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Plans for Bradford site unveiled (From Bradford Telegraph and Argus)
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Plans for Bradford site unveiled
6:00am Wednesday 22nd July 2009
These are the heavily-revised plans for the £55 million New Victoria Place development on the site of Bradford’s derelict Odeon cinema.
The Telegraph & Argus can today show the first images of the new design which has now been backed by English Heritage.
Changes include reducing the size of the glass-fronted development on the corner of Prince’s Way and Thornton Road.
A new planning application will be submitted to Bradford Council on Monday.
Developer Langtree Artisan, which won a design competition in 2006, came under fire from English Heritage for its original plans, which were considered too dominant.
But following the changes, Trevor Mitchell, English Heritage’s planning and development regional director is satisfied that the benefits of the New Victoria Place plans now outweigh the loss of the Odeon’s iconic towers.
He said: “The revised proposal respects the setting of adjacent listed buildings and provides new buildings of an appropriate quality, in a sympathetic landscaped setting, safeguarding the overall character of the city centre conservation area.
“While the loss of the Odeon’s turrets and façade would be regretted, we are satisfied that the benefits of the proposal would outweigh the harm which it would cause. English Heritage would therefore support the revised scheme.”
The scheme still includes all the internal elements from the original designs which were submitted last year – including office space, apartments, a 100-bed hotel, bars, cafes and community leisure facilities. It would involve demolishing the former Odeon building, which has been derelict since 2000.
A public exhibition is being held on Friday from 1.30pm to 5pm and on Saturday between 11am and 4pm in the Camargue Room at the Great Victoria Hotel, in Bridge Street.
A website newvictoriaplace.com containing the new designs will also go live on Friday.
Langtree Artisan and building owners Yorkshire Forward have been working with English Heritage and Bradford Centre Regeneration and say they have taken on board comments made during consultation last year to evolve the scheme. They expect the landmark development to bring more than 1,350 jobs to Bradford.
Simon Peters, of Langtree Artisan, said: “The exhibition is a great opportunity for the people of Bradford to visualise how the New Victoria Place scheme has evolved following the feedback we have received.
“We have created a vibrant and ambitious scheme which will deliver much-needed jobs to the city.”
Jan Anderson, executive director of environment for Yorkshire Forward, said: “New Victoria Place is an appropriate and innovative scheme which has evolved from the initial design proposals.”
And Maud Marshall, the chief executive of BCR, said: “Of primary importance in selecting a final design was the need to develop a financially-viable landmark development for the city – we believe that the new designs for New Victoria Place by Langtree Artisan are exactly this.
“We are delighted that English Heritage is now supporting the planning application.”
Bradford Odeon Rescue Group, which opposes the demolition of the building, has put forward a rival plan – backed by Bradford businessman Nirmal Singh – to retain the building and transform it into a hotel, nightclub and cinema.
Group member and Bradford Councillor John Pennington said he was disappointed that BORG had not been shown the designs prior to the exhibition and described the previous plans as “grotesquely huge”. He said he would be scrutinising the new plans when they are made public on Friday.
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Your Say YourBradford
ItchyBungle, Bradford says...
6:17am Wed 22 Jul 09
hardgravity, Idle says...
6:36am Wed 22 Jul 09
So much for preserving the front then!
pil@@@@
rongtw, bradford says...
6:57am Wed 22 Jul 09
i wonder how much the artists are payed for each 1 , it must be the biggest sector for growth in Bradford
Jammy, Bradford says...
6:59am Wed 22 Jul 09
jkelly, Bratfud says...
7:15am Wed 22 Jul 09
This also could become hole number three.
The Odeon Crusader, Wibsey says...
7:48am Wed 22 Jul 09
Trevor Mitchell (English Heritage): “While the loss of the Odeon’s turrets and façade would be regretted, we are satisfied that the benefits of the proposal would outweigh the harm which it would cause. English Heritage would therefore support the revised scheme.”
So, what about the visual contribution to the Conservation Area etc etc? In other words, you can affect it detrimentally so long as the proposed uses outweigh the **** hideousness of the building? Utter crap!
This is corrupt - Mitchell/English Heritage have been "got at" by Yorkshire Forward's government cronies!
And a new planning application - so the hundreds of objections will probably be wiped off the face of the earth...
We must reject this - it is not right for Bradford!
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
8:17am Wed 22 Jul 09
Anyone can do an artist impression and make fiction look good:
http://img20.imagesh
ack.us/img20/5297/sw
regenerations.jpg
tyker, midland road says...
8:48am Wed 22 Jul 09
yet another artists impression.
I have lost count of the cost of all these " improvements"--can anyone tell me the figure please?
Then add in the wasted money on computers and waste management not forgetting the Odsal project.
Just how much money are we talking about:where is it coming from and how can the city which if not dead is dying on it's feet afford such costs. i assume they do not have the ready cash but are borrowing. If so from whom and at what rates of interest?
