Bulls fans dont want to come to VP.

Im all for City moving to the new stadium thats planned to be built at OSV, i just dont see it ever materialising.

How much money have the Bulls got to invest in their new stadium? Hood and his deluded followers should hold their hands up and come clean. Then they shold do the city a favour and leave for the delights of Halifax.

jambo wrote:
I find it interesting to read the City fan's comments on here. Most of them seem to be happy to ignore the actual plans for the OSV. The main part of it is that the OSV will be a lot more than just a new stadium for the Bulls. People have to get this into their heads. It will replace the old Richard Dunn's as well as new depts for the university and college.
The main reason this plan was picked was because the club realised that development of Odsal by themselves was impossible. But, by bringing in partners and looking at the bigger picture of the city as a whole they had a plan in place that was close to begining right up to the point the education council cancelled additional funding for the college.

I personally have no problems sharing with City. TBH to me it makes sense for the 2 major teams in the city to share one 21st century stadium. However, Mr Lawn seems to be going off half cocked with less actual fact to his arguement than the average internet message board user. Mr Hood has already addressed his comments in the article and despite some people on here calling them liars (hope you have a good lawyer for that one) it remains that what Mr Hood is saying about the funding from the council is the truth.

And if Mr Lawn is trying to get Bulls fans to agree with him then in future perhaps he shouldn't refer to rugby league as a minority sport. It does speak of how he sees the sport and the Bulls ie he wants us to help getting VP back under ownership of City.

I should also pop another little ballon of City fans. Regarding the Bulls Super League licence. We'll get one for the next round. Odsal was given a B first time we applied. So we're good until at least 2015. So please stop telling yourselves that unless we move into VP we'll be out of the league because that's just not the case.

Jambo, I was following the post until the last paragraph. You are right in that the proposal was for the OSV, not just Odsal stadia. However, why did the originalplans need to include a hotel and university/college departments? Don't we already have enough empty hotels in Bradford and the same can be asked of colleges/university?


That said, if the Council are planning on handing over £15m to redevelop Richard Dunnes into a modern swimming/recreationa
l division, then that has to be good for the City. I just don't think it should cost that amount for the plans. So is the rest of the funding going to wards Hood's stadium modernisation or not?

Now I will move onto the part of the post that I want clarification on. You say that the Bulls' licence is not in jeopardy and I will take your word as you seem to know more about this than I. However, Hood clearly said that if the ground is not modernised and brought into the 21st centuary urgently, the Bulls WOULD lose their licence. If I remember rightly, he even described Odsal as 'not fit for purpose', which I assume will not go down too well with the Super League Franchise decision makers!!!