Bradford Telegraph and Argus‘Censorship’ fear over new GCSE syllabus (From Bradford Telegraph and Argus)

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Council’s education chief slams minister after books were cut from English syllabus

Bradford Telegraph and Argus: Councillor Ralph Berry Councillor Ralph Berry

The ditching of Amercian classic novels from the GCSE syllabus “smacks of censorship” says Bradford’s politician in charge of education.

Councillor Ralph Berry has heavily criticised Education Secretary Michael Gove after books including To Kill A Mockingbird, by Harper Lee, and John Steinbeck’s Of Mice and Men were removed from exam board OCR’s draft GCSE English Literature syllabus.

Instead, more works by British authors will reportedly be included, such as pieces by Charles Dickens and Jane Austen.

The Department for Education (DofE) wants pupils to appreciate the “power of the English literary heritage” and more pre-20th Century works.

Coun Berry, Bradford Council’s executive member for children’s services, said Bradford students could miss out if American classics were pulled.

“It smacks of censorship. It seems to be getting to some sort of level of what people should, and shouldn’t, know.

“My main feeling is it’s a great shame. This is silly. There is some good, stimulating reading he is dismissing.”

The new GCSE syllabus, which will start next year, will reportedly include more works by a host of British authors instead, including Charles Dickens and Jane Austen.

Mr Gove’s overhaul has also led to Arthur Miller’s The Crucible being removed.

The course will feature at least one play by William Shakespeare, a selection of work by the romantic poets, a 19th Century novel, a selection of poetry since 1850 and a 20th Century novel or drama.

OCR said the decision to drop the well-known works by the US authors was because of the DofE’s desire for the exam to be “more focused on tradition” and there were fewer opportunities to include them in the new syllabus.

But Coun Berry said children should read a broad range of books.

“What are we scared of here by banning these books?

“I have also read books of a different view. It also smacks of trying to create some sort of orthodox thinking,” he said.

“The books Mr Gove is banning are some of the ones that have had the greatest impact on my life.

“We’re not going to get a new generation of curious minds if they are getting away from reading some of the key, seminal works of the past 100 years.

“There seems to be a desire to prevent people from reading books which have a critical understanding of society and power.”

A Department for Education spokesman said in the past English Literature GCSEs were not rigorous enough and “their content was often far too narrow”.

It said no authors, books or genres would be banned.

Comments (19)

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6:58am Mon 26 May 14

Albion. says...

I think it preferable that they concentrate on British authors.
I think it preferable that they concentrate on British authors. Albion.
  • Score: -7

7:36am Mon 26 May 14

Frank22 says...

I think the work of authors should be added to have an extensive reading experience for our modern 21st century students. It will be beneficial for them as extra knowledge and information.
Coursework Writing Service
I think the work of authors should be added to have an extensive reading experience for our modern 21st century students. It will be beneficial for them as extra knowledge and information. Coursework Writing Service Frank22
  • Score: 0

7:47am Mon 26 May 14

Ratters Rat says...