My grandson has done an artist's impression of how Bradford will look in 10 years time.
this is it: .
A simple dot on the landscape and who have we to blame for this situation?
The Odeon Crusader, Wibsey says...
8:55am Wed 22 Jul 09
spleen ventor, Bradford says...
9:03am Wed 22 Jul 09
mad matt, Bradford says...
9:07am Wed 22 Jul 09
There will soon be another unsightly hole in the centre.
Best thing would be to fill the holes by bulldozing all the useless councillors into the holes and burying them.
dazbot, Bradford says...
9:08am Wed 22 Jul 09
The Odeon Crusader wrote:No it won't cause this one is Sh it, and as said before will look terrible in 20 years...just like the old police station opposite.
This is the fourth version of New Victoria Place put forward for consideration one way or another... will it be the last?
But, TBH I wish they would just do something now, im getting bored of it all.
David Crocket, Bradford says...
9:16am Wed 22 Jul 09
c/pot, eccelshill says...
9:17am Wed 22 Jul 09
The Odeon Crusader wrote:Hundreds of objections out of how many hundreds of thousand people,not a very good ratio.There seems to be more people wanting it re-developed than not,its untidy and old,get it knocked down asap.
It is effing vile! Trevor Mitchell (English Heritage): “While the loss of the Odeon’s turrets and façade would be regretted, we are satisfied that the benefits of the proposal would outweigh the harm which it would cause. English Heritage would therefore support the revised scheme.” So, what about the visual contribution to the Conservation Area etc etc? In other words, you can affect it detrimentally so long as the proposed uses outweigh the **** hideousness of the building? Utter crap! This is corrupt - Mitchell/English Heritage have been "got at" by Yorkshire Forward's government cronies! And a new planning application - so the hundreds of objections will probably be wiped off the face of the earth... We must reject this - it is not right for Bradford!
Joedavid, Bradford says...
9:23am Wed 22 Jul 09
When will this Council listen to the people of Bradford and kick this lot out?
The Council, along with the T&A to some extent, do not realize the people want the Odeon restored to the former theatre the New Victoria.
I hope all who comment and read the T&A will go to the Victoria Hotel and tell these people get out of our City!
ms walker, Round here says...
9:43am Wed 22 Jul 09
c/pot wrote:Two letters of support for redevelopment out of hundreds of objections on the planning site... now THAT is a very poor ratio!
The Odeon Crusader wrote:Hundreds of objections out of how many hundreds of thousand people,not a very good ratio.There seems to be more people wanting it re-developed than not,its untidy and old,get it knocked down asap.
It is effing vile! Trevor Mitchell (English Heritage): “While the loss of the Odeon’s turrets and façade would be regretted, we are satisfied that the benefits of the proposal would outweigh the harm which it would cause. English Heritage would therefore support the revised scheme.” So, what about the visual contribution to the Conservation Area etc etc? In other words, you can affect it detrimentally so long as the proposed uses outweigh the **** hideousness of the building? Utter crap! This is corrupt - Mitchell/English Heritage have been "got at" by Yorkshire Forward's government cronies! And a new planning application - so the hundreds of objections will probably be wiped off the face of the earth... We must reject this - it is not right for Bradford!
What really sticks in my craw is the fact that the Council, BCR and Yorkshire Forward have repeatedly and obstinately refused to listen to the pleas of residents over the last ten years to save the building. With the money they've wasted they could have saved the poor old thing several times over.
Once the Odeon is demolished (Maud's parting shot to the people of this city, perchance?) there is no guarantee that it will be replaced with anything, particularly in this economic climate. And how do Jury's Inn feel about another hotel in direct competition with theirs, just across the road...?
converse1, Thackley says...
9:55am Wed 22 Jul 09
To the editor of this paper, the Odeon is NOT derelict! I've been in photographed it and proved other wise.
It's about time the T&A got behind the public of Bradford and supported the cause to restore the building otherwise you will continue to be seen as merely a puppet of the council with no journalistic integrity at all!
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
9:55am Wed 22 Jul 09
converse1, West Yorkshire says...
10:01am Wed 22 Jul 09
c/pot, eccelshill says...
10:02am Wed 22 Jul 09
Moon on a stick wrote:Dont waste your time,its coming down and the sooner the better.
Is there an e-mail address or webform where people can object and if so what is it?
mapreader, mapreader says...
10:05am Wed 22 Jul 09
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
10:22am Wed 22 Jul 09
c/pot wrote:Little point replacing the Odeon with a building that itself will need replacing in 20 years.
Moon on a stick wrote: Is there an e-mail address or webform where people can object and if so what is it?Dont waste your time,its coming down and the sooner the better.
Within a month of being built, I can see the "Almost 20% let, office space available" sign residing on the side for 5 years.
peasonatrampoline, Thackley says...
10:29am Wed 22 Jul 09
I have personal views that the building could have been restored, in respect to Bradford's film heritage and to the adjacent Alhambra which would stick out quite oddly next to the newvictoria scheme.
However, setting aside these personal views I have a strong desire for both sides (BORG and the people of Bradford, BCR, the Council and Yorkshire Forward) to communicate together on this very important issue. It is saddening to see BCR,YF, and the Council disregarding the hundreds of objections to the demolition of the Odeon. Why can't there be an open and honest discussion between all parties and an honest negotiation of the best way to proceed. This probably seems far too simple and idealistic, but there is such a strong feeling of wrongdoing about the way the developers are ignoring people's views on this scheme.
born n bred, bradford says...
10:39am Wed 22 Jul 09
The Odeon Crusader, Wibsey says...
11:13am Wed 22 Jul 09
This is the third time this misinformation has been reported, and despite members of BORG complaining to the T&A, they still carry on with this inaccuracy!
scanipoos, Bradford says...
11:24am Wed 22 Jul 09
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
11:29am Wed 22 Jul 09
ms walker, Round here says...
12:35pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Where's our concert hall and exhibition centre?
Oh look, there it is, a beautiful Italianate building that, cleaned up, would be a sustainable and viable alternative to the **** that BCR and Yorkshire Forward are still trying to foist on us. If any of these smug autocrats actually lived in this city I might take their suggestions more seriously, but when they saunter in from outside to give us the benefit of their taste and wisdom I'm hard pressed to maintain my manners.
Dare I assume that, while the objections to the proposed 'old' design for new vic place will be ignored, the letters/emails we wrote objecting to the demolition of the Odeon will still stand?
Bradford's Bouncing Backwards, Bingley says...
1:04pm Wed 22 Jul 09
emma72, Eccleshill says...
1:16pm Wed 22 Jul 09
In that time BCR could have given BORG a chance to develop the Odeon and let it succeed of fail instead they've done nothing but sit at their desks daydreaming and doodling. It seems to me that little violet elizabeth aka maud marshall is quite determined. "I'll scweam and scweam til I make this town sh*t!"
security word show-fail you couldn't make it up!
Tom Sutton, Thornton says...
1:23pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Anyone who's read the independent reports on he interior and the structure will realise that the Odeon building should have come down years ago.
There will for ever be people clutching at their memories of how fine the New Vic was, believing that somehow it can rise again, but those days are long past. There is no place for it in Bradford if the city is to move forward.
Jammy, Bradford says...
1:28pm Wed 22 Jul 09
emma72, Eccleshill says...
1:29pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Encarta Definition:
1. protection of valued resources: the preservation, management, and care of natural and cultural resources
2. protection from change: the keeping or protecting of something from change, loss, or damage
Dictionary.com Definition:
1. the act of conserving; prevention of injury, decay, waste, or loss; preservation: conservation of wildlife; conservation of human rights.
For a conservation area there's not much conserving going on!
The Odeon Crusader, Wibsey says...
1:32pm Wed 22 Jul 09
"Anyone who's read the independent reports on he interior and the structure will realise that the Odeon building should have come down years ago."
Please share that piece of fantasy fiction with us, Tom.
The more recent structural survey actually concluded with the statement that whilst there were some issues, none of the structural problems were major!
However, you probably gained your structural insight from reading a quote from Maud or someone similar in the T&A...
scottie dog, queensbury says...
1:49pm Wed 22 Jul 09
rongtw, bradford says...
2:10pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
2:27pm Wed 22 Jul 09
rongtw wrote:You mean something like this?
just knock it down and leave a hole to match the rest of Bradford , a desolate moonscape !!! now there is a nice artist impression
http://uncyclopedia.
wikia.com/wiki/File:
Broadway.jpg
eldraco, Sydenham says...
3:01pm Wed 22 Jul 09
eldraco, Sydenham says...
3:01pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Welcome To The New World Order, Bradford-on-sea says...
3:30pm Wed 22 Jul 09
mad matt, Bradford says...
3:37pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Personaly i couldn't care less if they knock the Odeon down or not, but if they don't do something soon it's gonna fall down on it's own accord and then there will be a mess to clean up!
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
3:38pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Welcome To The New World Order wrote:None, there are already far too many apartments, too many hotel rooms, in fact you can get a 3 bed room hotel room for under £30 a night so it proves there's not a problem of under capacity. Plus there's plenty of empty office space... This new building is needed like a hole in the head.
It's a complete disgrace to demolish a fine old building and replace it with this modern crap. They should faithfully restore the original building. Besides, what need is there for such a facility in Bradford?
bradford rose, bradford says...
4:11pm Wed 22 Jul 09
davecat, Bingley says...
4:33pm Wed 22 Jul 09
rongtw, bradford says...