I don't know who Michael Groves thinks he is but he is messing about with children's education so much even the schools are beginning to struggle with planning.
He is so out of touch with education that his own wife is thinking about sending their children to Italy to be taught.
Yes updates have to be made I will agree but this goes far deeper than many people think he is now dictating to schools what GCSE's pupils should take many pupils could only pick one GCSE.
He lives in a world where himself and many of his cronnies have had a private education. He would not survive in the real world.
He is doing so much damage to our education system.
He doesn't recognize the arts and believes that GCSE music dance performing arts should disappear.Even asking schools to remove them as options. Children who are talented are going to miss out so much not every child is academic.
Tax payers money that was invested in a lot of cases will go to waste.
He has taken away Betec subjects for pupils to study
many pupils who have a less able academic
background used this as a stepping stone to GCSE's
This man has now it in to his head he can write exams papers.
The damage has been done for a generation of children let's hope he is not reelected at the next general election.
I don't know who Michael Groves thinks he is but he is messing about with children's education so much even the schools are beginning to struggle with planning. He is so out of touch with education that his own wife is thinking about sending their children to Italy to be taught. Yes updates have to be made I will agree but this goes far deeper than many people think he is now dictating to schools what GCSE's pupils should take many pupils could only pick one GCSE. He lives in a world where himself and many of his cronnies have had a private education. He would not survive in the real world. He is doing so much damage to our education system. He doesn't recognize the arts and believes that GCSE music dance performing arts should disappear.Even asking schools to remove them as options. Children who are talented are going to miss out so much not every child is academic. Tax payers money that was invested in a lot of cases will go to waste. He has taken away Betec subjects for pupils to study many pupils who have a less able academic background used this as a stepping stone to GCSE's This man has now it in to his head he can write exams papers. The damage has been done for a generation of children let's hope he is not reelected at the next general election. Ratters Rat
  • Score: 11

9:28am Mon 26 May 14

FinlandStation says...

Gove wants to produce little Englanders. Just the kind of people we need to help Britain succeed in a global economy.
Gove wants to produce little Englanders. Just the kind of people we need to help Britain succeed in a global economy. FinlandStation
  • Score: 8

10:44am Mon 26 May 14

allinittogether says...

Albion. wrote:
I think it preferable that they concentrate on British authors.
Why?
[quote][p][bold]Albion.[/bold] wrote: I think it preferable that they concentrate on British authors.[/p][/quote]Why? allinittogether
  • Score: -3

11:07am Mon 26 May 14

Albion. says...

Ratters Rat wrote:
I don't know who Michael Groves thinks he is but he is messing about with children's education so much even the schools are beginning to struggle with planning.
He is so out of touch with education that his own wife is thinking about sending their children to Italy to be taught.
Yes updates have to be made I will agree but this goes far deeper than many people think he is now dictating to schools what GCSE's pupils should take many pupils could only pick one GCSE.
He lives in a world where himself and many of his cronnies have had a private education. He would not survive in the real world.
He is doing so much damage to our education system.
He doesn't recognize the arts and believes that GCSE music dance performing arts should disappear.Even asking schools to remove them as options. Children who are talented are going to miss out so much not every child is academic.
Tax payers money that was invested in a lot of cases will go to waste.
He has taken away Betec subjects for pupils to study
many pupils who have a less able academic
background used this as a stepping stone to GCSE's
This man has now it in to his head he can write exams papers.
The damage has been done for a generation of children let's hope he is not reelected at the next general election.
Well he doesn't think he's "Michael Groves" for a start.
[quote][p][bold]Ratters Rat[/bold] wrote: I don't know who Michael Groves thinks he is but he is messing about with children's education so much even the schools are beginning to struggle with planning. He is so out of touch with education that his own wife is thinking about sending their children to Italy to be taught. Yes updates have to be made I will agree but this goes far deeper than many people think he is now dictating to schools what GCSE's pupils should take many pupils could only pick one GCSE. He lives in a world where himself and many of his cronnies have had a private education. He would not survive in the real world. He is doing so much damage to our education system. He doesn't recognize the arts and believes that GCSE music dance performing arts should disappear.Even asking schools to remove them as options. Children who are talented are going to miss out so much not every child is academic. Tax payers money that was invested in a lot of cases will go to waste. He has taken away Betec subjects for pupils to study many pupils who have a less able academic background used this as a stepping stone to GCSE's This man has now it in to his head he can write exams papers. The damage has been done for a generation of children let's hope he is not reelected at the next general election.[/p][/quote]Well he doesn't think he's "Michael Groves" for a start. Albion.
  • Score: 6

11:10am Mon 26 May 14

Albion. says...

allinittogether wrote:
Albion. wrote:
I think it preferable that they concentrate on British authors.
Why?
Because it's time we promoted the greatness of Britain in our places of education.
[quote][p][bold]allinittogether[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Albion.[/bold] wrote: I think it preferable that they concentrate on British authors.[/p][/quote]Why?[/p][/quote]Because it's time we promoted the greatness of Britain in our places of education. Albion.
  • Score: 1

11:40am Mon 26 May 14

Steve30d says...