4:48pm Wed 22 Jul 09
http://uncyclopedia.
wikia.com/wiki/File:
Broadway.jpg
also the word degeneration !!! not regeneration and yes "davecat" all these comments will self destruct in 1 hour.
Tom Sutton, Thornton says...
5:00pm Wed 22 Jul 09
The Odeon Crusader wrote:I was referring to the extensive recent structural report by Ramboll Whitybird, which I've read, but apparently many others haven't.
Tom Sutton wrote: "Anyone who's read the independent reports on he interior and the structure will realise that the Odeon building should have come down years ago." Please share that piece of fantasy fiction with us, Tom. The more recent structural survey actually concluded with the statement that whilst there were some issues, none of the structural problems were major! However, you probably gained your structural insight from reading a quote from Maud or someone similar in the T&A...
boparob, Bradford says...
5:14pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Welcome To The New World Order wrote:Why are people so stuck in their ways? The Old Odeon building is a serious eyesore, and the sooner Bradford folk wake up the better. Why do we want an old building? Move on, thr future is here now. Our kids deserve new modern facilities instead of having to go out of town driving for miles for something that can be built right here on our door step. The sooner this city modernises the better. Once the new Provident building is up and the Odeon site has a new build the City will have a whole new modern look to it that is attractive to outside investors providing jobs and financial security for many families. Stop holding the city back and change. If you don't like it, move to Morecambe or Blackpool, two other dying towns that refuse to change.
It's a complete disgrace to demolish a fine old building and replace it with this modern crap. They should faithfully restore the original building. Besides, what need is there for such a facility in Bradford?
ms walker, Round here says...
5:43pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Tom Sutton wrote:That must be the one from last year, Tom, because Ramboll Whitbybird have changed their name since then. I understand, from that report, that it would cost just over a £million to make the old building structurally sound. Seems better value to me than spending £55million on a wobbly glass facade...
The Odeon Crusader wrote:I was referring to the extensive recent structural report by Ramboll Whitybird, which I've read, but apparently many others haven't.
Tom Sutton wrote: "Anyone who's read the independent reports on he interior and the structure will realise that the Odeon building should have come down years ago." Please share that piece of fantasy fiction with us, Tom. The more recent structural survey actually concluded with the statement that whilst there were some issues, none of the structural problems were major! However, you probably gained your structural insight from reading a quote from Maud or someone similar in the T&A...
ms walker, Round here says...
5:47pm Wed 22 Jul 09
boparob wrote:Those kids of yours that deserve modern new facilities - they wouldn't happen to be the same ones suffering heatstroke this summer in the badly designed new schools that Bradford Council have presided over??
Welcome To The New World Order wrote:Why are people so stuck in their ways? The Old Odeon building is a serious eyesore, and the sooner Bradford folk wake up the better. Why do we want an old building? Move on, thr future is here now. Our kids deserve new modern facilities instead of having to go out of town driving for miles for something that can be built right here on our door step. The sooner this city modernises the better. Once the new Provident building is up and the Odeon site has a new build the City will have a whole new modern look to it that is attractive to outside investors providing jobs and financial security for many families. Stop holding the city back and change. If you don't like it, move to Morecambe or Blackpool, two other dying towns that refuse to change.
It's a complete disgrace to demolish a fine old building and replace it with this modern crap. They should faithfully restore the original building. Besides, what need is there for such a facility in Bradford?
If you want something new and modern building on the doorstep I suggest you put your energies into getting something done about the big bloody crater in the city centre, before encouraging this shambolic council to start on another one.
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
6:06pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Maud's last "success" was the Gatehaus, an unfinished apartment block, offered using rent guarantees to prop up rediculous pricing with the only tenants prepared to pay the money being now convicted drug dealers.
Tom Sutton, Thornton says...
6:10pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
6:16pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Johsay, Bradford says...
6:35pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Rambo, bradford says...
7:14pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Theyve Photoshopped trees into the photo in front of the Odean in an attempt to cover it up.
Google image search "Bradford dance" and look at the picture, second line down.
dbo679, Bradford says...
7:16pm Wed 22 Jul 09
blackpool donkey, blackpool says...
7:55pm Wed 22 Jul 09
cheeky1, Buttershaw says...
9:17pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Tom Sutton, Thornton says...
9:45pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Johsay wrote:No, just a Bradford resident who wants to see Bradford move forward. I have no nostalgic memories of the Odeon, a building that no-one seemed to care for until long after it closed down as a cinema. The BORG suggested extension is not sympathetic to the listed buildings on Quebec Street, and is inferior to new plans.
Tom Sutton - Bfd Council's mole per chance?
Yorkshire Forward has allowed stagnation in this part of Bradford for far too long. At long last they've come up with a well designed building, which hopefully the Council's planning committee will approve.
Hopefully a future Government will get rid of Yorkshire Forward and hand responsibility and money back to Bradford Council for the regeneration of our city.
ms walker, Round here says...
10:13pm Wed 22 Jul 09
"Hopefully a future Government will get rid of Yorkshire Forward and hand responsibility and money back to Bradford Council for the regeneration of our city."
No, Tom, NO-O-O-O-O!! *Mrs Walker bangs head against wall in frustration and disbelief*
While I agree wholeheartedly with the first part of your statement about getting rid of useless quango Yorkshire Backward, I have to say, I wouldn't trust Bradford Council with a rusty bicycle these days. They couldn't even get the waste contract right. What on earth - other than blind optimism! - makes you think they can fix the city that their ineptitude has helped to wreck?
Jammy2010, bradford says...
11:05pm Wed 22 Jul 09
A lot of you are emotional and the rest are, lets say, a tad bit on the erm retarded side. NOBODY wants to invest in Bradford! Hardly anybody wants to invest in the North and if they do Leeds is the obvious choice. Leeds has 15+ hotels which have attracted business people from around the world as the hotels compete etc and this means bigger bang for your buck.
Odeon cinema ah, im a bit on the fence here as im fond of the building but i also feel we should ambrace the change. I shall reserve judgement till i see further information as from what i can see its not very good is it?
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
11:25pm Wed 22 Jul 09
The reason people don't want to invest in Bradford is because of the failure to deliver schemes such as Westfield and the fact some estate agents have colluded with developers to give false rental figures.
The fact there is not much in the way of parking, particularly affordable long term parking is a real issue.
Even if the Westfield scheme did happen it would only kill off existing retail and damage the Kirkgate and there doesn't seem to be anyway plan to address that.
Aire Valley, Bingley says...
11:45pm Wed 22 Jul 09
Tom Sutton, Thornton says...
12:24am Thu 23 Jul 09
ms walker wrote:Many people would like to blame the Council for everyone else's failings. Much of the Council's power and finance has been taken off them by the centralising central government and they are greatly restricted by Government edicts. Councillors themselves have very little power. We need to give power back to people and to untie the hands of their elected representatives to get on with the job of improving our city.
Tom Sutton wrote "Hopefully a future Government will get rid of Yorkshire Forward and hand responsibility and money back to Bradford Council for the regeneration of our city." No, Tom, NO-O-O-O-O!! *Mrs Walker bangs head against wall in frustration and disbelief* While I agree wholeheartedly with the first part of your statement about getting rid of useless quango Yorkshire Backward, I have to say, I wouldn't trust Bradford Council with a rusty bicycle these days. They couldn't even get the waste contract right. What on earth - other than blind optimism! - makes you think they can fix the city that their ineptitude has helped to wreck?
A refurbished Gaumont is not what Bradford needs. I've read Odeon supporters comments that say that a concert hall could be used for "pop concerts". The sedentary pop concerts of their generation have morphed into the all-standing gigs of today, and Bradford has no lack of gig venues, especially now that Gasworks has a 1,000 capacity. There are also sufficient larger venues in the region. Another cannot ever be economic. BORG's suggested extensions would be totally unsympathetic with the listed buildings of Quebec Street and their new Prince's Way frontage would be an incongrous intrusion.
The time has come for Bradford to move on from the 20th centrury.
Dr Evil, Saltaire says...
1:21am Thu 23 Jul 09
I would love to sit with Maud & Anne & the rest with photos of Foster Square in the 60s and hear them try to defend what was mindlessly built in its place the First Time around.
I have only seen pictures of Bradford in its Prime. Realistically there are no pictures of Bradford 2009 which I will be able to proudly show my Granchildren.
Maud, Anne, the lot of you; you should be ashamed of yourselves, resign, and leave this City now.
strummerboy, Bradford says...
1:35am Thu 23 Jul 09
Bradford had some great buildings with great character that were torn down all in the name of progress.
The new rule for Bradford is 'if in doubt build a hotel'.
No wonder this city looks like a cemetry with traffic lights.
Bah!!!
ms walker, Round here says...
2:40am Thu 23 Jul 09
Indeed Tom? Then why ignore the majority of voices calling for a refurbished Odeon? The support for the old building has outweighed the support for redevelopment by about 250 to 1.
Now tell me again about people-power and I'll try to keep a straight face.
Your support for Bradford Council is touching but are you sure you don't have a vested interest?
I appreciate your comments but it should be recognised that the Gasworks is a very different type of venue to that proposed for the Odeon - and is wholly unsuited to the kind of Trade Fairs that say the Harrogate convention centre or Manchester Gmex host. A refurbished Odeon would have a much larger capacity than the Gasworks, be suitable for a larger range of events, and provide an indoor arena space to enhance the usability of the park.
albion, west riding says...
6:38am Thu 23 Jul 09
Jammy2010 wrote:New hotels would help, but MORE hotels are probably not needed, neither are your insults regarding other peoples comments.