FinlandStation wrote:
Gove wants to produce little Englanders. Just the kind of people we need to help Britain succeed in a global economy.
yeah. The kids are supposed to demonstrate a little knowledge of the background of the times the books are set in. So has anyone else seen the OCR paper on of Mice and Men, from a few years ago? I was unimpressed at the leading questions suggesting the only way to get decent marks, would be to follow a line, that in the US the Great depression only really affected racial minorities. My reading of the book is anyone who was poor had big problems.
[quote][p][bold]FinlandStation[/bold] wrote: Gove wants to produce little Englanders. Just the kind of people we need to help Britain succeed in a global economy.[/p][/quote]yeah. The kids are supposed to demonstrate a little knowledge of the background of the times the books are set in. So has anyone else seen the OCR paper on of Mice and Men, from a few years ago? I was unimpressed at the leading questions suggesting the only way to get decent marks, would be to follow a line, that in the US the Great depression only really affected racial minorities. My reading of the book is anyone who was poor had big problems. Steve30d
  • Score: 6

12:21pm Mon 26 May 14

bd7 helper says...

Wasting time
Wasting time bd7 helper
  • Score: -3

12:44pm Mon 26 May 14

Grumpygirl says...

Albion. wrote:
allinittogether wrote:
Albion. wrote:
I think it preferable that they concentrate on British authors.
Why?
Because it's time we promoted the greatness of Britain in our places of education.
The greatness of Britain? Mrs. Thatcher, Suez, the Atlantic Slave Trade, the Chinese Opium Wars, the Iraq war, the Civil War, the Bengal famine, Peterloo, Mrs Thatcher, Boer Concentration camps, Amritsar massacre, execution of Joan of Arc, the class system, Palestine, the Titanic, Appeasement, Workhouses, Bloody Sunday, the Irish potato famine, the Poor Laws, Apartheid, Mrs. Thatcher, partition of India, eviction of the Jews, Kenyan torture camps, Bl0ody Mary, fall of Singapore, the Corn Laws, Cyprus internment, child labour, and, of course, Mrs. Thatcher.
[quote][p][bold]Albion.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]allinittogether[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Albion.[/bold] wrote: I think it preferable that they concentrate on British authors.[/p][/quote]Why?[/p][/quote]Because it's time we promoted the greatness of Britain in our places of education.[/p][/quote]The greatness of Britain? Mrs. Thatcher, Suez, the Atlantic Slave Trade, the Chinese Opium Wars, the Iraq war, the Civil War, the Bengal famine, Peterloo, Mrs Thatcher, Boer Concentration camps, Amritsar massacre, execution of Joan of Arc, the class system, Palestine, the Titanic, Appeasement, Workhouses, Bloody Sunday, the Irish potato famine, the Poor Laws, Apartheid, Mrs. Thatcher, partition of India, eviction of the Jews, Kenyan torture camps, Bl0ody Mary, fall of Singapore, the Corn Laws, Cyprus internment, child labour, and, of course, Mrs. Thatcher. Grumpygirl
  • Score: 0

12:46pm Mon 26 May 14

Grumpygirl says...