If you dont build new hotels with better facilities then the old hotels will carry on with their mediocrity and thus the city goes deeper into the sh-it.
A lot of you are emotional and the rest are, lets say, a tad bit on the erm retarded side. NOBODY wants to invest in Bradford! Hardly anybody wants to invest in the North and if they do Leeds is the obvious choice. Leeds has 15+ hotels which have attracted business people from around the world as the hotels compete etc and this means bigger bang for your buck.
Odeon cinema ah, im a bit on the fence here as im fond of the building but i also feel we should ambrace the change. I shall reserve judgement till i see further information as from what i can see its not very good is it?
new_to_the_area, saltaire says...
8:36am Thu 23 Jul 09
albion wrote:Of course we need more hotels...haven't you heard about all the tourists waiting to come and see the pond ?
Jammy2010 wrote:New hotels would help, but MORE hotels are probably not needed, neither are your insults regarding other peoples comments.
If you dont build new hotels with better facilities then the old hotels will carry on with their mediocrity and thus the city goes deeper into the sh-it.
A lot of you are emotional and the rest are, lets say, a tad bit on the erm retarded side. NOBODY wants to invest in Bradford! Hardly anybody wants to invest in the North and if they do Leeds is the obvious choice. Leeds has 15+ hotels which have attracted business people from around the world as the hotels compete etc and this means bigger bang for your buck.
Odeon cinema ah, im a bit on the fence here as im fond of the building but i also feel we should ambrace the change. I shall reserve judgement till i see further information as from what i can see its not very good is it?
And the offices...they'll attract hotel custom. If the offices get leased out.
One big circular argument, based on hope.
Tom Sutton, Thornton says...
9:17am Thu 23 Jul 09
The Council's planning committee, which will have to make decisions on the planning application and the request to demolish a building in a Conservation Area, has no lawful power to refuse an application because there are many voices wanting to retain the building. It can only take into account planning law, and the edicts handed down from Central Government. If they refuse the application because a very vocal minority of citizens want to keep the Odeon, the applicants have a right of appeal to the Secretary of State's Planning Inspectorate, who has to enforce planning law, which could mean the Council having to pay hundreds of thousands of pounds in costs to the applicant, if the Inspector considered the applications should be approved. I want the Council spending my money on improving Bradford, not paying out massive costs to developers.
I mentioned Gasworks as a gig venue. There is spare capacity in existing large exhibition halls such as in Manchester and Harrogate, and spare capacity in Bradford's exsiting venues, e.g. the Hilton, the University, St. George's Hall, and the Carlisle Business Centre, etc. To provide such a space at a refurbished Odeon would be an economic disaster.
Joedavid, Bradford says...
9:27am Thu 23 Jul 09
Why then havn't this committee dealt with the second planning application put in last year by these people to have permission to demolish the Odeon?
An independent inquiry is needed into this whole affair of how these planning applications are dealt with and also into Yorkshire Forward too.
Tom Sutton, Thornton says...
9:44am Thu 23 Jul 09
converse1, West Yorkshire says...
11:07am Thu 23 Jul 09
ctions have to be taken into account by the planning department (many hundreds objected to the last monstrosity, this is why it was withdrawn, and we are now presented with an even worse design, the fourth to be precise!). 3. The councils own unitary development plan states that the Odeon should be retained and returned to leisure use! If we must have NVP build it somewhere else, how about the Alexandra car park just up Gt Horton Rd?
ms walker, Round here says...
12:02pm Thu 23 Jul 09
Tom Sutton wrote:Tom, the people who wish to keep the Odeon building also have the right to appeal to the Secretary of State. Government guidelines stipulate that buildings should be reused where possible in order to meet sustainability targets.
OK Ms Walker, the only vested interest I have is that I pay Council tax and national taxation.
The Council's planning committee, which will have to make decisions on the planning application and the request to demolish a building in a Conservation Area, has no lawful power to refuse an application because there are many voices wanting to retain the building. It can only take into account planning law, and the edicts handed down from Central Government. If they refuse the application because a very vocal minority of citizens want to keep the Odeon, the applicants have a right of appeal to the Secretary of State's Planning Inspectorate, who has to enforce planning law, which could mean the Council having to pay hundreds of thousands of pounds in costs to the applicant, if the Inspector considered the applications should be approved. I want the Council spending my money on improving Bradford, not paying out massive costs to developers.
I mentioned Gasworks as a gig venue. There is spare capacity in existing large exhibition halls such as in Manchester and Harrogate, and spare capacity in Bradford's exsiting venues, e.g. the Hilton, the University, St. George's Hall, and the Carlisle Business Centre, etc. To provide such a space at a refurbished Odeon would be an economic disaster.
You claim that a refurbished Odeon would be an economic disaster but are conveniently ignoring the massive amount of existing 'To Let' office space in and around the city centre, and the fact that only yesterday plans for another hotel (1 Hamm Strasse) were published in the business section of this paper.
A venue/conference centre/civic space would be a facility for the people of Bradford, would provide a logical enhancement to the West End and would do far more to attract people than an office block and hotel.
At 3000, the capacity would be almost twice that of St George's Hall, and since most of the campus bars have now closed the university is hardly standing out as a hub of 'happening' events. The Carlisle Business Centre and The Hilton are hardly big enough for major event conferences or trade shows, and I would also venture the suggestion that the Carlisle Business Centre is too far from town to be easily accessible by public transport for one-off visitors to the city.
While I agree with your concern about wasted money, after BCR have blown £29million in six years I think your criticism might be better directed at them and Bradford's incompetent Council who allowed this travesty to happen. If BCR and the Council had actually listened to the majority then (and we are the majority - the planning site statistics speak for themselves!) or allowed Nirmal Singh to step in with private finance when he first offered to do so, we would not have this pitiful crumbling edifice now. I urge you to rethink your perspective.
Aire Valley, Bingley says...
1:39pm Thu 23 Jul 09
Many believe there is no requirement for further office space. It's not just about creating more office space but about ensuring the right mix of office space is available. We need offices that can attract a spectrum of businesses from small start ups to the established multi nationals. Decent office space fronting the 'Park at the Heart' could create the kind of prestigious location that may attract the bigger employers, a great prospect for Bradford.
Doggedly pursuing retention of the Odeon while dismissing an alternative out of hand, based on the evidence of two images published in the T&A, makes little sense. Once the public exhibition is revealed we will be in a better position to carefully evaluate the pros and cons.
Joedavid, Bradford says...
2:18pm Thu 23 Jul 09
Aire Valley wrote:Your first para. yes BORG and Backer wish to buy it as it stands and refurbish it and extend.
As great as it sounds I’m not convinced that a concert/ conference venue is a feasible proposition, at least from a financial perspective. Have any venue operators come forward wanting to invest or sign a lease. If not, then probably with good reason. Is a concert venue really a priority for the city? Many believe there is no requirement for further office space. It's not just about creating more office space but about ensuring the right mix of office space is available. We need offices that can attract a spectrum of businesses from small start ups to the established multi nationals. Decent office space fronting the 'Park at the Heart' could create the kind of prestigious location that may attract the bigger employers, a great prospect for Bradford. Doggedly pursuing retention of the Odeon while dismissing an alternative out of hand, based on the evidence of two images published in the T&A, makes little sense. Once the public exhibition is revealed we will be in a better position to carefully evaluate the pros and cons.
Last para. the above BORG plans have been dismissed out of hand.
emma72, Eccleshill says...
3:30pm Thu 23 Jul 09
View the 'Common Sense Regeneration' plan at:
http://www.bradfordc
ivicsociety.co.uk/co
mmonsenseregeneratio
n.pdf
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
4:10pm Thu 23 Jul 09
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
4:42pm Thu 23 Jul 09
Since it's been written it's clear to see the council isn't moving in the same direction, indeed the website to open tomorrow refers to the Odean area as the "former Odeon site" - not one lesson learnt from the mistakes made in the 60's, how very sad.
SLATE MINER, Bfd. says...
4:50pm Thu 23 Jul 09
Moon on a stick wrote:Cant be that good if you managed to read and digest 48 pages in 32mins Lol
Got to page 56, brilliant, well thought out and that's the kind of vision of Bradford I know many others would like to see. Since it's been written it's clear to see the council isn't moving in the same direction, indeed the website to open tomorrow refers to the Odean area as the "former Odeon site" - not one lesson learnt from the mistakes made in the 60's, how very sad.
avagander, says...
8:36pm Thu 23 Jul 09
" I remember Bradford's Bouncing Back in the 90s".
Obviously not very well as that was 1983!
The Odeon needs to go - converting it to a concert hall will cost tens of millions (£1m was just to make it safe) and no business plan would stand up to paying back the loan on millions with a few 3,000 seater concerts a year.
Bradford has a huge shortage of modern office accommodation - if there were buildings empty Provident wouldn't need to be building a new one!
From investment in offices you get people in the City Centre. Walk round at lunch and see how many 'suits and ties' you see - barely any. These are the people with disposable income. 1000 new 'suits' spending £5 a day on sandwiches is £5,000 extra every working day into the city centre economy.
The City Park is the first stage of this. If you doubt it will work take a trip to Sheffield. Their city centre was dying after Meadowhall opened. The first job they did was install a huge water feature next to their Town Hall. Then came a new office block for a law company and then a 5* hotel.
Unfortunately Sheffield did this with a Chief Exec who had a plan from day one of taking the job and a Council members who backed him to the hilt and weren't afraid to make bold decisions.