Steve30d wrote:
FinlandStation wrote:
Gove wants to produce little Englanders. Just the kind of people we need to help Britain succeed in a global economy.
yeah. The kids are supposed to demonstrate a little knowledge of the background of the times the books are set in. So has anyone else seen the OCR paper on of Mice and Men, from a few years ago? I was unimpressed at the leading questions suggesting the only way to get decent marks, would be to follow a line, that in the US the Great depression only really affected racial minorities. My reading of the book is anyone who was poor had big problems.
That's true. Steinbeck has been hijacked by the right.
[quote][p][bold]Steve30d[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]FinlandStation[/bold] wrote: Gove wants to produce little Englanders. Just the kind of people we need to help Britain succeed in a global economy.[/p][/quote]yeah. The kids are supposed to demonstrate a little knowledge of the background of the times the books are set in. So has anyone else seen the OCR paper on of Mice and Men, from a few years ago? I was unimpressed at the leading questions suggesting the only way to get decent marks, would be to follow a line, that in the US the Great depression only really affected racial minorities. My reading of the book is anyone who was poor had big problems.[/p][/quote]That's true. Steinbeck has been hijacked by the right. Grumpygirl
  • Score: 13

12:58pm Mon 26 May 14

mrs walker says...

Literature has a role beyond teaching children how to understand texts and writing styles. The greatest literature shares ideas and raises our awareness of our own humanity with all its flaws, fallibility and heroism. This is why books like To Kill a Mockingbird and Lord of the Flies are important. They reflect human behaviours and prejudices and help us develop critical faculties and a moral reasoning that can stay with us for life. Books on the syllabus should inspire, engage and inform.
Literature has a role beyond teaching children how to understand texts and writing styles. The greatest literature shares ideas and raises our awareness of our own humanity with all its flaws, fallibility and heroism. This is why books like To Kill a Mockingbird and Lord of the Flies are important. They reflect human behaviours and prejudices and help us develop critical faculties and a moral reasoning that can stay with us for life. Books on the syllabus should inspire, engage and inform. mrs walker
  • Score: 22

1:49pm Mon 26 May 14

istanbull-bantam says...

In spite of their being British, authors such as Dickens and Austen are 'difficult' reading and far more suited to an 'A'-level than a GCSE English course, and the relevance of the latter, in particular, to kids growing up in modern Britain is highly questionable. Furthermore, they are widely regarded as "boring" by many students even at A-level, which would seem likely to discourage future generations from exploring literature further rather than encouraging them to read.

"To Kill a Mockingbird", "Of Mice and Men", and "The Crucible", in stark contrast, are classics of World Literature, which have encouraged countless kids worldwide to love reading and therefore read more (which is, presumably, what a GCSE English course should be all about).

It would be/is a tragedy far beyond even Shakespeare's art to deprive our kids of these gems of American/World Literature, and to risk further alienating them from the beauty of books.
In spite of their being British, authors such as Dickens and Austen are 'difficult' reading and far more suited to an 'A'-level than a GCSE English course, and the relevance of the latter, in particular, to kids growing up in modern Britain is highly questionable. Furthermore, they are widely regarded as "boring" by many students even at A-level, which would seem likely to discourage future generations from exploring literature further rather than encouraging them to read. "To Kill a Mockingbird", "Of Mice and Men", and "The Crucible", in stark contrast, are classics of World Literature, which have encouraged countless kids worldwide to love reading and therefore read more (which is, presumably, what a GCSE English course should be all about). It would be/is a tragedy far beyond even Shakespeare's art to deprive our kids of these gems of American/World Literature, and to risk further alienating them from the beauty of books. istanbull-bantam
  • Score: 4

1:56pm Mon 26 May 14

Not so simple says...

Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world!

Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom.
Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world! Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom. Not so simple
  • Score: 3

1:59pm Mon 26 May 14

istanbull-bantam says...

Steve30d wrote:
FinlandStation wrote:
Gove wants to produce little Englanders. Just the kind of people we need to help Britain succeed in a global economy.
yeah. The kids are supposed to demonstrate a little knowledge of the background of the times the books are set in. So has anyone else seen the OCR paper on of Mice and Men, from a few years ago? I was unimpressed at the leading questions suggesting the only way to get decent marks, would be to follow a line, that in the US the Great depression only really affected racial minorities. My reading of the book is anyone who was poor had big problems.
How might a paper on "Of Mice and Men" relate to racial minorities, since there is only one character from such a minority in the book?
[quote][p][bold]Steve30d[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]FinlandStation[/bold] wrote: Gove wants to produce little Englanders. Just the kind of people we need to help Britain succeed in a global economy.[/p][/quote]yeah. The kids are supposed to demonstrate a little knowledge of the background of the times the books are set in. So has anyone else seen the OCR paper on of Mice and Men, from a few years ago? I was unimpressed at the leading questions suggesting the only way to get decent marks, would be to follow a line, that in the US the Great depression only really affected racial minorities. My reading of the book is anyone who was poor had big problems.[/p][/quote]How might a paper on "Of Mice and Men" relate to racial minorities, since there is only one character from such a minority in the book? istanbull-bantam
  • Score: 1

2:05pm Mon 26 May 14

istanbull-bantam says...

Not so simple wrote:
Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world!

Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom.
Teach the kids British history? On a literature course? Wouldn't it be more appropriate on a history course?!
[quote][p][bold]Not so simple[/bold] wrote: Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world! Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom.[/p][/quote]Teach the kids British history? On a literature course? Wouldn't it be more appropriate on a history course?! istanbull-bantam
  • Score: 0

4:28pm Mon 26 May 14

Not so simple says...

istanbull-bantam wrote:
Not so simple wrote:
Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world!

Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom.
Teach the kids British history? On a literature course? Wouldn't it be more appropriate on a history course?!
Have you seen any substance in any syllabus that is taught in schools? Yes you have your sciences and mathematical subjects which have their roots firmly set within the research of non English speaking persons.

Education is poor in this country and has been ruined by successive meddling government policies.

English literature....all the famous 'English' writers and linguistic experts have studied foreign languages to encompass command. English language has it's roots in languages from abroad and any historian can teach you that.

Re what is British: have a look at what our forefathers fought to achieve in this country so we, who reside in the great land, may have a good life which is freedom based. All this is found in the Magna Carta. This is the very foundation which is ever so briefly taught to students and merely glanced over by the law students.

Without this constitution you would be living in a strange land which is governed by nobles and elite families who couldn't give a hoot about the general population who are referred to as commoners.

When you study the constitution you will note that the previous paragraph is true of modern days because the people have no knowledge of the workings and expectations of our Constitution aka MAGNA CARTA. Many good people died to keep this country free and secure the freedom of the people via the Magna Carta but people are too lazy and dumbed down to understand what is real education and what is real freedom as dictated by the natural laws of common law as per the Magna Carta and the Bill of Rights.

The only people who stand up to meddling are commonly referred to by one another as Freemen and the movement is called Freeman on the land. Spend a day studying this and your eyes will be opened like never before as what we take as education nowadays is nothing but a superficial doctrine to ensure the people are subdued and the globalist agenda is continued with a poor standard of education which reflects in one seriously dumbed down electorate.

Take five minutes out and study the freeman on the land and what it means....you will then see the reality if you are able to contemplate what the freeman stands for.
[quote][p][bold]istanbull-bantam[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Not so simple[/bold] wrote: Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world! Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom.[/p][/quote]Teach the kids British history? On a literature course? Wouldn't it be more appropriate on a history course?![/p][/quote]Have you seen any substance in any syllabus that is taught in schools? Yes you have your sciences and mathematical subjects which have their roots firmly set within the research of non English speaking persons. Education is poor in this country and has been ruined by successive meddling government policies. English literature....all the famous 'English' writers and linguistic experts have studied foreign languages to encompass command. English language has it's roots in languages from abroad and any historian can teach you that. Re what is British: have a look at what our forefathers fought to achieve in this country so we, who reside in the great land, may have a good life which is freedom based. All this is found in the Magna Carta. This is the very foundation which is ever so briefly taught to students and merely glanced over by the law students. Without this constitution you would be living in a strange land which is governed by nobles and elite families who couldn't give a hoot about the general population who are referred to as commoners. When you study the constitution you will note that the previous paragraph is true of modern days because the people have no knowledge of the workings and expectations of our Constitution aka MAGNA CARTA. Many good people died to keep this country free and secure the freedom of the people via the Magna Carta but people are too lazy and dumbed down to understand what is real education and what is real freedom as dictated by the natural laws of common law as per the Magna Carta and the Bill of Rights. The only people who stand up to meddling are commonly referred to by one another as Freemen and the movement is called Freeman on the land. Spend a day studying this and your eyes will be opened like never before as what we take as education nowadays is nothing but a superficial doctrine to ensure the people are subdued and the globalist agenda is continued with a poor standard of education which reflects in one seriously dumbed down electorate. Take five minutes out and study the freeman on the land and what it means....you will then see the reality if you are able to contemplate what the freeman stands for. Not so simple
  • Score: 1