Bradford Councillors seem afraid to do anything bold, but with hung Council this is always impossible.
albion, west riding says...
8:46pm Thu 23 Jul 09
Moon on a stick, Bradford says...
11:45pm Thu 23 Jul 09
emma72, Eccleshill says...
8:06am Fri 24 Jul 09
avagander wrote:Bradfords Bouncing Back must have been a really effective campaign then !!
I started reading the Civic Trust document.
" I remember Bradford's Bouncing Back in the 90s".
Obviously not very well as that was 1983!
The Odeon needs to go - converting it to a concert hall will cost tens of millions (£1m was just to make it safe) and no business plan would stand up to paying back the loan on millions with a few 3,000 seater concerts a year.
Bradford has a huge shortage of modern office accommodation - if there were buildings empty Provident wouldn't need to be building a new one!
From investment in offices you get people in the City Centre. Walk round at lunch and see how many 'suits and ties' you see - barely any. These are the people with disposable income. 1000 new 'suits' spending £5 a day on sandwiches is £5,000 extra every working day into the city centre economy.
The City Park is the first stage of this. If you doubt it will work take a trip to Sheffield. Their city centre was dying after Meadowhall opened. The first job they did was install a huge water feature next to their Town Hall. Then came a new office block for a law company and then a 5* hotel.
Unfortunately Sheffield did this with a Chief Exec who had a plan from day one of taking the job and a Council members who backed him to the hilt and weren't afraid to make bold decisions.
Bradford Councillors seem afraid to do anything bold, but with hung Council this is always impossible.
new_to_the_area, saltaire says...
8:49am Fri 24 Jul 09
avagander wrote:"From investment in offices you get people in the City Centre"
I started reading the Civic Trust document.
" I remember Bradford's Bouncing Back in the 90s".
Obviously not very well as that was 1983!
The Odeon needs to go - converting it to a concert hall will cost tens of millions (£1m was just to make it safe) and no business plan would stand up to paying back the loan on millions with a few 3,000 seater concerts a year.
Bradford has a huge shortage of modern office accommodation - if there were buildings empty Provident wouldn't need to be building a new one!
From investment in offices you get people in the City Centre. Walk round at lunch and see how many 'suits and ties' you see - barely any. These are the people with disposable income. 1000 new 'suits' spending £5 a day on sandwiches is £5,000 extra every working day into the city centre economy.
The City Park is the first stage of this. If you doubt it will work take a trip to Sheffield. Their city centre was dying after Meadowhall opened. The first job they did was install a huge water feature next to their Town Hall. Then came a new office block for a law company and then a 5* hotel.
Unfortunately Sheffield did this with a Chief Exec who had a plan from day one of taking the job and a Council members who backed him to the hilt and weren't afraid to make bold decisions.
Bradford Councillors seem afraid to do anything bold, but with hung Council this is always impossible.
No. from investment you only create the opportunity. It's a competitive market and any business has options. Why chose Bradford over anywhere else on the M62 corridor ?
I am fairly recent here, so it may have been covered before, but I don't see the compelling reason that will make tourists and businesses come here rather than the numerous options they have, so designing the city around them without that plan seems a bit strange.
bradford in focus, haworth says...
11:24am Fri 24 Jul 09
http://bradfordinfoc
us.fotopic.net/c1729
808.html
do we ever learn...
ms walker, Round here says...
6:00pm Fri 24 Jul 09
emma72 wrote:Just read it: I wish I could vote for Bradford Civic Society in the next local elections...
The civic society have just published a regeneration plan which proposes the preservation of the Odeon as an immediate priority.
View the 'Common Sense Regeneration' plan at:
http://www.bradfordc
ivicsociety.co.uk/co
mmonsenseregeneratio
n.pdf
Common sense indeed!
avagander, says...
10:58pm Fri 24 Jul 09
Moon on a stick wrote:No 1 the Interchange has part of one floor vacant. A bit of a peoblem if you need 100,000 sq ft for 1000 staff.
What nonsense, there's an office block next to the interchange empty after years of begging for business, there's one opposite YBS near the Gatehaus. Having worked in Sheffield what utter tripe, the water feature is not massive, and it cost over 24 times less than the Bradford scheme. There's plenty of original architecture left in Sheffield centre working very successfully as shops and cafe's. Admittedly it still has a lot vacant but is still a world apart from the sad state of affairs that Bradford centre currently is.
Broadacre House is a 1970s office and well past it's sell by date.
So as you can see Bradord has NO large scale modern offices to offer.
The Sheffiled Peace gardens cost £5m - not quite 24 times less!
An artist's impression of the revised plans for New Victoria Place on the site of the Odeon
The internal courtyard of the New Victoria development on the space now occupied by the Odeon building in the latest architect’s designs
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wibsey lad, bradford says...
6:14am Wed 22 Jul 09