6:24pm Mon 26 May 14

istanbull-bantam says...

Not so simple wrote:
istanbull-bantam wrote:
Not so simple wrote:
Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world!

Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom.
Teach the kids British history? On a literature course? Wouldn't it be more appropriate on a history course?!
Have you seen any substance in any syllabus that is taught in schools? Yes you have your sciences and mathematical subjects which have their roots firmly set within the research of non English speaking persons.

Education is poor in this country and has been ruined by successive meddling government policies.

English literature....all the famous 'English' writers and linguistic experts have studied foreign languages to encompass command. English language has it's roots in languages from abroad and any historian can teach you that.

Re what is British: have a look at what our forefathers fought to achieve in this country so we, who reside in the great land, may have a good life which is freedom based. All this is found in the Magna Carta. This is the very foundation which is ever so briefly taught to students and merely glanced over by the law students.

Without this constitution you would be living in a strange land which is governed by nobles and elite families who couldn't give a hoot about the general population who are referred to as commoners.

When you study the constitution you will note that the previous paragraph is true of modern days because the people have no knowledge of the workings and expectations of our Constitution aka MAGNA CARTA. Many good people died to keep this country free and secure the freedom of the people via the Magna Carta but people are too lazy and dumbed down to understand what is real education and what is real freedom as dictated by the natural laws of common law as per the Magna Carta and the Bill of Rights.

The only people who stand up to meddling are commonly referred to by one another as Freemen and the movement is called Freeman on the land. Spend a day studying this and your eyes will be opened like never before as what we take as education nowadays is nothing but a superficial doctrine to ensure the people are subdued and the globalist agenda is continued with a poor standard of education which reflects in one seriously dumbed down electorate.

Take five minutes out and study the freeman on the land and what it means....you will then see the reality if you are able to contemplate what the freeman stands for.
Wow! That is quite an impassioned (not to mention lengthy) response to a simple (rhetorical) question about the appropriateness of teaching British history in an English Language/Literature course.

I agree entirely that kids should be taught about British history and the things you mention ... in a - well - History course (as distinct from a Language/Literature course)! In fact, I'd go further and suggest that schools should also promote British culture and endeavour to foster a positive sense of British cultural identity, as so many other countries do.

I am indeed living in a strange land and as an English teacher of almost 20 years and a linguist I'm quite familiar with the history of the English language and its roots in the proto-Germanic and Indo-European families. I'm also pretty familiar with Turkce, Zhonguo, and francais ... Still thanks for the lesson!

But I have a question: Why do you suggest that British history should be taught in an English class as opposed to, say, a History class?
[quote][p][bold]Not so simple[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]istanbull-bantam[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Not so simple[/bold] wrote: Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world! Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom.[/p][/quote]Teach the kids British history? On a literature course? Wouldn't it be more appropriate on a history course?![/p][/quote]Have you seen any substance in any syllabus that is taught in schools? Yes you have your sciences and mathematical subjects which have their roots firmly set within the research of non English speaking persons. Education is poor in this country and has been ruined by successive meddling government policies. English literature....all the famous 'English' writers and linguistic experts have studied foreign languages to encompass command. English language has it's roots in languages from abroad and any historian can teach you that. Re what is British: have a look at what our forefathers fought to achieve in this country so we, who reside in the great land, may have a good life which is freedom based. All this is found in the Magna Carta. This is the very foundation which is ever so briefly taught to students and merely glanced over by the law students. Without this constitution you would be living in a strange land which is governed by nobles and elite families who couldn't give a hoot about the general population who are referred to as commoners. When you study the constitution you will note that the previous paragraph is true of modern days because the people have no knowledge of the workings and expectations of our Constitution aka MAGNA CARTA. Many good people died to keep this country free and secure the freedom of the people via the Magna Carta but people are too lazy and dumbed down to understand what is real education and what is real freedom as dictated by the natural laws of common law as per the Magna Carta and the Bill of Rights. The only people who stand up to meddling are commonly referred to by one another as Freemen and the movement is called Freeman on the land. Spend a day studying this and your eyes will be opened like never before as what we take as education nowadays is nothing but a superficial doctrine to ensure the people are subdued and the globalist agenda is continued with a poor standard of education which reflects in one seriously dumbed down electorate. Take five minutes out and study the freeman on the land and what it means....you will then see the reality if you are able to contemplate what the freeman stands for.[/p][/quote]Wow! That is quite an impassioned (not to mention lengthy) response to a simple (rhetorical) question about the appropriateness of teaching British history in an English Language/Literature course. I agree entirely that kids should be taught about British history and the things you mention ... in a - well - History course (as distinct from a Language/Literature course)! In fact, I'd go further and suggest that schools should also promote British culture and endeavour to foster a positive sense of British cultural identity, as so many other countries do. I am indeed living in a strange land and as an English teacher of almost 20 years and a linguist I'm quite familiar with the history of the English language and its roots in the proto-Germanic and Indo-European families. I'm also pretty familiar with Turkce, Zhonguo, and francais ... Still thanks for the lesson! But I have a question: Why do you suggest that British history should be taught in an English class as opposed to, say, a History class? istanbull-bantam
  • Score: 0

12:14am Tue 27 May 14

Not so simple says...

istanbull-bantam wrote:
Not so simple wrote:
istanbull-bantam wrote:
Not so simple wrote:
Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world!

Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom.
Teach the kids British history? On a literature course? Wouldn't it be more appropriate on a history course?!
Have you seen any substance in any syllabus that is taught in schools? Yes you have your sciences and mathematical subjects which have their roots firmly set within the research of non English speaking persons.

Education is poor in this country and has been ruined by successive meddling government policies.

English literature....all the famous 'English' writers and linguistic experts have studied foreign languages to encompass command. English language has it's roots in languages from abroad and any historian can teach you that.

Re what is British: have a look at what our forefathers fought to achieve in this country so we, who reside in the great land, may have a good life which is freedom based. All this is found in the Magna Carta. This is the very foundation which is ever so briefly taught to students and merely glanced over by the law students.

Without this constitution you would be living in a strange land which is governed by nobles and elite families who couldn't give a hoot about the general population who are referred to as commoners.

When you study the constitution you will note that the previous paragraph is true of modern days because the people have no knowledge of the workings and expectations of our Constitution aka MAGNA CARTA. Many good people died to keep this country free and secure the freedom of the people via the Magna Carta but people are too lazy and dumbed down to understand what is real education and what is real freedom as dictated by the natural laws of common law as per the Magna Carta and the Bill of Rights.

The only people who stand up to meddling are commonly referred to by one another as Freemen and the movement is called Freeman on the land. Spend a day studying this and your eyes will be opened like never before as what we take as education nowadays is nothing but a superficial doctrine to ensure the people are subdued and the globalist agenda is continued with a poor standard of education which reflects in one seriously dumbed down electorate.

Take five minutes out and study the freeman on the land and what it means....you will then see the reality if you are able to contemplate what the freeman stands for.
Wow! That is quite an impassioned (not to mention lengthy) response to a simple (rhetorical) question about the appropriateness of teaching British history in an English Language/Literature course.

I agree entirely that kids should be taught about British history and the things you mention ... in a - well - History course (as distinct from a Language/Literature course)! In fact, I'd go further and suggest that schools should also promote British culture and endeavour to foster a positive sense of British cultural identity, as so many other countries do.

I am indeed living in a strange land and as an English teacher of almost 20 years and a linguist I'm quite familiar with the history of the English language and its roots in the proto-Germanic and Indo-European families. I'm also pretty familiar with Turkce, Zhonguo, and francais ... Still thanks for the lesson!

But I have a question: Why do you suggest that British history should be taught in an English class as opposed to, say, a History class?
As history is full of falsehood as dictated by the writers of such fabricated fairytales.
[quote][p][bold]istanbull-bantam[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Not so simple[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]istanbull-bantam[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Not so simple[/bold] wrote: Teach the kids British History including the times we've gone and messed things up around the world! Teach the children about the Magna Carta and Bill of rights so they, the future generations know exactly what is meant by freedom and non of this bull crap party political freedom.[/p][/quote]Teach the kids British history? On a literature course? Wouldn't it be more appropriate on a history course?![/p][/quote]Have you seen any substance in any syllabus that is taught in schools? Yes you have your sciences and mathematical subjects which have their roots firmly set within the research of non English speaking persons. Education is poor in this country and has been ruined by successive meddling government policies. English literature....all the famous 'English' writers and linguistic experts have studied foreign languages to encompass command. English language has it's roots in languages from abroad and any historian can teach you that. Re what is British: have a look at what our forefathers fought to achieve in this country so we, who reside in the great land, may have a good life which is freedom based. All this is found in the Magna Carta. This is the very foundation which is ever so briefly taught to students and merely glanced over by the law students. Without this constitution you would be living in a strange land which is governed by nobles and elite families who couldn't give a hoot about the general population who are referred to as commoners. When you study the constitution you will note that the previous paragraph is true of modern days because the people have no knowledge of the workings and expectations of our Constitution aka MAGNA CARTA. Many good people died to keep this country free and secure the freedom of the people via the Magna Carta but people are too lazy and dumbed down to understand what is real education and what is real freedom as dictated by the natural laws of common law as per the Magna Carta and the Bill of Rights. The only people who stand up to meddling are commonly referred to by one another as Freemen and the movement is called Freeman on the land. Spend a day studying this and your eyes will be opened like never before as what we take as education nowadays is nothing but a superficial doctrine to ensure the people are subdued and the globalist agenda is continued with a poor standard of education which reflects in one seriously dumbed down electorate. Take five minutes out and study the freeman on the land and what it means....you will then see the reality if you are able to contemplate what the freeman stands for.[/p][/quote]Wow! That is quite an impassioned (not to mention lengthy) response to a simple (rhetorical) question about the appropriateness of teaching British history in an English Language/Literature course. I agree entirely that kids should be taught about British history and the things you mention ... in a - well - History course (as distinct from a Language/Literature course)! In fact, I'd go further and suggest that schools should also promote British culture and endeavour to foster a positive sense of British cultural identity, as so many other countries do. I am indeed living in a strange land and as an English teacher of almost 20 years and a linguist I'm quite familiar with the history of the English language and its roots in the proto-Germanic and Indo-European families. I'm also pretty familiar with Turkce, Zhonguo, and francais ... Still thanks for the lesson! But I have a question: Why do you suggest that British history should be taught in an English class as opposed to, say, a History class?[/p][/quote]As history is full of falsehood as dictated by the writers of such fabricated fairytales. Not so simple
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